Battery Monitor Comparison - Victron BMV712 vs Balmar SG200

[MooGroc]

I was hoping to see some people report success with the SG200 in this thread even if there are clearly some customers that aren't happy.


No success stories?

[nickvh]

Have you looked at simarine, i installed this on four banks last year with shunts etc and after sorting out install errors I am very pleased with the single point monitor for everything.

[captNordy]

I have been cruising full-time with both units for the past 1.5yrs. Both have shown the same data with little fluctuation, so I'd say they are very similar as far as accuracy. I use the Victron to interface with my other Victron devices to serve as a cutoff indicator. However, I never look at it as the Balmar unit is much easier to see at a distance.

For those seeing the Balmar SOC fluctuate, mine does that if I disconnect the batteries and then re-connect. It takes a full charge cycle for it to get back in-line, so not a problem.

[skipgundlach]

This thread makes me very nervous.

I have both a coulomb counter (TriMetric 2030) and the original Balmar Smartgauge.

They don't agree much but by aggressively fully charging and then equalizing as much as possible (I have not babysat my solar and Xantrex 2000XC to have it constantly equalizing once 'full'); the result was what appeared to be dead batteries (4x Trojan L16H-AC, 435AH @6VDC) now appear to be healthy, based on a SGR, after charging and equalizing, of nearly 1.300; the lowest cell was a temperature compensated 1.279, and most were in the 1.290 range. The level of agreement on SOC also improved markedly over the 2 or so months of this aggressive charging.

However, a qualified marine electrician urged me to get the newest Balmar (he was the reason I got the SmartGauge), and, I in my ennui with all that has happened in my battery world, have asked him to do the installation while I'm on the road visiting grandchildren.

Yet, reading the above makes me nervous. I have no doubt it will be correctly installed. But I now wonder if it's just another expensive but largely useless piece of gear I've bought to try to avoid an early death on a bank which is well into 4 figure$, never mind 500 pounds over a 17" box and out over an engine to remove and the reverse to reinstall.

Oy.

[StupidMonkey]

Originally Posted by Phyrcooler

Uh. What...? I didn’t say anything about showing SOC.

I was actually talking about battery health and what someone initially plugs into a battery monitor program for their bank size. If they just plug in their when-new battery capacity, and actually have old batteries, they may be way off seeing 100% and thinking they have XX amps available to them.

And yes, I’ve read those threads until my eyes glazed over.

Regardless.... what I really want to know is if the Balmar works as advertised? Has it developed into a functional, reliable tool? Or is a Victron a better instrument, and I’m stuck having to test and computate to determine my batteries SOH?

I have been using my Smartgage while living aboard for a year now. It is a SOC gage, not a SOH gage. That said, it has some algorithem to adjust the SOC displayed, to reflect the SOH of your battery bank. It is not a window into the future. I paid really close attention for the first few months, as I installed it when replacing and enlarging my house bank. It's displayed SOC was fairly close to published SOC voltages for my batteries after I let them set for 20 min without a load on them. So it saves me 20 min everytime I check SOC and alarms when I am below 70%.

[StupidMonkey]

MooGroc

I like mine. I however, believe watts are like calories. You can count them all you like, but it doesn't mean squat once you step on the scale.

[lateral]

Originally Posted by Phyrcooler

I was actually talking about battery health and what someone initially plugs into a battery monitor program for their bank size. If they just plug in their when-new battery capacity, and actually have old batteries, they may be way off seeing 100% and thinking they have XX amps available to them.

And yes, I’ve read those threads until my eyes glazed over.

Regardless.... what I really want to know is if the Balmar works as advertised? Has it developed into a functional, reliable tool? Or is a Victron a better instrument, and I’m stuck having to test and computate to determine my batteries SOH?

I was told by Chris that no you didnt have to do a capacity test to config older batteries. It would figure it out.

For me, NO. To last question.

By process of elimination I'm altering one parameter at a time to see if i can
get it to present reasonable numbers.
For instance dropping to 76% with no load after being charged to 100% within a couple of days.

[rgleason]

I wish people would distinguish between the older Smartgauge by Merlin and the SG200. Otherwise some of these statements seem very ambiguous and can only be read that way.


Also I agree with lateral, "..didnt have to do a capacity test to config older batteries. It would figure it out." and it does for my T-105 FLA

[RickG]

Comment on the BMV-712, its algorithm is sensitive to the charged-voltage setting; if the voltage set too low it will sync to 100% early. With our 800ah Firefly house bank I have been tweaking the setting slowly. Setting charged-voltage too high meant the BMV never synced to 100%, even when tail current was low. Setting charged voltage too low mean the BMV synced to 100% while the tail current indicated that charge was still being accepted. My setting is now at 0.1V below float voltage and it seems to be tracking well. We are on a mooring in the Caribbean and with the usual cloud coverage the Victron solar controllers cycle through Bulk/Absorption/Float more than once a day.

