380: lagoon 380 issues scaring me

[lucaneptun]

Hi there, j'm a beginner , j plan to buy one and sail in caribbean.
what worries me are:
-sail drives : how often do they need care and major works? volvo better than yanmar? straight shaft rare on the market?
-safe hatches: lewmar and gojot can be fixed properly once for all?

thank you all
luca

[tkeithlu]

Welcome to the forum, Luca. I'll leave it for an owner to approach your questions.

[barnab]

Hi Luca


We have a Leopard 38, not a Lagoon, but here's my view:


If you want a catamaran, there is no way around saildrives, you have to live with it (There are very old cats with shaft drives, new I only know Antares, but if you could afford an Antares you would probably not be looking at Lagoon 38). Saildrives are not soooooo bad, I just recommend changing the seals annually, even if that means a haulout. Also, look into installing oil header tanks so worst case the oil goes out and not water in.



Regarding escape hatches: Fortunately the Leopards don't have them. Newer Lagoon have glasses laminated in and hammers in- and outside to break them. This is sure better than the hatches that are known to fail from time to time. Alternative: As some owners have done just laminate the escape hatches and rely on never needing them.


Adrian

[belizesailor]

The Lagoon 38 is a good boat, Ive sailed thousands of miles on them.

Sail drives are just the nature of most production cats. The drives are all built by ZD, but to Yanmar or Volvo specs. Some versions of the Yanmar drives are more problematic (google "cone clutch"). The Volvo design is very reliable. Ive done nothing, but routine maintenance to mine for 20 years now with zero issues.

Routine maintenance is just changing the oil, which can be done without a haul out via vaccum pump (the Yanmars are actually better set up for this than the Volvos), changing the shaft seal as needed (haul out required), and changing the zincs (can be done in water).

Sail drives are very expensive to repair if they fail, but they are generally very reliable.

You do need be expecially cautious about galvanic corrossion with SDs too.

"Escape" hatches. I dislike these on all boats that have them. Ive never even heard of them being used for "escape" but I have seen them swamp many boats. I especially dont like them on the L38 because the are just a sheet of tempered glass very close to the water line. If that gets broken underway you are in deep doo doo. They are only in the aft cabin too, so I guess only those in the aft cabin get to "escape". This is also the part of the boat most likely to be underwater if inverted due to the additional weight carried aft...esp on a fully loaded cruising boat. Total dumbass marketting gimmick IMO. My suggestion: fiberglass in that big dangerous hole in the boat.

For an Atlantic crossing on a L38 a few years ago, we made up 1/2" plywood dead eyes for those silly escape hatches and for the big cabin side windows.

[lucaneptun]

thank you, very much appreciated, any lagoon 380 owner willing to share?
thanks

[JasonS]

We own our Manta 40 for 9 years. Volvo D1-30 with sail drives. No sail drive issues. We change the zincs regularly and dive and clean. Bottom paint every 20-24 months. The questions you have aren’t specific to Lagoon. You’ll pretty much find that all the major cat builders use Volvo or Yanmar. And yes, engine parts are ridiculously expensive. Add exhaust elbows to your list. Recommend changing them out to stainless steel to reduce the clogging and corrosion issues with the stock cast steel ones. Good luck with your search!

[RobinHood]

Hi.
I have a BabyLagoon from 2006.
As described above, the Volvo Saildrive is very reliable. The sealing at the propeller shaft has to be replaced in case of of water in Saildrive.( Mayonaise)
The upper sealing is lifetime save. Replace if you see cracks. Not before. If anybody gives you other advice, ask him if he knows the design. Surly he doesn't know. Escape hatches have a problem if they are newer version. They can fall out..my hatches are safe and sealed. Nobody is allowed to open them except the captain.
We made a very nice Atlantic crossing with our boat and are now since two years in the Caribbean.

