Blue Water Boats ........Again.

[svseachange]

Originally Posted by Snore

The PSC 34 with a tiller, might be an option.

That's our setup and it works great, the cockpit is small but we can lift the tiller to create more room.

What about a cutaway keel (like the PSC 34) with skeg hung rudder as a compromise?

The main problem with our boat seems to be in light airs. It loves 10-25 kts. The cutter config helps into the wind.

[Mimsy]

Originally Posted by Andrew B.

Overlooked the S&S 34, and PSC 34 too.

You and Thomm are completely missing the point. That list is ONE persons opinion, nothing more. You are free to make up your own list. It will be a list of boats that YOU think are "Blue Water" boats. Someone might subscribe to, some one may not but really, who cares? These lists serve to point folks to likely candidates, not be written as Gospel.

People sail happily long distances on many different boats (GASP! Even Hunters!) the trick is knowing what your preferences are and buying something you feel good about. If you see you have the same criteria for design particulars as someone who has a list, then you are likely to find a suitable boat on a list. If your preferences don't match up, find another list...

[carstenb]

Considering the very high number of modern production boats circumnavigating, saying that they can't is about the same as saying a bumblebee can't fly.

Theya re doing it and very few are sinking, so what is all the discussion about?

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Mimsy

You and Thomm are completely missing the point. That list is ONE persons opinion, nothing more. You are free to make up your own list. It will be a list of boats that YOU think are "Blue Water" boats. Someone might subscribe to, some one may not but really, who cares? These lists serve to point folks to likely candidates, not be written as Gospel.

People sail happily long distances on many different boats (GASP! Even Hunters!) the trick is knowing what your preferences are and buying something you feel good about. If you see you have the same criteria for design particulars as someone who has a list, then you are likely to find a suitable boat on a list. If your preferences don't match up, find another list...

We can see the point, just adding some other (been there done that) boats.

I'm still trying to see which boats will ride better offshore or does it matter that much most of the time. Water length is nice but it didn't help in my example with the Hobie 16 out doing the NACRA 6.0 in those large waves in the gulf. (due to it's design)

As far as having a 27 foot boat vs a 41, my 27 is my first monohull. I didn't think I should buy a 41' boat as my first. When I bought my old boat one of the first things I did was buy a new mainsail. It seems most sailors by the sails last. Not sure why.

Plus I sail singlehanded a lot and since I'm still working I have to come in and out of a slip all the time which kinda limits my boat size. You cannot sail that far on a weekend or a week's vacation so having a 41' boat is still a waste of boat I think for one person.

Another guy said he sails his big boat and doesn't think about anything. That's not what its about for me. I want to see how the boat does in all situations.

I really like this Islander 36 for example but it has the more shallow 4'9" draft and I'm thinking the 6' draft model (I believe it's 6') would make it a little more stiff not to mention point better but I don't really care about pointing that much since I won't be doing organized racing.

Other boats I like would include something like a Contessa 32 or a Waquiez 32 Centurion both of which can be found with tiller steering. (or just continue sailing this old 27) Don't get confused though, I like most all sailboats............

there's also a Westsail 32 that's been sitting for years that I like if the guy ever stops " working on it " which means he visits the boat once a month and stares at it (which I can understand) and decides to sell it.

[David_Old_Jersey]

No Seadog 30 on that list (a couple RTW), so I can confirm that the list is crap!

As said already, lists like this are useful - but only to help folks get into a ballpark. If ya take any of them (with Hunters or without!) as gospel then pretty much a confirmation of own knowledge level.

FWIW (nada!), I suspect that the reason that older more traditional boats are on the list(s) is because they have both been around longer so have been long ago identified and used to go RTW etc and because nowadays cheaper (at least to buy!) than anything more modern (in style if not in build year).

In 25 years time I am sure Hunters will be firmly on these lists - especially the older ones, those built in 2013 and before.......not the modern crap they build in 2038!

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Don L

This just shows what you don't know! When sailing my boat I don't worry about anything for the most part because I don't need to to.

If you think think you are better off in your little bristol or whatever than in my 43' Hunter you must have taken too many boom hits to your head!

Well, let's say ole Don and I screwed up and were caught offshore in some nasty stuff. We're all buttoned up with drogues out. ........praying for war (oops that's Full Metal Jacket, I mean praying for our lives) and whatnot.

He on his 43' ah shhh "Hunter" Jeez (he may as well kiss his ......goodbye)..........and me on the Bristol 27. If the waves will just not get too big I'm thinking the 55-65 knot winds aren't going to have much boat to get a hold of as far as the Bristol 'cause she sits soooo low in the water.........

