Mah mah mah mah myyy carona (my experience with it and some thoughts)

[jstrru402]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

And what I think is that believing that Russia and China are less able than any other state is a sure sign of communist-phobia.

let us not forget that this all started (supposedly) because some medical expert in China convinced someone centuries ago that eating bats was a good idea, and to this day people still believe it.

where do China and Russia rate on pharmaceutical innovation? 49th and 51st, respectively. enjoy your "vaccine"

[Westcliffe01]

Please, neither Russia, nor China have ever given a crap about sacrificing millions of lives for the sake of their political goals. The American government may not give a crap either but the voters do which is why military engagement only goes so far with the US.


Go and take a look at life in Cuba, or China from the perspective of a Chinese before extolling the virtues of these dictatorships where you dissapear forever if you express the slightest criticism of the regime.

Originally Posted by barnakiel

And what I think is that believing that Russia and China are less able than any other state is a sure sign of communist-phobia.


But communist-phobia did not stop Russia from placing the first artificial satellite in space and the first human in space. Nor did it stop China from becoming the biggest country in the world by PPP and second by net GDP.



Russia and China have outstanding bio-hazard (weapons) record.Matched only by Israel and the US.


Who has best bio weapons laboratories, has best bio-hazard scientists and know-how. Hence the ability to provide anti-viral and anti-bacterial solutions.


You are, imho, 100% correct about how effective the vacc may be given our abysmal record with HIV vacc. But we do have some form of flu vacc by now, so hopefully the Covid one will be at least that much effective (=somewhat effective).



It is better to have something and not use it than to have nothing.



b.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by jstrru402

this is comical and wishful thinking. reality is that Russia's vaccine probably shouldn't be trusted and China copied Russia's, since all they can do is steal things and try to copy them, often to disastrous results.

Have you gotten your China/Russia vaccine yet? why not?

No. China did not copy the Russian vacc. They are based in different science. Why do you think they copied? Where did you read about it. Pls share the source.


I have read about both in the Guardian and they seem to be talking of different attitudes. The Russian one being similar to the one developed in Australia. But I do not think Russia could copy from Australia either, these two countries seem to have no scientific links at all.

I am not sure why you go personal and ask if I have had it and why not. It is pretty clear no vaccs are available in trade yet, one has been approved by the Med authorities (Russia) and is now in the production pipeline, to be available (in small lots) possibly at the end of September.


The other (China) has just been patented. Not even in pre-production yet.


I think you may like to read deeper on how the process from patent to production to availability looks. This is quite some time that goes into large scale availability - most often +6 months to build up, and then further 6 months to crank out and distribute.


Most of the time what I am reading here seems to suggest there is no vaccine avaialble globally before spring 2021. No matter who makes it - uncle Ivan or uncle Sam.


And since you are so eager on the personal note: I have already tested for Covid. It turns out I do not need to worry. Tell yourself the rest of the story.

Cheers,
b.

[jstrru402]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

No. China did not copy the Russian vacc. They are based in different science. Why do you think they copied? Where did you read about it. Pls share the source.

that was meant more as a general comment that China often cheats and steals, which results in missed details and cut-rate production.

nothing was personal. I would've just assumed the Russian vaccine was available since their elite have received vaccinations. never mind your own words:

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Meanwhile elsewhere, Russia and China have vaccines already. Ahead of such 'developed nations' as US and EU.

do you think there needs to be a direct link between international industries for espionage to occur? the idea that something may be stolen implies that it was taken without permission or knowledge.

[DreamBig]

China would have never released the virus if it didn't have a antivirus already. That's how the globalists were vaccinated early on, like these reporters. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/ne...accinated.html

https://youtu.be/sMLNbLohcMM this explains the time line best.

This was an act of war on the world, someone is trying to bully the world into a New world order. Just like Sars and need were test runs.

Ask yourself why is no one holding China responsible for this? This should ruin China, they should be held accountable to the world and pay damages to every country they affected.

