Beneteau 361 Rudder removal advice needed

[scfoster]

Have a 2001 Beneteau 361 with heavy steering.
Now that it's on the hard for the winter, decided to tackle removing the rudder.
Dug the required hole under the rudder, disconnected the autopilot arm, loosened the two cable tensioner bolts, removed the two bolts that run through the rudder stock.
Did not see a split in the rudder quadrant, where a bolt would be tightened to pinch the rudder stock. So, I should be good with hardware removal.

Rotated the rudder back and forth and rocked it. Was able to drop the rudder a good 1.25", then it stopped. Installed the emergency tiller and tapped on the top of it, yielding about another 1/4" drop.

Now the top of the rudder shaft is about 1/8" above the rudder quadrant. I don't want to go bashing on the emergency tiller, if there's something I'm missing.

Anyone have experience dropping the rudder? Thoughts?

[scfoster]

No responses but figured it out. The first 200 or so rudder assemblies for the Beneteau 361 were made by Tides Marine, not Beneteau. So they are completely different that what's shown on the Beneteau spare parts site.

The rudder shaft is carbon fiber and fiberglass, with an upper and lower bushing also built up from carbon fiber and fiberglass. This slides up into a stand tube that has a UHMW plastic sleeve with a single UHMW ring which the top of lower bushing contacts to limit upward travel.

The top of the rudder shaft is square (with rounded edges) and has two 90 degree offset holes drilled through the shaft. The lower hole lines up with an upper collar that sits on top of the stand tube. The upper part of the shaft press fits into the rudder quadrant with about 1 inch of the shaft above the top of the quadrant. When vertically aligned, a bolt fits through the hole.

The top of the shaft had slightly mushroomed, so it was necessary to jack the rudder back up, tap down the rudder quadrant to expose the top of the shaft and lightly sand the sides. Then silicone lubricant was applied. Took away the jack and placed the metal emergency tiller bar into the top of the rudder shaft. Said a prayer and bashed the top of the metal tiller bar with a heavy hammer about 10 times. Once the top of the rudder shaft was below the top of the rudder quadrant, I knew it would continue to drop, so began lightly tapping for a while until it totally came out.

The rudder and shaft is about 6.25 feet so you need a nice deep hole in the ground.

Once removed, I could see that antifouling, which had been sprayed in successive coats over the past 20 years, had gotten up inside the bearing surfaces. This caused the binding.

Carefully cleaned it off as best I could, but it exposed some of the fiber strands. Was told by Tides Marine to apply light coats of epoxy and sand in between coats to build up a smooth surface.

[tkeithlu]

Very glad that you figured it out, scfoster. It could not be particularly complicated, but from even your excellent pictures I could not see how it was assembled or what was stopping it from sliding out.

[scfoster]

Originally Posted by tkeithlu

Very glad that you figured it out, scfoster. It could not be particularly complicated, but from even your excellent pictures I could not see how it was assembled or what was stopping it from sliding out.

Pretty simple assembly. There is a rudder with a 3 foot post that goes up inside the vertical stand tube in the boat. The stand tube has a UHMW plastic sleeve, which is the slippery bearing surface.
The rudder post has an upper and lower bushing, bonded to the rudder post. They ride up against the plastic sleeve in the stand tube.

At the top of the stand tube, with the rudder post inserted, a black plastic collar slides down on the rudder post and sits on top of the stand tube. A bolt runs through the collar and the rudder post, locking the rudder to the collar and preventing it from dropping. That is what holds the rudder vertically, while allowing it to rotate.

At the top of the rudder post, the rudder quadrant (large black disk) goes on and is also locked in place with a bolt through the bottom of the quadrant and the rudder post. The post is square and the hole in the quadrant is also square.

Cables attach to the outer rim of the quadrant, which pull the quadrant clockwise and counterclockwise, with helm inputs, turning the rudder.

So there are only 4 separate pieces:
1. Rudder assembly (rudder, rudder post, lower bushing & upper bushing), all bonded together.
2. Vertical stand tube with UHMW plastic sleeve bonded to hull.
3. Rudder retention collar on top of stand tube with bolt.
4. Rudder quadrant on top of rudder post with bolt.

[tkeithlu]

It's a beautiful assembly. I'm impressed. Am I right in thinking that the stand tube is tall enough to keep water out?

[scfoster]

Originally Posted by tkeithlu

It's a beautiful assembly. I'm impressed. Am I right in thinking that the stand tube is tall enough to keep water out?

Yes it is. A single tube of HDPE plastic encased in carbon fiber and fiberglass. Beneteau changed the design to something less expensive.

After sanding the lower bushing with progressively finer grit, began building back up with thickened epoxy, applied with a very short nap roller with sanding in between coats. Finally applied a layer of epoxy and wrapped plastic around it to achieve as smooth a surface as I could. Sanded with really fine grit paper, using sandpaper sheets cut in half and pulled back and forth like polishing a pair of shoes. Doesn't look great but feels smooth to the touch.

Now have to barrier coat the rudder before reinstallation.