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Well, let's say ole Don and I screwed up and were caught offshore in some nasty stuff. We're all buttoned up with drogues out. ........praying for war (oops that's Full Metal Jacket, I mean praying for our lives) and whatnot.

He on his 43' ah shhh "Hunter" Jeez (he may as well kiss his ......goodbye)..........and me on the Bristol 27. If the waves will just not get too big I'm thinking the 55-65 knot winds aren't going to have much boat to get a hold of as far as the Bristol 'cause she sits soooo low in the water.........

You don't know **** and this post just proves it.

[carstenb]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Well, let's say ole Don and I screwed up and were caught offshore in some nasty stuff. We're all buttoned up with drogues out. ........praying for war (oops that's Full Metal Jacket, I mean praying for our lives) and whatnot.

He on his 43' ah shhh "Hunter" Jeez (he may as well kiss his ......goodbye)..........and me on the Bristol 27. If the waves will just not get too big I'm thinking the 55-65 knot winds aren't going to have much boat to get a hold of as far as the Bristol 'cause she sits soooo low in the water.........

Yes well, really - I mean a force 11 storm in a 27 footer? And you think others will need to kiss their arse arrivederci? Better pucker up yourself.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Don L

You don't know **** and this post just proves it.

+1

[AiniA]

Originally Posted by Suijin

Everything is relative and everything is a compromise. A full keel boat on a long blue water passage is going to be, all things being equal, more comfortable because of the easy motion of the boat...the bow of most fin keelers is rounder, with less wetted surface and can pound mercilessly in a seaway. Her rudder is also protected by and supported by the hull along it's entire length. But she is also going to be considerably slower and less agile.

There are many modern blue water boats that are not full keel, so that is not the be all and end all of blue water boat design by any stretch.

Here's another interesting resource for you to look at. I think in the end a boat's blue water credentials are defined by a combination of the fitness of her construction and the purpose of her design. Catalina's were never designed (until the 47) to be blue water boats, and so were generally not built to be blue water boats. But I would bet that more Catalina's have circled the globe than any other sailboat for the simple fact that there are so many of them and they are affordable.

Sailboat Reviews of Offshore Cruising Yachts : Bluewaterboats.org

As we have sailed most of the way around the world (East Coast to South Africa) I have seen virtually no Catalinas. Not saying that they are bad boats, just that people are not choosing them. The most common make we have seen is Amel, interesting considering how expensive they are. What is most remarkable is how many different kinds of boats you see.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by carstenb

Yes well, really - I mean a force 11 storm in a 27 footer? And you think others will need to kiss their arse arrivederci? Better pucker up yourself.

I'm curious why he's got a drogue out... full keelers heave to beautifully... and 50-60 aint that bad... unless its against a dominant current in which case it'd do you no good.. a drogue I mean..

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by AiniA

As we have sailed most of the way around the world (East Coast to South Africa) I have seen virtually no Catalinas. Not saying that they are bad boats, just that people are not choosing them. The most common make we have seen is Amel, interesting considering how expensive they are. What is most remarkable is how many different kinds of boats you see.

You need to get out more. Hundreds of ordinary boats " out there "

Look at the boats on the ARC

Catalinas are fine boats , but American sailboats don't export well and US is proportionally a motor boat country. The main sailing centres in Greater Europe and down under are where to look to see what's what.

Amels are produced in such small numbers as to insignificant statistically

Dave

[Mike OReilly]

Well, all I can say is that I'm miffed. All those pretty lists, and my Rafiki-37 doesn't appear on any of them. Hmmm, maybe it isn't a bluewater boat ... damn! Guess I should have bought a Hunter after all

(kidding Don ... I'm just kidding).

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by boatman61

I'm curious why he's got a drogue out... full keelers heave to beautifully... and 50-60 aint that bad... unless its against a dominant current in which case it'd do you no good.. a drogue I mean..

I figured I'd just throw the drogue out with a lot of line and go below and get on Cruiser Forum to see whats up. That and maybe have my sardines and beer dinner.

Also, I've been out in 35 knots gust on my NACRA 6.0 where you couldn't even reef the main or lower the jib. All you could do was stay double trapped and keep sailing. (or flip it and sit on the tramp between the hulls and nap)

[letsgetsailing3]

Originally Posted by AiniA

As we have sailed most of the way around the world (East Coast to South Africa) I have seen virtually no Catalinas. Not saying that they are bad boats, just that people are not choosing them. The most common make we have seen is Amel, interesting considering how expensive they are. What is most remarkable is how many different kinds of boats you see.

This probably tells more about what you noticed than what you saw. In other words, it's probably not all that scientific a poll. We're all susceptible to our own perceptions.