Can you help me figure out how to apply butyl tape when I remount my traveler track?

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by PerfectPirate

Don't overthink this or get too complicated in your approach. In a situation like yours, I would lay a very thin strip of butyl along each bottom flange of the track. This is simply an aid to bedding it against the gelcoat, not for waterproofing. To waterproof the fasteners, I would insert the bolts through the track prior to mounting. Pinch the butyl on the bottom flanges in a bit, to hold each bolt in place. Then, wrap a thin layer of butyl around the threads of each bolt where it will be passing through the fiberglass. This butyl will provide the actual sealing against water penetration.

When everything is prepped, carefully maneuver the track into place, locating each bolt into its proper hole. Then, oh so carefully, try to work the track and bolts down evenly along the length of the track. Once you have enough threads through the fiberglass, then you can pull them down using the nuts, doing a few turns on each nut and then moving on to the next. Repeat until fully tight. If you have gauged things properly, once each bolt is fully seated there should be just a hint of butyl showing on the bolt threads underneath, before the nut is on.


I had a very similar track installation on my C&C 27 and over 16 years it never leaked that I could detect. Also, this is the approach which the builder used for the cleats and stanchions on my current boat. When I pulled those bolts last summer everything was still bone dry after 46 years of sailing. Definitely don't use silicone. 4200 will cure and degrade from UV over a few years, resulting in leaks when the track works under load. I speak from experience on that. Everything that I have ever bedded with butyl has never leaked, but it is important to carry it down into the hole.

Thanks for that great info. Your idea sounds like what I saw when I disassembled it. On a 40 year old boat, I can't be sure if it's original from the builder or not. Upon inspection, there was sealant along the edges and a big glop at every screw hole shoved in the open channel on the bottom of the track. I had no idea if that is correct and that's why I'm asking, but your method sounds logical.

I can live without drainage of the well. That area is notoriously dirty and I clean it all the time anyway. Bottom line, I need it to not leak.

BTW, I'm a butyl convert in almost all cases, so no worries about 4200

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by Spot

Because this track is an open channel, putting butyl on the bottom of it does not confine it in such a fashion that it will seal at its best. The spacers under the track would create a nice place for the butyl, esp. if they had the small chamfer recommended by others to create an o-ring effect. I am no longer suggesting epoxying the spacers to the boat now that I have take a better look at the track channel.

Is Ron back in business with the Bed-It product? I thought sales were on hold due to health issues.

A drain is still important otherwise the joints are constantly 'soaking in the bathtub' so to speak.

Wow, "a picture speaks a thousand words" Thanks for submitting that diagram. You are exactly on point with it. Did you draw that up just for this thread? That's impressive. Color coded too!

I haven't used G10. How would I buy it? How thick are you suggesting? I have 1/8" aluminum on hand that I can make up right away. Would that be adequate?

Everything I've read says the business is on hold and Bed-It tape is not available There's a thread on Sailing Anarchy. Lot's of people looking for a similar alternative.

The drain is a good idea, but I'm trying to launch and go sailing in a couple of weeks. I've found that if you keep the traveler lines out of the well, it dries pretty quick just from the boat rocking and evaporation. If I use spacers, I bet it will drain a lot quicker too.

[Spot]

You are welcome. I used to draft for a living so pictures are natural for 'splaining things. Sometimes I use MS Paint, sometimes CAD.

Aluminum would be fine IMHO. G10 or FR4 sheets can be ordered online. I work at a place that uses it so I can get scraps as needed.

[team karst]

The boat designer put in a bathtub cavity in deck with no drain? Is this in an impossible spot?

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by team karst

The boat designer put in a bathtub cavity in deck with no drain? Is this in an impossible spot?

I wouldn't call it the deck. The traveler is in the cockpit just aft of the companionway. Like I said previously, it can be a messy spot, but I keep it clean and dry as much as possible.

But, to answer your question, yes the designer did that to me.

