Common Rail Diesels - Experience

[Emouchet]

Why not looking at Beta marine engine? Those are simple engine, very reliable, and do not include modern electronic. What you want for a sail boat engine is simplicity, reliability and durability.

[BrightAyes]

Thanks for feedback
Bright Ayes

[wingssail]

I don't mind if my toys are high tech but I want the important stuff to be simple and fixable.

So, B&G Hercules instruments with Bluetooth data server etc: Fine.

But my diesel engine: old and dumb mechanical injection pump.

[NSboatman]

Originally Posted by waterman46

Yep, specially when the notoriously leaking Sherwood salt water pump begins to slowly drip, unnoticed by you, those drips hit the pumps v-belt and a fine salt mist begins to cover everything on the engine. Electrical connections to the injectors can be repaired but I hope your ECU could be very well sealed.

Been there, some that. This man speaks the truth. Damn Sherwood H5’s…

[Barkingmad]

Originally Posted by dannc

Correct. There is a lawsuit in the US against JD over their policy that prevents owners from repairing their equipment. My understanding is that JD will NOT to sell a spare ECU to an owner. The JD ECU is matched to the engine.

https://www.frontierpower.com/service/swapjdecu.htm

Basically, the link discusses the need to program the ECU, JD can do it for you or the dealer can, but the ECU and engine are matched.

Later,
Dan

LOL don't care about any of that when a 1/4 million dollar tractor is sitting in a field of perfectly dry beans waiting for the remote service guy to show up in 2 days only to spend 1000$ on diagnostics to replace a 30$ transmission gear range sensor that disables your whole rig!

Old school tractor didn't care what range the transmission was in for the engine to run!
Then you have to spend money to have the beans run through a natural gas drier because it rained while waiting for the repair......
Nothing like watching your profits go up in smoke!
Technology rocks!
BTW. Should have seen the look on his face when he got stuck in the muddy field and I told him to call a tow truck!

[NBs]

Originally Posted by NSboatman

Been there, some that. This man speaks the truth. Damn Sherwood H5’s…

And Sherwood 1730 is poor desing pump

[Chotu]

Do these engines have something akin to OBD error codes easily read by an inexpensive device?

My outboards are sophisticated 2-strokes with low emissions and similar fuel economy to 4 strokes. That’s achieved through complex sensors and an ECU.

The ECU is actually immersed in an oil bath.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Chotu

Do these engines have something akin to OBD error codes easily read by an inexpensive device?

My outboards are sophisticated 2-strokes with low emissions and similar fuel economy to 4 strokes. That’s achieved through complex sensors and an ECU.

The ECU is actually immersed in an oil bath.

In cars OBD is a legal requirement. Not so outside that realm

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

In cars OBD is a legal requirement. Not so outside that realm

Well that absolutely stinks.

We need a legal requirement in all cases for open ECU/error codes.

[ftamburrano]

I would keep and repair-rebuild the old engine. Modern diesel engines are not suitable for normal sailboats. Think how fragile are modern electronic devices. When, on open sea while sailing, you have a lightning nearby, even at tens os hundreds meters, the induced currents by the voltage gradients are able to destroy or damage electronic engine controllers. Those in the engine may be vital, much more than others which are fungible. And you cannot easily replace electronic devices, neither at sea nor in remote places where you may sail. Just stick to the old or very old engines: they are absolutely reliable and you may make repairs while sailing, or in a nearby harbour. No point to get a modern technologically advanced engine which lowers CO2 emissions, and consumes 3% les fuel, for an auxiliary engine on a boat, where fuel saving would be meaningless and CO2 produces minimal anyway, and immediately adsorbed into the sea water.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by ftamburrano

I would keep and repair-rebuild the old engine. Modern diesel engines are not suitable for normal sailboats. Think how fragile are modern electronic devices. When, on open sea while sailing, you have a lightning nearby, even at tens os hundreds meters, the induced currents by the voltage gradients are able to destroy or damage electronic engine controllers. Those in the engine may be vital, much more than others which are fungible. And you cannot easily replace electronic devices, neither at sea nor in remote places where you may sail. Just stick to the old or very old engines: they are absolutely reliable and you may make repairs while sailing, or in a nearby harbour. No point to get a modern technologically advanced engine which lowers CO2 emissions, and consumes 3% les fuel, for an auxiliary engine on a boat, where fuel saving would be meaningless and CO2 produces minimal anyway, and immediately adsorbed into the sea water.

Nothing about this is untrue but it’s unrealistic. Today new engines will almost all be common rail above 100hp and soon almost all engine will be likewise. My van has a common rail 1.3 litre diesel ( 70 hp) ecu controlled

Hence the likelihood is that over the next few years all new diesels will be ECU controlled

Lightning strikes in many parts of the world are not common , in 35 years of ocean and med sailing I’ve been in a handful of electrical storms where there was a risk of a strike. The other thing is that an actual lightning strike can range from minor damage to sinking the boat.

Hence really critiquing an ecu against lightening strikes in rather extreme. The situation may or may not result in ecu damage , we simply don’t have the data to properly evaluate the risk.

Stand-alone ECUs are not keyed to any engine ,the engine is an inert lump of metal. Hence it’s entirely possible to carry a spare , however like all spares you have to evaluate the risk of carrying or not carrying such a spare.

There are many things that stop a diesel from running , a faulty ECU is not at the top of the list.

[mabowers]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Standard industrial engines with ECUs , are just another spare part to replace, easier then doing a starter motor .

In my case, the last thing I need is another boat buck ($1000) "must have" spare engine part to carry, along with special diagnostic tools/training. Pretty sure Volvo techs are scarce at sundown with the entrance channel to the lee during flood tide in a small craft warning... which with my luck is when the ECU smokes itself.

[noelex 77]

For our latest boat we preordered the Yanmar engine before it was required in order to obtain one of the last well proven non common rail models.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by mabowers

In my case, the last thing I need is another boat buck ($1000) "must have" spare engine part to carry, along with special diagnostic tools/training. Pretty sure Volvo techs are scarce at sundown with the entrance channel to the lee during flood tide in a small craft warning... which with my luck is when the ECU smokes itself.

Personally having experienced a failed impeller and overheat shutdown , I find that is also an issue during a flood tide , ( or in my case in the middle of a reef entrance to a lagoon)

focusing on one item to the exclusion of all other failure modes simply is nonsensical

as for volvo , boat bucks is it middle name, ECU or any other part also

[mabowers]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Personally having experienced a failed impeller and overheat shutdown , I find that is also an issue during a flood tide , ( or in my case in the middle of a reef entrance to a lagoon)

focusing on one item to the exclusion of all other failure modes simply is nonsensical

as for volvo , boat bucks is it middle name, ECU or any other part also

I don't disagree re: focusing on a single failure mode, but I don't want to introduce additional ones.