Poll for Professional Masters and Mates (over 500 tonnes)

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

The poll question does not mention 'open waters'.

I can't respond to the poll as such as no mention is made here or in the previous thread of 'common sense'.
.

Jeez Ping, you're a smart guy; you can probably figure it out. The first option is for them to follow the rules and allow you to avoid them if the rules require it.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Pandor

Presumably, but plenty of recreational sailors don't understand these rules. It is the fact that some sailors don't understand the rules that makes it very hard to operate a larger commercial vessel around any recreational vessel. You just don't know what to expect.

And an awful lot of them claim to know the rules, then make up weird ideas like "tonnage rule" and "they're working, I'm playing". Some actually follow the rules - life is like a box of chocolates.

Given the way the colregs currently work, do you want them to follow the rules, (and yes it would be nice if they all knew the colregs, we can all dream) or just stay out of the way. Not everyone is going to read this, so obviously some will keep following the colregs, until it's re-written based on the outcome of the poll.

Your poll did not specify "open water." So you are changing the questions.

First option clearly states do you want them to follow the rules and allow you to avoid them where the rules require that. Work it out ffs.

What kind of license do you hold? I've never experienced any merchant mariners that describe the size of our ships in displacement. That is usually the Navy or the Coast Guard.

Navy. What license do you hold? What do you drive?

Well, then you already have the answer. How may large ticketed mariners do you think actually are members of this forum anyway?

According to the other poll, 50-something at last look. I'm doubtful, but the idea is to settle the (mis)conception that big ship drivers just want the little boats to be unpredictable I mean, get out of the way.

[Pandor]

Navy

That is pretty funny. I’ve found that it is the gray ships that more than any other want everyone (merchants or rec) to just stay out of their way.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Pandor

That is pretty funny. I’ve found that it is the gray ships that more than any other want everyone (merchants or rec) to just stay out of their way.

Wrong Navy.

[Lodesman]

Here's the spectrum of my rides - the middle one is indicative of the vessel type I spent the bulk of my seatime in.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Pandor

But I will also understand that even a sailboat needs to insist on their rights under COLREGS given their own limitations.

Wow, just wow!


A self proclaimed professional mariner who thinks there are "rights under COLREGS"

[chrisr]

thanks for starting a new thread / survey lodesman. my one seemed to go off the rails...

hope this ones fares better !

still seems to be a lot of folk that don't appreciate the rules allow for different actions in different circumstances (narrow channels, restricted vessels etc).

also cannot get over the folk who seem to think that following COLREGS encourages some sort of dangerous confrontation between vessels of any size. just bizarre...

cheers,

ps : i'll try to keep jokes about the grey funnel line to a minimum in future !

[BigBoater917]

I spend more than half my time in pilotage waters but would still prefer abiding by the COLREGS. The catch that seemed to be seen in the previous thread is that most rec sailors don't realize we most likely have already done our maneuver before they even recognize the risk of collision. Since my ATB is a bit smaller and more maneuverable than ships we often have tighter zones of comfort before have to act.

Edit- you should post the same poll on gCaptain and see how the results compare.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by chrisr

thanks for starting a new thread / survey lodesman. my one seemed to go off the rails...

hope this ones fares better !


ps : i'll try to keep jokes about the grey funnel line to a minimum in future !

I thought your question was a good one, but too many people voted before they read the first post. I was hoping this was a little clearer, but now I'm not so sure.

Don't worry about the jokes, I got a thick skin and a sense of humour.

[Pelagic]

There is a good opportunity here for non licensed skippers to better understand the career licensed mindset taking this poll.

ESPECIALLY IF VOTERS HAVE REACHED COMMAND LEVEL

Very simply
a) Do you as a professional want all pleasure boats to follow the Rules

b) Pleasure boats, don't worry about the Rules, Just Stay Out Of the Way

If those qualified to take the poll think about it..a) can be the only logical answer

Reason:?
The ugly truth is that Career Mariners in command, care first about this....
To keep their licence, their job and to feed their families.

LIABILITY is a big part of Command responsability, so teaching junior officers to ALWAYS act in accordance with COLREGS , is what the Master of the ship will do, for self preservation.

So those "professionals" who disagree are either junior or haven't thought it thru

[Jammer]

In some waters the only way that rec boats can stay out of the way is to stay at the dock. Sure, there are plenty of commercial mariners who would prefer that. And there are some congested areas where there are special rules, or where there are serious questions whether some classes of boats (e.g. rental kayaks) should be allowed.


In many cases there's only one river/channel/harbor entrance/etc and there is no "out of the way" for boats that want to use the resource.

[NSboatman]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Here's the spectrum of my rides - the middle one is indicative of the vessel type I spent the bulk of my seatime in.

Nice- Halifax class, and the old oiler. Preserver?

Both soon to be replaced!

...maybe. If our gubmint can get their **** together...

[Uricanejack]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

There is a good opportunity here for non licensed skippers to better understand the career licensed mindset taking this poll.

ESPECIALLY IF VOTERS HAVE REACHED COMMAND LEVEL

Very simply
a) Do you as a professional want all pleasure boats to follow the Rules

b) Pleasure boats, don't worry about the Rules, Just Stay Out Of the Way

If those qualified to take the poll think about it..a) can be the only logical answer

Reason:?
The ugly truth is that Career Mariners in command, care first about this....
To keep their licence, their job and to feed their families.

LIABILITY is a big part of Command responsability, so teaching junior officers to ALWAYS act in accordance with COLREGS , is what the Master of the ship will do, for self preservation.

So those "professionals" who disagree are either junior or haven't thought it thru

If I did. I’d have parked it in long ago, The number of things you could possibly be held liable for, is just nuts.

It doesn’t matter how big or small the vessel is, once you take on the responsibility for the life of someone in your care on your vessel. Crew, passengers and any other people on any other vessels. You may encounter.

There is no greater responsibility.

OOW, or Master.

When you are paid to take on this responsibility, you have chosen to take it on. It does not matter if it’s the smallest pickle boat on a harbour tour or the biggest passenger ship in the world.

If you wish to be considered a professional you do things properly according to requirements where there is anybody checking on you or not.
Regardless of liability.

Liability is for the lawyers to sort out later.

A pleasure boat skipper has no greater or less responsibility.

The professional is expected to have a higher level of knowledge and understanding.

So long as you do the best you can with the knowledge you have.
What more could be expected.

[Pelagic]

I don't think any professional sets out to be a bad watchkeepr , but laziness and cynicism sets in to some whose motivation is low.

Then bad habits develop , poor lookout practices and they do become a liability to the Master.

I have had to remove a few in my time

The good ones see the big picture and understand that many of todays pleasure boat operators with touch screen navigation have probably never done a course on Rules of the Road, which was more common when they needed to learn basic navigation to go out there

So we go that extra effort to guide the yachtsman into following the rules

[HeinSdL]

An interesting follow up question to those answering with the first choice: when motor sailing, do you display the cone? (Presuming those 500t Masters also go out sailing now and then).