[roverhi]

The leaks are coming from the fasteners. That's what you have to seal. Push the fasteners through the track the wrap butyl around the threads of the fastener where they will be going through the deck. Install the track pushing/installing the fasteners going from fastener to fastener and keep them going into the fiberglass evenly until the track is down flat. That should stop the leaks. Putting butyl along the base of the track may keep water from getting under the track and possibly inhibiting corrosion of the track but that's not what's critical to seal.

[AKA-None]

A slight counter sink at the mounting holes helps a lot

[coopec43]

I'm about to mount all the deck hardware so this thread is very timely, informative and relevant to me.


I've got nitrile 8mm "O" rings which I'll use around the bolt where it enters the deck (that is in addition to the Butyl) I suppose that is an over-kill?

[AKA-None]

Originally Posted by coopec43

I'm about to mount all the deck hardware so this thread is very timely, informative and relevant to me.


I've got nitrile 8mm "O" rings which I'll use around the bolt where it enters the deck (that is in addition to the Butyl) I suppose that is an over-kill?

Personally I’d pick one but definitely would still have a slight countersink to ensure the seal is pressed against the bolt
If only flat there will be a tendency for the seal to simply flatten out and perhaps not seal the mounting hardware

[wyb2]

Originally Posted by jjccp

Wow, "a picture speaks a thousand words" Thanks for submitting that diagram. You are exactly on point with it. Did you draw that up just for this thread? That's impressive. Color coded too!

I haven't used G10. How would I buy it? How thick are you suggesting? I have 1/8" aluminum on hand that I can make up right away. Would that be adequate?

Everything I've read says the business is on hold and Bed-It tape is not available There's a thread on Sailing Anarchy. Lot's of people looking for a similar alternative.

The drain is a good idea, but I'm trying to launch and go sailing in a couple of weeks. I've found that if you keep the traveler lines out of the well, it dries pretty quick just from the boat rocking and evaporation. If I use spacers, I bet it will drain a lot quicker too.

SS fender washers can do the same thing without having to fab up a bunch of spacers. You just want them to be slightly larger OD than the width of the track base, and an appropriate ID for the screw size. Of course if the size means ordering them online, and you have the aluminum on hand, making spacers may end up being faster than waiting for a package.

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by roverhi

The leaks are coming from the fasteners. That's what you have to seal. Push the fasteners through the track the wrap butyl around the threads of the fastener where they will be going through the deck. Install the track pushing/installing the fasteners going from fastener to fastener and keep them going into the fiberglass evenly until the track is down flat. That should stop the leaks. Putting butyl along the base of the track may keep water from getting under the track and possibly inhibiting corrosion of the track but that's not what's critical to seal.

Great tips, thanks

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

A slight counter sink at the mounting holes helps a lot

Yes, chamfer bit is on stand by. Thanks

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by coopec43

I'm about to mount all the deck hardware so this thread is very timely, informative and relevant to me.


I've got nitrile 8mm "O" rings which I'll use around the bolt where it enters the deck (that is in addition to the Butyl) I suppose that is an over-kill?

I'm no expert, maybe someone else can answer that, but the correct method of using butyl actually creates an O ring that seals the hole. If you haven't read Marinehowto.com, that might help. I did my deck last year having never done that type of work before and I have Zero leaks on the entire deck. A nice chamfer bit is a good idea too.

I'll also mention that the deck to hull seam on my 40 year old boat was done with butyl and it's still soft and pliable. Not too many other materials we use can make that claim.

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by wyb2

SS fender washers can do the same thing without having to fab up a bunch of spacers. You just want them to be slightly larger OD than the width of the track base, and an appropriate ID for the screw size. Of course if the size means ordering them online, and you have the aluminum on hand, making spacers may end up being faster than waiting for a package.

I came upon the same idea after digesting all this excellent information. I found some flat stainless steel washers with a extra small hole in my fastener bin. They are just a bit wider than the track. I have to buy a few more and some longer bolts, but I'm leaning in that direction.

Still considering all suggestions

[team karst]

With a salt water boat, I would consider delrin fender washers. Very tough, no corrosion issue. Stacking SS washers increases the surface area susceptible to attack. Plus that direct contact of Al to SS is not optimum.