How many Policy Holders on Marine Insurance Policy?

[Sailor647]

Hi Everyone,

How many Policy Holders can there be on an insurance policy for our boat?

We have a Markel Jackline policy. Both of us (husband and wife) are Named Insureds.

https://www.gowrie.com/pdfs/NewJacklinePolicy.pdf

Our marine insurance carrier is telling us that only one person can be the policy holder. Why not both of us?

The reason I ask is, when our house burned down years ago, we were told by Allstate if we wanted to get the full value of our policy, then we'd have to sue them. So we did. However, throughout the entire process they would only deal with me - since I was the only "policy holder." Having both of us in that fight would have been a lot easier on us.

God forbid we have any kind of loss with our boat. We take great care, are religious about maintenance, and are very cautious cruisers. However, stuff happens and we spend hurricane season in the tropics. (But we take every conceivable option for protecting our boat.) So far, so good. Not a single incident or loss. Knock on wood.

My concern is, what if the "Policy Holder" isn't in a position to handle a claim due to injury or illness? Will they deal with my spouse?

Again, I'm not expecting to have a claim and will do everything in our power to prevent anything bad from happening.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate it.

[john61ct]

Wouldn't a Power of Attorney handle that?

[Paul L]

If you are both on the title or documentation then I don't see why you both wouldn't be named on the insurance.

[Sailor647]

Originally Posted by Paul L

If you are both on the title or documentation then I don't see why you both wouldn't be named on the insurance.

We are both on the USCG Documentation and are both "Named Insureds" on the policy. However, only ONE of us is the "Policy Holder", which (with land based insurance companies) means only the Policy Holder can file and deal with any claims.

I'm wondering if it's the same for marine insurance. I sent an email to the broker - haven't heard back yet.


Regarding POA -
If I remember correctly, a Power of Attorney isn't used if the person is healthy and of sound mind. I think... So, if the Policy Holder is of sound mind, what's the problem? Well, past experience tells me that if something happens to the boat and a claim is filed, it would be better for us if we could BOTH work through the claims process. Again, knock on wood that nothing happens.

And, also not sure if it the POA is binding in countries outside of the US. But, since the policy is sold and managed by a US company, one would think it would be. Now trying to remember if we have those on the boat?

Any other ideas?

Thanks.

[john61ct]

I've seen POA used for when people are just away overseas, have friends or professionals manage their affairs, no incapacitation required.

And yes would need to be valid for the relevant jurisdiction wrt the contract.

Nice thing is can be enabled or revoked as needed, independent of the contract.

[capt04530]

Policyholders need to have an "insurable interest" in the property being insured. Owners or lenders for example. Additional named insureds can be captains, Marina's or entities with other interests in the property. If you both own the property, you should both be listed as policyholders.

[SailSonoma]

Hi,

Most policies refer to the individuals or entities listed on the declarations page as a Named Insured. The forms in the policy will contain a clause that defines who is an "Insured" as most yacht policies provide coverage for others in certain circumstances. The policy will go further and define the duties of the Insured in the event of a loss. You do not generally see a separate category for "Policy Holder" defined.

I'm basing my comments on 10 years as the owner of a property and casualty insurance agency with a decent amount of Marine coverage in Massachusetts. It is important to note that every Marine policy is different, and that you should read the policy carefully to understand your rights and obligations before you need to deal with a loss.

I'm currently insured with Pantaenius and have only received quotes from the Jackline program. I did just read through my forms, but have not had a chance to read theirs, only their quotation.

I believe that the Gowrie Group operates as a managing general agent for the Jackline program. They may have found it easiest to institute the standard you have described to make it easier for them to handle claims on behalf of the Insurance carrier. But bottom line is that the policy forms drive your rights and obligations, so unless the limitation is specifically called out in writing, it is likely just for their convenience.

Caveat emptor...

Craig
s/v Sonoma, Bristol 41.1
Currently enjoying St Croix, USVI, at Green Cay Marina

[jmschmidt]

You are speaking of a General POA. A limited POA can assign any single right, or group of listed right, to any person or to multiple people in a certain order.

[hellosailor]

A contract is between two parties. So the "corporation entity", your insurer, is one party. They want to deal with one other entity, not two. Let's say they let you and the wife both be policy holders. She says "I'll accept that payment" and you say "Hell no." Now what?

So if you both want to be policy holders, incorporate, form an LLC, make some kind of legal entity that is the policy holder. More complicated than it needs to be, huh?

"If I remember correctly, a Power of Attorney isn't used if the person is healthy and of sound mind. " POA laws vary from state to state. The party you designate as a "durable and general Power of Attorney" can be given the right to do ANYTHING that you can do, including file or settle lawsuits. You don't have to be disabled, you could just have gone fishing or decided to play golf that day, so your friend the POA is doing something for you.
Many national corporations (brokers and banks being the most notorious) try to pretend that the laws of THEIR state or THEIR company policy override local laws about POA. And some local laws are very blunt about that: If they ignore a legitimate request from a POA-designee? They're often responsible for all consequential damages. I've spoken to a number of published journalists who've touched on that point, and everyone agrees, there's gonna be one huge class action lawsuit one of these days.