Diesel Fuel Polishing

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by sy_gilana

The Davco is way superior to the Racor types (IMHO)

In what way?

DO use a gear pump for this. Forget diaphragm, and junkyard recoveries.

Plenty of successful systems have been made using Walbro pumps or similar.
Why would you forget a system that works?

[bstreep]

Originally Posted by bobconnie

algee X algee killer

This product is a total waste of money, IMHO. I don't care who says it works. Just like the magnets for water softening, fuel economy, etc. It's a freakin' MAGNET - and not a strong one at that.

I'm a molecular biologist by education. My 91 year old father, a chemical engineer, just laughs at these products and repeats the incorrectly attributed PT Barnum quote: "There's a sucker born every minute".

Aside from that, I think this is a decent idea - but I also believe it won't cure an existing dirty tank problem. This should be a solution to KEEP your tank clean, not clean up a filthy one.

[delmarrey]

Here's a link to some educational material that should help w/your decision>>> http://www.lydallfiltration.com/tech...uelFilters.pdf

CURRENT FILTER DESIGN
A typical diesel fuel filter system uses a primary filter on the suction side of the fuel pump and a secondary filter on the pressure side. The primary filter is required to remove large particles that can damage the pump and separate water from the fuel. The secondary filter is required to withstand higher pressures and remove small particles that can damage the engine components. Newer filter designs use a one-stage system that incorporates the water removal capability of the primary filter with the high efficiency particle removal of the secondary filter.
Two-stage systems that use a coalescing filter for water removal and a surface filter for particle removal. The two-stage system typically uses an open coalescing media based on cellulose or a cellulose/glass composite. The coalescing filter needs to be emptied on some periodic basis. The secondary filter typically uses a finer cellulose composite media for particle removal.
One stage systems use a single filter with a multilayer composite structure. The current state of the art uses a meltblown media formed on or laminated to a cellulose support. The chemical composition of the meltblown has broad chemical compatibility and is moderately hydrophobic. The cellulose media provides physical support to the meltblown and is generally bonded with a phenolic resin, which needs to be post cured.
Neither of these technologies can achieve high efficiency below 10 μm. Glass based media is currently the only nonwoven technology able to achieve 99.9% removal of particles below 10 μm.

[Cheechako]

For an oft used and installed system, you really just need a small pump and one good filter. A big system with dual or triple filters and a big pump will do a great job and keep your friends happy too, but expensive unless you're a great scrounger. If going that way I would use a 120V ac motor. My maintenance guys built one for cleaning hydraulic oil. Had about a 1.5 horse motor and big pump with 1" hose and dual industrial filters. It was all neatly arranged attached to a hand truck. Man, that thing would move a lot of fluid and it's amazing what would come out of even a "clean" system....

[steveebryant]

Thank you all for the good suggestions.

I like the Parker Fuel Polishing Module - FPM-050 idea. While it is the most expensive in the short run, it is also the easiest to implement.

While I really like the idea of using a salvaged fuel pump, I have yet to determine how to know if a given filter/separator, such as Davco, would be compatible with the pump.

I suppose that I should contact Davco and discover what flow rates and pressures are required for the filter to be effective and then search to find a fuel pump that will provide that flow rate and pressure.

Then I will need to discover how many amps will be required to drive the pump. That all sound do able.

The question that seems to remain less clear to me is: "Will a battery connected to a charger deliver the type of 'clean' DC current that would not damage the pump or charger?" If that is a possibility, then I might be able to find a power supply that can be plugged into 110 V AC and deliver the correct DC volts and amps . . . final comments please?

[s/v Jedi]

Hi guys,

I'm a bit late to this thread, but I designed a fuel polishing system aboard Jedi 5 years ago. It's based on the documentation from Nordhavn. You find my description here: A new fuel system for Jedi (English) - s/v Jedi

this is the diagram:

ciao!
Nick.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by steveebryant

Thank you all for the good suggestions.

I like the Parker Fuel Polishing Module - FPM-050 idea. While it is the most expensive in the short run, it is also the easiest to implement.

caution here.

Saw quite a bit of discussion on Parker module somewhere and thought generally was whilst it did some polishing based on very low flow rates was absolutely no good for dirty tanks or cleaning up dirty tanks.

Too low flow rate.

Cheers

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by steveebryant

The question that seems to remain less clear to me is: "Will a battery connected to a charger deliver the type of 'clean' DC current that would not damage the pump or charger?" If that is a possibility, then I might be able to find a power supply that can be plugged into 110 V AC and deliver the correct DC volts and amps . . . final comments please?