[facciatosta]

About 9 years ago in Europe we chartered monohull with Volvo with the sail drive. It was relatively new boat. One day battery could not crank the starter. After some investigation we found out that the top bolts fixing sail drive to the motor were loosed and laying on the floor.The top part of the sail drive was about half inch away from the motor. The motor flange did not have through holes but rather dead end threaded holes. Engine itself was made from some kind aluminum alloy. I am not a mechanical engineer but my theory is that since axis of the shaft was located below the axis of the motor then when in forward motion it pushes bottom part forward and it causes to push top part of the drive backward. Not sure if engine was maintained properly. It was in in Sicily. The 17 years old "expert" told us we must have hit something. The divers found nothing. They got is other boat.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by facciatosta

About 9 years ago in Europe we chartered monohull with Volvo with the sail drive. It was relatively new boat. One day battery could not crank the starter. After some investigation we found out that the top bolts fixing sail drive to the motor were loosed and laying on the floor.The top part of the sail drive was about half inch away from the motor. The motor flange did not have through holes but rather dead end threaded holes. Engine itself was made from some kind aluminum alloy. I am not a mechanical engineer but my theory is that since axis of the shaft was located below the axis of the motor then when in forward motion it pushes bottom part forward and it causes to push top part of the drive backward. Not sure if engine was maintained properly. It was in in Sicily. The 17 years old "expert" told us we must have hit something. The divers found nothing. They got is other boat.

No Volvo marine diesels I'm aware of have ever been made of aluminum. Heck I'd be interested to know if any marine diesels ever have been made of aluminum alloy?

[facciatosta]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

No Volvo marine diesels I'm aware of have ever been made of aluminum. Heck I'd be interested to know if any marine diesels ever have been made of aluminum alloy?

I do not have time to upload pictures now. Maybe later. I revise my post. It were threaded bushings compressed into engine block. Eventually some bushings got pulled out and in some bolts got loosed. The number on the engine block is U10447391 whatever it means

[facciatosta]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

No Volvo marine diesels I'm aware of have ever been made of aluminum. Heck I'd be interested to know if any marine diesels ever have been made of aluminum alloy?

It looked like an aluminum alloy to me. I could be wrong.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by facciatosta

It looked like an aluminum alloy to me. I could be wrong.

The silver parts in the picture are the top of the saildrive. They are often aluminum. The green parts are the engine. They're always all steel with Volvo Penta diesels as far as I know. Aluminum blocks for land transport diesels are just now hitting regular mainstream and we're always quite a bit behind in boat world. Bottom line is that what you described isn't common and probably isn't a design flaw but more likely just poor maintenance. The engine puts out it's thrust inline, the 90 degree direction change happens in the saildrive gearbox and generally you have a better drive line angle with a saildrive because it's gearbox is bolted directly to the engine with not much shaft to go out of alignment.

[facciatosta]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

The silver parts in the picture are the top of the saildrive. They are often aluminum. The green parts are the engine. They're always all steel with Volvo Penta diesels as far as I know. Aluminum blocks for land transport diesels are just now hitting regular mainstream and we're always quite a bit behind in boat world. Bottom line is that what you described isn't common and probably isn't a design flaw but more likely just poor maintenance. The engine puts out it's thrust inline, the 90 degree direction change happens in the saildrive gearbox and generally you have a better drive line angle with a saildrive because it's gearbox is bolted directly to the engine with not much shaft to go out of alignment.

I cannot comment on the materials but to me it seems a design flaw. How maintenance could prevent those anchor plugs from falling out. It couldn't. You tighten the bolt and exerts pulling force on the plug then vibration finishes the job.

[MikeTC]

Hi Luke

Welcome

We have an 2004 L380 and been living aboard for 7 years. 7000 miles inc off shore.

The L380 has been excellent value for money. I have replaced both sail drives, one from fear of a perceived bad noise and the other because the top seal failed twice. Figured it best to replace than repair.

The escape hatches have been inspected professionally and cleaned periodically. No problems there.

The boat has cost around AUD 17k on average to maintain. Major expenses being new sail-drives, fridge, total antifoul removal, new spinnaker and AIS. I have done most of the other maintenance.

Hope this helps.

Mike

[rabbi]

Originally Posted by RobinHood

The upper sealing is lifetime save. Replace if you see cracks. Not before. If anybody gives you other advice, ask him if he knows the design. Surly he doesn't know.

Bold statement.


The insurance company will likely follow the manufacturer's recommendation instead of some internet advice.
Volvo / Yanmar give it a 5 / 7 year lifespan.


Yanmar uses dual seals but the upper "seal" is just a thin rubber held in place by a little steel band and easily pulls off. This is just a last resort in case the main seal fails.
This design makes it impossible to check for cracks in the main seal.
How exactly do you inspect for cracks from below with all the marine life growing on the rubber?


Volvo uses a single seal. Easier to inspect the top but no safety margin. Good luck in case you experience a leak on passage.


BTW: I know the design.