Cheers, RickG

[Stu Jackson]

Thanks, Rick.


Another way of saying "premature float" covered in these recurringly posted links:


For everyone installing a battery monitor: The "Gotcha Algorithm" thread, a "MUST READ"

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4922.0.html

DEFAULTS are factory settings that are made to be modified to suit your setup.

Also read this one:

Programming a Battery Monitor (by Maine Sail)

https://marinehowto.com/programming-a-battery-monitor/

[AlanT]

Originally Posted by Ostinato

Does anyone have experience with both the Victron BMV712 and Balmar SG200? I have currently have the Balmar SG200 but need to buy a second one for a different installation.

For me, the key measurement is the State of Charge (SOC) and so I want to know if the Victron can provide the same measurement as accurately as the Balmar. A buddy of mine has the Victron but I couldn't determine if it measures the same attribute or as well, in part, because he didn't have a load on his batteries.

I know the Victron is a little less expensive but if can't measure the SOC accurately then it won't do what I need. I've also used the Blues Seas monitor but that doesn't does provide an SOC and I might as well just have a multimeter.

I have had installed and like the Victron. I had the Balmar on a previous boat and planned to repeat with same but my electrician convinced me that the Victron's attributes made it better. Yes it monitors SOC. It is also hooked up to the VRM which I just checked on my iphone as I was typing this . I am 1,300 miles away from my boat so its nice to know that batteries are at 100%. DCV is 27.3v and current load is 33W. Connectivity is king! ~A

[RickG]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Thanks, Rick.


Another way of saying "premature float" covered in these recurringly posted links:


For everyone installing a battery monitor: The "Gotcha Algorithm" thread, a "MUST READ"

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4922.0.html

DEFAULTS are factory settings that are made to be modified to suit your setup.

Also read this one:

Programming a Battery Monitor (by Maine Sail)

https://marinehowto.com/programming-a-battery-monitor/

Not premature float as the solar chargers are still performing as expected. You just need to get the BMV tuned so that its algorithm is as close to reality as possible. I agree, MainSail's articles were a huge help in getting as close as possible. Still fine tuning with very small adjustments.

Cheers, RickG

[sailorboy1]

I have had a BMV600 (maybe a 60x as i don't remember) now over 10 years. It has seen 2 sets of golf cart banks and now a set of FireFly. I am VERY with it. Maybe i don't take the SOC reading too serious. If it says 78% i an ok the might really be 75% or 81%. I have it setup so it rarely resets to 100% and if I could would even turn down the tail amps more. I really don't have an issue if wants to tell me SOC is98-99% when it really is 100% as long it doesn't go the other way and start telling me 100% when it is 95%. And unlike the SG200 magic box I at least know the parameter my bmv is using.

Why do we make it so hard other than sport and entertainment.

[two-rocks]

Bought the SG200 when it was new...it was not perfect. Added the Bluetooth dongle for the ability to update firmware. Been good/great since then.

Have many Victron parts onboard (smart solar x 4, inverter, orion dc-dc, battery dongle for temp/voltage - all with Bluetooth). It was not normal to add the SG200 to the mix with all my victron gear (good stuff!), but the display looked better than the 90's Victron. Purchased when we had lead acid batteries and 'worried' way too much about keeping them topped up.

We put LFE in a couple years ago, and life is much better. The SG200 works great with them - I guess? - constantly shows high 98-99 SOH and the state of charge seems very accurate. That said, I no longer care about partial SOC or depth of discharge - really just use it to judge when the solar might not be able to keep up.

[Bycrick]

I’ve had three Victron 70x over 20+ years. They tell me volts accurately compared to my Fluke meter. The tell me amps accurately compared to my Fluke meter. They’ll tell me how many Ah I’ve used over a period, as accurately as I can check. The first died in a lightning strike. The second inexplicably went out of calibration and read off by 0.4 v. I caught it because I check with my good meter frequently. Instantly replaced by Victron even though well out of warranty. Third one has been there for 10 years. I wouldn’t think of trying to get state of charge to work right. I can guess as well as they do.

I bought the original SmartGauge mostly out of curiosity. It was OK for accuracy +/- 10% of my guesses, but didn’t add a whole lot of useful information. It seems to have gone south recently and I’ve left it in place rather than fill the hole in the panel with something else. I won’t replace it.

The new SG200 seems to me to be overly complicated just to have SOH/SOC computations, even if they worked right all the time. I don’t want to spend hours/days/weeks messing with parameters or software updates. My system isn’t complicated enough to justify multiple shunts, etc.

YMMV.