A few owners too many?

[denverd0n]

Originally Posted by siamese

Number of previous owners is of no importance to me. All that matters to me is the condition of the boat.

This ^^^^^

Sure, if you can find a one-owner boat, and the one-owner was obsessive about maintenance, that's a great thing. But many owners wouldn't bother me at all, because I am going to be judging the condition of the boat right now, right before I buy it.

[Scaramanga F25]

All electronics more than 6 or 7 years old are obsolete. No matter who or how was maintained.

[GTom]

Too many owners mean two kind of risks:
#1: before even touching her (not Taylor Swift, the boat): clear title. Even if the complete chain of bills is available, there is an increased risk of a hidden mortgage on it.
#2: the obvious question: why did it change hands so quickly, multiple times? Right, someone can run into a family situation, or "just wanted to try the boat", but 3-4 in a sequence? Weird. In a buyer's market I'd be very reluctant to buy a boat for short term.

[Scaramanga F25]

As a general rule boats change hands every 5 or 6 years on average.

[hamburking]

Just as a sole owner can be a good or bad thing, so can many owners.

My most recent boat had 2 previous owners...the first replaced the engine. The second replaced the standing rigging and sails. I replaced the ground tackle and running rigging. The guy I sold it to spent thousands more on the boat. So, many owners can be good too, if each owner does some improvement to the boat.

The only boats to really avoid are the ones which have been neglected. Good luck, and please let us know what happens!

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Now if each owner drilled a dozen holes for their personal widget, that's another thing.

But of course they did, plus they each wired it "their" way probably and left no diagram etc.

[tarditi]

Well, I'm the 3rd owner of a 50 year old boat - doesn't mean there isn't a list of things requiring attention/upgrades... A factor perhaps, but I wouldn't elevate it higher than, say, a good survey.

[boatman61]

This thread.. and a couple of others go a long way to show why 25+ year old boats often take up to 2 years to sell.

[Lihuedooley77]

1. Thoroughly inspect the vessel. Below the water line, hull, deck, cabin, mast, deck fittings, etc. And that is just the beginning.

2, Take it out for a SAILING SEA trial for a few hours, and use all of the various systems, sails, running rigging, auto pilot, all electronics, radio VHF, nav, engine room, oil leaks, fluid leaks, clamps, engine start, again check for leaks, same for tranny, , ease of shifting, etc, anchor, moused, condition of chain and line rode, windlass operation.

3. Batteries at docks and also when not on shore power. All cabin lights, steaming and running and anchor lights. Add in fresh water system, all vessel through hulls, and pumps, and head system, and holding tank. Ships compass accurate, check it with your hand bearing compass. Stove type, tanks, operation and safety.

3. That is just a partial list....when I say check all systems, I really mean everything.....and then if all that goes good , have the boat surveyed.

4 Every boat owner is going to tell you that his vessel is in bristol condition. Many do not even sail their boats and actually are not aware of the true situation.

Might even take a hose and soak down the topsides, main companion way hatch, deck, all cabin hatches, portlights, base of the mast. look for leaks.
Wont work as good as a rain storm but might give you a clue as to those possible problems.

How about head room when below, and leg length and comfort of the berths. Condition of setee and berth cushions, and cockpit cushions.

Life Jackets up to code, fire extinguishers current and proper number for length of vessel, fog whistle, man over board gear, dock lines that are plyible, not like steel ropes.

I am not using a cheat sheet list, this is from memory, and may have missed a few items. Probably more than a few.

Erica owned a Crealock 37, brand new, and in later years we were partners in a Ericson/Olsen 34...( used), I also instructed and took skippered charters for 25 years when working for various sailing clubs and brokers.

Some with new and some with very used boats , no matter what the owners said, many vessels were in bad shape, lots of problems .

We recently returned from living on Kauai island for 10 years, bare boating world wide. No hawaii sailing' . Or sailing fixes were with moorings, sunsail and conch.

Now , at our new mainland home we joined a sailing club....neat people, boats in horrible condition, and in many cases very inexperienced members. Most times the vessel that we had booked for Catalina Trips, we were not able to take, some with blown engines, transmission problems, broken mast, reefing system frozen solid , so we could not run the leach reefing line tight, not even close, huge bag in the foot of the sail.

We are no longer members and are back in partners with the Olsen / Ericson, that we are taking sailing next week, and also going thru our own 2 the 3 hours boat and systems inspections.


There is a lot that should be taken into consideration before laying out loads of cash for a boat purchase. Only you and the surveyor are going to protect you. Buyer be alert.

