Visit our Popular Forums

Captain Bill · 10-02-2010, 16:59

Maybe they shouldn't have, after all it's their reputation.

Cheechako · 10-02-2010, 20:13

"All this bad mouthing the Yanmar motor. I'm not sure these problems were due to a defective motor by what I've read on this thread."
While this motor has evidently been used in a less than perfect manner...I believe a good diesel is one that will take abuse and still go 10,000 hours. Yanmar doesnt fit that bill in my experience.... one of the current problems is the Injection Pump... which shouldnt have been compromised from low rpm useage... I would say most my diesels have been idled for charging about as much as run with prop turning .... that would be about 50/50. My perkins 4-108 was pushing a 36000 lb boat with a max prop set for 2800 rpm max. (usually ran at about 2400 rpm and 7-8 knots) never a problem...over 6000 hours when I sold the boat...

**Dockhead** · 11-02-2010, 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tspringer

The problem is not Turbo. I got the new turbo installed, buttoned everything up, got her up to temp and went out for a sea trial. Problem is exactly as before. Max rpm at full throttle is 2,950 at which point the boat pours black smoke.

While installing the new turbo I double checked the exhaust and intake systems to make sure no rags or such had been left behind before or any other obvious air blockage.

So.... back to square zero. I guess we are down to 3 options at this point as far as I can tell: replace the injection pump, haul out and re-pitch the prop, go for a full rebuild or repower replacing the engine.

At this point we are all just frazzled and disgusted. The kids want to go home. So do I. I guess we will get hauled out again and try to drop the pitch on the max-prop by 4 degrees.... this is what the max prop guys said try though they did not really believe the prop pitch could be the issue if it is pitched as my maintenance notes indicate.

The Yanmar regional tech guys at Mastry say its the prop. The max prop guys say that if the pitch is as my records indicate then its not the prop.

I went over all of the gear and equipment we have added to the boat and my best guess would be that we have added about 2,000lb in overall weight to the boat. That includes a larger battery bank, a rear arch with solar panels, watermaker and various other gear plus all my tools and our cruising equipment. I cannot see it being much if any over 2Klb.

Terry

Man, I feel your pain. I've been through a very similar wild goose chase with a smoking Yanmar ("Another Smoking and Cruising Thread").

All I can tell you is that since you did the work yourself, the turbo replacement is not money down the drain. The bright side:

1. You now have a spare.

2. You now know for d*mn sure it ain't the flippin turbo.

3. You now know how to take it off and put it on, and what it looks like inside.

All this is actually valuable.

delmarrey · 11-02-2010, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

[I]
.... one of the current problems is the Injection Pump... which shouldnt have been compromised from low rpm useage...

How long would you expect 18 YO seals to last?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tspringer

It has a Yanmar 4JH2-HTE 75hp turbo/intercooled diesel engine that was installed in 1992. At the time of my purchase the engine had approximately 3500 hours. It now has about 4000 hours.

sigmasailor · 16-02-2010, 08:42

Any news here?
I am still curious about the working part of your home.

Tspringer · 16-02-2010, 10:03

We are waiting on the new Yanmar 4JH4-TE engine package to arrive so we can install it.

Terry

sigmasailor · 16-02-2010, 10:25

OK, repower I understand. Oh, well... At least you know what you get for the next 25 years. I hope you got a good deal. I agree that with a rebuilt you have to wait and see how long it lasts. The latter depending largely on the skills of the mechanic and you sure did have your share of that.

Just for the fun of it are you going to look at the faulty piston?

Chuteman · 16-02-2010, 10:56

T:
You mentioned possibly visiting the Miami boat show to get some "help" from the Yanmar reps - were you able to do that?
Good luck on the install and resuming your voyage asap

Tspringer · 17-02-2010, 11:11

I did go to the Yanmar booth at the boat show. I spoke with one of the Yanmar guys who basically passed me off as quickly as he could to a guy from Mastry who was also working the booth. I was informed that they do not do any kind of "Boat Show" pricing or discounting at all, under any circumstances. None of the issues I have been through meant anything. The Mastry rep at the show quoted me a price on the new engine significantly MORE expensive than JAS Marine did. So I purchased the engine through JAS, which I was going to do anyway unless any boat show pricing had been significant because John at JAS has been so great to work with.

