Merry Christmas from Guardia Civil (Spain)- insurance q

[markxengineerin]

I am cruising in Europe, currently Spain. I was visited by Guardia Civil this morning and they notified me that I must have insurance to be in their waters, and that they will "end my voyage" if I don't get some asap.

I tried to find international insurance before I left the United States, but found it impossible. 5 or 6 "no's" and I gave up. The boat was built in 1994 and I sail alone.

Questions:
1)Anyone have recommendations or experiences with "temporary" liability insurance in Spain? I won't be here more than another 1-2 months. I assume it's going to be difficult to find, with no mailing address, limited Spanish language abilities, and the temporary yet immediate need I have.
2)Is there a list of other European countries which require yacht insurance for visitors? I may be looking at leaving Spain immediately to avoid this hassle, but have to assume there could be some communication between EU countries.

Thanks!

[SailingHarmonie]

Noonsite lists which countries require insurance. Look under “Documents”

A Quick Look shows that France, Spain and Portugal all require proof of insurance. I leave it to you to search the rest.

Kind of basic cruising prep to know this stuff before you get there. Just because you think it is “impossible” doesn’t give you a pass on the rules. The rules do apply to you.

[markxengineerin]

I'm not thinking I deserve a pass. This was a risk I was willing to take, because the odds of having a problem seemed low. I checked in in France, stayed in one of the largest marinas and was not asked for insurance.

This does seem to be a difficult rule to enforce properly, because of the fine print in policies from all around the world. For example, I could probably have just shown my cancelled American insurance (which was invalid here even before I cancelled it) and been fine.

[GordMay]

This reminds me of: "The three unwritten rules of life:"
1.
2.
3.

[jeanathon]

Just go to a local insurance agent. They will set you up. Obviously try for one that speaks English.

[svhydra]

except for the needless scolding i am in complete agreement with sailingharmonie. i hope you can find a speedy resolution to this problem. best of luck and merry x-mas!

[JPA Cate]

Maybe there's someone bilingual for English and Spanish in the marina, who can help the OP find a bilingual ins. agent. They will sell term insurance. It won't even be too expensive, I hope. I would get it before moving the boat. The Guardia Civil know where she was when you were told to get in compliance.

Ann

[SailingHarmonie]

Originally Posted by markxengineerin

I'm not thinking I deserve a pass. This was a risk I was willing to take, because the odds of having a problem seemed low. I checked in in France, stayed in one of the largest marinas and was not asked for insurance.

This does seem to be a difficult rule to enforce properly, because of the fine print in policies from all around the world. For example, I could probably have just shown my cancelled American insurance (which was invalid here even before I cancelled it) and been fine.

Wait a second, your proposed "solution" to the problem of being caught KNOWINGLY violating the rule on insurance is to skip out of the country--without checking out--and hope you don't get caught at that?

And you say you DO think the rules apply to you? Color me skeptical... Or maybe they do not apply to you as long as you do not get caught?

This is a great example of how to give cruisers following you a bad reputation: Just blow off any rule that is inconvenient when you think you might not get caught.

Put the big boy pants on and do what you need to do to get insurance. Do not dig the hole deeper.

[Fore and Aft]

Mark I think you're in the country of the most dodgiest marine insurance companies in the world. Surely Edward Williams can give you some worthless chit to keep the authorities of your back?
Cheers

[JPA Cate]

Oh, for pity's sake. Do NOT buy ins. from Edwin Williams: they have a huge non-payment of claims reputation. Do find a local broker, even if you have to take an Eng. Span. dictionary and work out in advance how to write down what you need. It's not rocket science. Maybe Google translate or some other app for a phone if you have one?

Ann

[markxengineerin]

I did not propose lying to authorities, I was making an example of how this is a difficult rule to enforce.
I don't see sailing without insurance much differently than I see sailing singlehanded while asleep- neither are ideal, but there are worse crimes in this world which are perfectly "legal". Personal choice. There's also no way for an American visitor to check in or out of Spain if it's a stop in the middle of other Schengen destinations. This was explained to me a couple weeks ago when I tried to check in...

Thanks for the input, I've also received a few nice PM's and will follow up with what happens. I don't want any payouts, just a low cost policy so that I'm compliant with the law.

[Tupaia]

The insurance is not for you it is for 3rd parties to whom you might cause injury or damage. If you are really stuck with English speakers there are several Marine Ins Brokers in Gibraltar, Google is your friend.

[Chotu]

I might have put it back on the Guardia:

“I’m a stupid American. Lo ciento. I didn’t know. Very sorry. Could you point me to a place here in the harbor where i can get insurance right now to get into compliance immediately?”

They know everyone in the harbor.

[markxengineerin]

The insurance is not for you it is for 3rd parties to whom you might cause injury or damage.

Same can be said for the ethical debate of singlehanding while asleep- I'm ok with my risk of hurting others. Especially since many countries don't require 3rd party insurance. And because there are low cost policies like Edwin Williams with a reputation for not paying out anyway. Very sketchy concept, this requirement of international insurance.

Could you point me to a place here in the harbor where i can get insurance right now to get into compliance immediately?”

Tried that, they don't know !

Gibraltar is a helpful suggestion, thanks!

[BM2023]

Insurance companies, I am pretty sure, will only insure you for a full calendar year. Professionals like ship yards, may be able to insure a vessel for a limited period, for example for delivery purposes, but consumer I do not think have this option.

There are two things you can do :
• Google for the local “Gestoria”, they will most probably be able to assist you with this matter
• Google “yacht insurance” and one of Europe’s largest will most definitely appear.

Please do to take into consideration, you are probably cheaper off insuring in the USA or UK (Gibraltar) than in the EU, because of your nationality.

As Tupaia commented, the requirements for insurance is probably because of 3de party liability, in case you cause an accident, damage goods of others, etc.

On your question if it is obligatory throughout the whole of the EU, Chat GTP answered the following:

Yacht insurance is not mandatory in all EU countries. While some countries, such as Italy and Croatia, require boat insurance, others, like the Netherlands, do not make it a legal requirement but emphasize its financial benefits in case of damage or accidents. In the UK, there is no legal obligation to have yacht insurance. The necessity of yacht insurance varies across EU member states, and yacht owners should be aware of the specific regulations in their respective countries.