This would in turn possibly open up the door to go after people like Soros or Gates and expose the crazy nutjobs they actually are.
https://youtu.be/oOrjS3YYac0

One last thing, do some research on bill Gates dad and it will turn up information that wouldn't be too far fetched for the Gates foundation to part of the virus and vaccine industries. Couple that with a person that thinks there are too many people in the world, and it could be a recipe for disaster. Food for thought.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

Please, neither Russia, nor China have ever given a crap about sacrificing millions of lives for the sake of their political goals. The American government may not give a crap either but the voters do which is why military engagement only goes so far with the US.

Go and take a look at life in Cuba, or China from the perspective of a Chinese before extolling the virtues of these dictatorships where you dissapear forever if you express the slightest criticism of the regime.

That a place is a regime does not imply a place is incapable of providing a vaccine.


barnakiel

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by jstrru402

that was meant more as a general comment that China often cheats and steals, which results in missed details and cut-rate production.


(...)

do you think there needs to be a direct link between international industries for espionage to occur? the idea that something may be stolen implies that it was taken without permission or knowledge.

Well. Stealing (know-how, ideas, etc.) is not something new. And not related to being in China or elsewhere. Think of how Japan developed the best cameras in the world. We do not see many Western consumers today showing any pangs when buying a Sony, a Nikon or a Canon.



Same thing applies to any nation. The most powerful ones have best espionage networks too. This should be expected. Satellites, bribes, etc., it all costs big money.



I am absolutely with you on espionage being well and kicking. How could we expect that in the singular case of Covid, gravity laws got suspended? I am sure everybody is watching everybody else. It is a big race for big money. Economies may go in smoke with the Covid (Japan down by 27%, UK by 30%) but vaccinations will sell like freshly baked bread.


We will very soon see if the Russian vaccine makes any difference - the fall is nearly here and we are expecting a huge surge of cases. As they say the proof of the pudding is ...


b.

[atoll]

Originally Posted by DreamBig

China would have never released the virus if it didn't have a antivirus already. That's how the globalists were vaccinated early on, like these reporters. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/ne...accinated.html

https://youtu.be/sMLNbLohcMM this explains the time line best.

This was an act of war on the world, someone is trying to bully the world into a New world order. Just like Sars and need were test runs.

Ask yourself why is no one holding China responsible for this? This should ruin China, they should be held accountable to the world and pay damages to every country they affected.

This would in turn possibly open up the door to go after people like Soros or Gates and expose the crazy nutjobs they actually are.
https://youtu.be/oOrjS3YYac0

One last thing, do some research on bill Gates dad and it will turn up information that wouldn't be too far fetched for the Gates foundation to part of the virus and vaccine industries. Couple that with a person that thinks there are too many people in the world, and it could be a recipe for disaster. Food for thought.

dam, just when i thought it was safe to go out
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...out-90049.html

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

And what I think is that believing that Russia and China are less able than any other state is a sure sign of communist-phobia.


But communist-phobia did not stop Russia from placing the first artificial satellite in space and the first human in space. Nor did it stop China from becoming the biggest country in the world by PPP and second by net GDP.



Russia and China have outstanding bio-hazard (weapons) record.Matched only by Israel and the US.


Who has best bio weapons laboratories, has best bio-hazard scientists and know-how. Hence the ability to provide anti-viral and anti-bacterial solutions.


You are, imho, 100% correct about how effective the vacc may be given our abysmal record with HIV vacc. But we do have some form of flu vacc by now, so hopefully the Covid one will be at least that much effective (=somewhat effective).



It is better to have something and not use it than to have nothing.



b.

I was about to write similar. Part of our downfall is our arrogance, China and Russia cant be as capable or even better at things than us?, they're the bad guys right?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by jstrru402

that was meant more as a general comment that China often cheats and steals, which results in missed details and cut-rate production.

nothing was personal. I would've just assumed the Russian vaccine was available since their elite have received vaccinations. never mind your own words:



do you think there needs to be a direct link between international industries for espionage to occur? the idea that something may be stolen implies that it was taken without permission or knowledge.

Tbe US dosent cheat and steal?

[jstrru402]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Tbe US dosent cheat and steal?

did I say that? does Chinese innovation rely on intellectual property theft more than that of the US? yes.

[JPA Cate]

This thread has been closed, per the community rules, as the discussion has nothing to do with sailing or cruising, which is the subject of Cruisers Forum.

JPA Cate