A battery charger and battery delivers very clean power that will supply DC power to even the most sensitive electronics. It will power a pump without any problems.
The Parker system is easy, but it's expensive for what you get. There have been some complaints from users that the pump does not prime very well. The most common home built systems combine a Walbro fuel pump with a Raycor 500 filter. The connections are simple fuel hose and valves.
I have built a system like this and it works very well. Currently it has an an old fuel pump of unknown make, it has a very low flow like the Parker system, but has kept the fuel spotlessly clean. I don't think the low flow makes any difference, when sailing the fuel tank gets plenty of agitation. The low flow pump I have draws 0.9 A. The pump is also very quiet.
I have purchased a Walbro pump to replace it as I think the pump is on its last legs. The specs for the Walbro pump say it draws about 3 times current as my smaller pump but the flow rate is higher.
For filtration I have Raycor 900 filters which take a lot more crud ( about 10x from memory) than the smaller 500 series. This is particuarly helpful for the filter on the main engine if you get a diesel bug problem smaller filters can plug in only a few minutes making getting anywhere difficult even if you have lots of spare filters.

[steveebryant]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

A battery charger and battery delivers very clean power that will supply DC power to even the most sensitive electronics. It will power a pump without any problems.
The Parker system is easy, but it's expensive for what you get. There have been some complaints from users that the pump does not prime very well. The most common home built systems combine a Walbro fuel pump with a Raycor 500 filter. The connections are simple fuel hose and valves.
I have built a system like this and it works very well. Currently it has an an old fuel pump of unknown make, it has a very low flow like the Parker system, but has kept the fuel spotlessly clean. I don't think the low flow makes any difference, when sailing the fuel tank gets plenty of agitation. The low flow pump I have draws 0.9 A. The pump is also very quiet.
I have purchased a Walbro pump to replace it as I think the pump is on its last legs. The specs for the Walbro pump say it draws about 3 times current as my smaller pump but the flow rate is higher.
For filtration I have Raycor 900 filters which take a lot more crud ( about 10x from memory) than the smaller 500 series. This is particuarly helpful for the filter on the main engine if you get a diesel bug problem smaller filters can plug in only a few minutes making getting anywhere difficult even if you have lots of spare filters.

I like the idea. I found a WALBRO Fuel pump GSS342 @ 255lpm (~65gpm) for 65$. I need a little inside information as to how to size up a proper filter/seprator with the WALBRO pump. It seems I am afraid of improper function of the filter because the flow from the pump is too great or the pressure to too great.
Thanks, signed,
"Fearful due to lack of knowledge and bad experiences"

[noelex 77]

The pump I purchased is the Walbro FRC-6, but I haven't installed it yet .
There does not seem to be any practical problems using different pumps. Some people use much bigger, or smaller pumps, but 255L per min is too large (thats pumping out and average sized tank every minute) and will not be compaterable with 10mm fuel hose.
It should be installed after the filter so that it sucks fuel out.

[steveebryant]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

The pump I purchased is the Walbro FRC-6, but I haven't installed it yet .
There does not seem to be any practical problems using different pumps. Some people use much bigger, or smaller pumps without any problems, but 255L per min is very large (thats pumping out and average sized tank every minute) and will not be compaterable with 10mm fuel hose.
It should be installed after the filter so that it sucks fuel out.

Yes, I like the looks of that pump. Have you decided which water separator you will use? Also the Racor people have a timer switch that might be useful too.

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by steveebryant

Yes, I like the looks of that pump. Have you decided which water separator you will use? Also the Racor people have a timer switch that might be useful too.

I use a Raycor 900.
The timer would be useful, but I simply turn mine for a couple of hours a day or leave it on if I have excess power from the solar panels. I always run it sailing and for a few hours after as this is when the tank contents are stirred up.

[steveebryant]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

The pump I purchased is the Walbro FRC-6, but I haven't installed it yet .
There does not seem to be any practical problems using different pumps. Some people use much bigger, or smaller pumps, but 255L per min is too large (thats pumping out and average sized tank every minute) and will not be compaterable with 10mm fuel hose.
It should be installed after the filter so that it sucks fuel out.

I have 5/16" x 8mm hose on my boat now. When I install this new system, it will not be a part of the engine fuel circuit; it will be installed independently for the purpose of recirculating the fuel through a filter/seprator only. What would be the proper size hose for such a pump and can it be purchased in the 5/15" diameter?

[captain58sailin]

You can use bushings to adapt the fittings to fit the hose size. You might want to consider using a passive centrifuge in line on your fuel system, so that every time you run your engine you will be circulating the fuel and cleaning it at the same time and elimate the need for a seperate pump just to circulate your fuel through a filtration device. That depends on how large your engine compartment is, and how much fuel you are trying to clean. I have 1500 gallons of fuel capacity, and it is easier for me to just keep the system as part of the fuel supply to the gen set and main engine. I drain my centrifuge periodiclly and have not had problems with stopping up my racors, I do keep a vacuum gage on the supply manifold to the engines, to monitor filter condition. I also have a small 12 volt pump that I can employ to charge my system and refill the racor housing after a filter change. I also use a couple of 3 way valves that allow me to change filters on the fly with 2 seperate racor filter housings that are plumbed together ala Fuel Boss, only I made my own for about $1500 dollars less than what they charge. The secondary filter on my main engine is at 2 microns and I like to use no larger than 10 micron in the racors.

[steveebryant]

Wow, noelex 77, you have provided me with a lot of useful information. I will need to re-read it all over more closely as well as review the Walbro site and perhaps make a phone call or two to them.
Thank you so much!
Steve