A Catalina 27, whew, those older Catalinas, and I have sailed a bunch of them, personally we would try for a more well found vessel . Newer Catalinas are quite nice, we like em. Also , there are thousands of older Catalina lovers out there that are totally happy .

All of the above is just our personal opinion, learned over many, many years and on many many different vessels, sail and power .

Even with all of that experience, we are learning amazing things on the Cruiser Forum, lots of highly knowledgeable and experienced people eager to help out.

[Trumpet]

If you are too cautious you will never own a boat. On the other hand ....

I've owned two boats since 1992. Both had relatively few owners for their age (and given the longevity of my ownership of the first, I've improved the age to number of owners ratio significantly).

That first was a Dufour Arpege. I was the fourth owner in just over 20 years. She suffered deck delamination when I bought her and still suffered it when I sold her 20 years later - not surprising as it had never got to the top of my maintainence list. I rewired her as the unreliability of the electrics was a problem. I also gave her a furling genoa along with a detachable inner forestay, replaced the main, upgraded the ground tackle significantly, replaced all the nav equipment ... and a long list of other stuff, because I had her 20 years. I sailed her on the West Coast of Scotland all that time, so maintained her well enough to enjoy sailing her in those waters and upgraded/replaced stuff for a trip round Shetland the year before I finally sold her. The one thing I didn't have to contemplate was replacing the engine, because her previous owner had done that the year before I bought her.

When I finally sold her she was 43 years' old and had had four owners. I had maintained her according to my priorities and my disposable income. I wouldn't have described her as particularly well maintained when I sold her - the deck delamination meant there were annoying internal leaks - but she was seaworthy. Had she had more frequent changes of ownership I think she would have been at least as well maintained and probably better, because she'd have likely been surveyed at each sale and sooner or later someone would have dealt with the deck delamination.

So number of previous owners cuts both ways, I reckon. An old boat with few previous owners suggests a great boat that you won't want to part with. On the other hand, it may be a boat where the owner has prioritised maintenance according to means.

[sailpower]

Originally Posted by crankysailor

Hi folks,

just looking for a sounding board for some thoughts I am having on a boat purchase.. I would love to hear people's opinion on this one.

I think the ideal boat to buy is one with a sole knowledgeable owner who has had her since new and spared no expense on keeping her tip top etc. But sometimes one might find a boat which ticks almost all the boxes (and if we all know how tricky that part can be) but well.. has not quite the ideal owner pedigree so to speak.

So the question is.. how anal about this "requirement" would you be? For example, I am looking at a boat whose PO history looks a bit like Taylor Swift's list of boyfriends. First owner had her (the boat, not Taylor Swift) for like 12 years and then subsequent 4 or 5 owners in the last 10 years or so. The first of the 4 looks like he invested a substantial amount in her and then did sail her on a circumnavigation. The following owners kinda coasted on his investment I think. She looks reasonably good on paper .. though I haven't seen her yet. She probably will need some new bits like sails and rigging but then she should be ready to go. I am willing to invest this on her etc.

But well.. the checkered owner history is putting a bit of a damper on my enthusiasm. One imagines the "adventurous" types, buying her for a sabbatical for just a couple of years and not really caring that much.. no consistency in her maintenance etc.. maybe it is just me being neurotic. Or am I justified in thinking this is a big red flag? what do you guys think?

Narrowing your search based on arbitrary criteria is an excellent way to keep the dream alive.

Maybe also consider not buying based on choice of anchor as in, anyone who has selected this particular anchor surely can't be trusted to have done anything else "right".

Or, how about canvas color? Big red flag particularly if the canvas is actually red.

Good luck. I look forward to reading your circumnavigation blog after you have this sorted

[El Pinguino]

The first owner was an axe murderer and subsequent owners keep finding body parts - a finger here, an ear there......

[sailpower]

Originally Posted by Scaramanga F25

All electronics more than 6 or 7 years old are obsolete. No matter who or how was maintained.

Why are working electronics obsolete?

[GTom]

Originally Posted by sailpower

Why are working electronics obsolete?

I don't get that either. We are speaking of 2010-11 parts. Radars, chart plotters, inverters, etc are not PC graphics cards that get 30% better in each biannual generation.

[meirriba]

Originally Posted by sailpower

Why are working electronics obsolete?

Working equipment is not obsolete. However, at the present pace of change, you may find it difficult to get service or more precisely - parts.
E.g. - very silly but educational sample. I have 6 years old Raymarine system with ST70 instruments. It was extremely difficult to find a replacement cover for one that was lost overboard.