The footprint issue and clearly much higher install expense if I went with a different make of engine is the only reason I am going back with a Yanmar. I would have felt better about getting a new Yanmar had I been able to purchase through Mack Boring, my biggest gripe is really with Mastry and of course Mobile Consulting in Jacksonville.

I will not be inspecting the old engine... I have sold it.

Terry

Chief Engineer · 17-02-2010, 15:17

Terry,
You have done the boating community a big service by keeping us apprised of your travails...

**bstreep** · 17-02-2010, 15:38

I can't believe the Yanmar rep or reps don't follow threads like this. This is so bad for their Customer Service reputation.

Chuteman · 17-02-2010, 16:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief Engineer

Terry,
You have done the boating community a big service by keeping us apprised of your travails...

Terry:
Thanks for all the updates. Sounds like you are on a good path with the new mechanic & the new engine.
Wishing you nothing but the best

**hpeer** · 20-02-2010, 03:22

FWIW, I just got my new issue of Good Old Boat and there is an article from a fellow with a Yanmar (3 clyinder I think) who has had two fuel lift pump failures in as many years. The failure causes the engine to "make oil." He attributes the failures to biodiesel, 20% to 30% mix, that he has been using.

He wrote an article several years ago describing the virtues of biodiesel and how it helps maintain an engine. He now notes that while everything else he said was true it now seems that biodiesel is a stronger solvent than fossil diesel and can ruin some seal, e.g. the fuel lift pump diaphragm.

He also quotes a very simple method of testing a lift pump by immersing it in kero, except for the intake port. Then operate the pump and see if it makes bubbles. If it does, it is bad.

I would imagine you could do the same thing by putting a solution of dishwashing soap and water around the body and then blowing into the in port and have someone else look for bubbles. That is a common way to look for small leaks.

**Dockhead** · 20-02-2010, 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

"All this bad mouthing the Yanmar motor. I'm not sure these problems were due to a defective motor by what I've read on this thread."
While this motor has evidently been used in a less than perfect manner...I believe a good diesel is one that will take abuse and still go 10,000 hours. Yanmar doesnt fit that bill in my experience.... one of the current problems is the Injection Pump... which shouldnt have been compromised from low rpm useage... I would say most my diesels have been idled for charging about as much as run with prop turning .... that would be about 50/50. My perkins 4-108 was pushing a 36000 lb boat with a max prop set for 2800 rpm max. (usually ran at about 2400 rpm and 7-8 knots) never a problem...over 6000 hours when I sold the boat...

I agree. My dad's boat has a Westerbeke (Perkins) 4-108. When he bought the boat 12 years ago it had 4,000 hours on the broken hour meter and he has motored to h*ll and back since then; I suppose it must have over 8,000 or more. He has no generator on board and no one ever told him not to run the engine at idle, and he spends 90% of his time at anchor, so that Westerbeke has been, for all these years, getting a couple hours of idling twice a day, charging batteries, year in, and year out.

That Westerbeke does not emit even the slightest wisp of smoke, starts like a champ, and has never given the slightest trouble all these years. It's ugly, it leaks, it shakes, and it is amazingly noisy for such a small unit, but it always gets you there (at 1900 RPM). The fact that it is noisy even has an advantage -- you can clearly hear whether or not it is happy at its work.

Our boat has a Yanmar, with only 800 hours, which smokes like a barbecue. I've overhauled the injection pump and injectors, overhauled the turbocharger, and been through everything else you can go through without taking the engine out. It is beautiful to look at and almost silent (turbo and intercooler help a lot, soaking up decibels). But my God, the complexity of it, if you need to diagnose some problem. It smokes less now and has been pronounced healthy by the best marine surveyor I know ("Yanmar's just smoke sometimes, my boy"). So we'll see what this season brings, but I sympathize with the above post.

Yanmars are the best, in theory. In practice, I'm not sure I wouldn't prefer to have one of those massive, primitive, heavy, inefficient, naturally aspirated, bulletproof Perkins tractor engines.