Choosing a gateway ?

[petit bateau]

I am trying to figure out what is the best pathway to take for a gateway between OpenCPN and a NMEA200 / STng network, and I'd appreciate advice and comments from those who have done this before.

I have not done this before. This is an old boat that is getting refreshed. The old instruments, plotter, were Raymarine S60 but have all died. The key instruments have been replaced with Raymarine STng gear. I am in the process of replacing the autopilot (a long story) and adding in a VHF/AIS/GPS per the system block diagram below.

I am reluctant to go down the Raymarine route for a plotter and so am minded to go with OpenCPN. Until now I have been happy with paper charts and an antique Android tablet running an equally antique Navionics chart. For now I have OpenCPN running on my daily laptop, but in due course there will be a dedicated ship/nav computer. Whether that is a Pi or a Win10 machine is a future decision but I mention it in case it is relevant.

So the next key decision is how to connect the STng (or perhaps NMEA2000) network to OpenCPN, and indeed anything else (future tank sensors, power system, etc).

In principle I think I can see four ways.

a) wired USB e.g. Yacht Devices YDNU-02
b) wired ethernet e.g. Yacht Devices YDEN-02 (price £175 inc VAT)
c) wireless, e.g. Actisense W2K-1 (price £210 inc VAT)
d) or
- CANbus adapter and TwoCan plugin on OpenCPN
- e.g. https://opencpn-manuals.github.io/ma...0.1/index.html
OEMS on this path include:
= Kvaser Leaflight HS v2
= Canable Contact
= Axiomtek AX92903
= Rusoku Toucan Marine

I have plenty of my own thoughts as to what might be the best way to do this, but I'd rather listen to what others have to say for now without putting my spin on things yet. I've been reading and watching OpenCPN forums such as this one over the years, and also Jon Hacking (SV Ocelot) has given me some helpful input. In fact he is the one who suggested I throw this question open to the whole community.

[Ryban]

I thought about rolling a DIY solution for this for a long time to save some money, but ended up just forking over the $$ for the Yacht Devices YDWG-02 gateway. It really couldn't be easier to setup and use.

I believe it should also work with SeaTalk NG, if you have the cable to connect your Seatalk devices to your NMEA2K backbone, but don't take my word on that.

[nohal]

Now that N2K over IP (call it Wi-Fi if you prefer) landed in the OpenCPN codebase, I would go wireless, Actisense or YD.
If something wired, any device supported by SocketCAN under Linux (I use CANable and CANable PRO)
STNG is NMEA2000, just non-standard connectors.

[bdbcat]

I concur with Nohal. Wireless YD or Actisense is the way to go forward.
I have tested both. No functional difference encountered. I prefer the Actisense mechanical packaging, but you may have other ideas.




Thanks
Dave

[wholybee]

Thirdly I agree. YD or Actisence wireless.
I have the YD.

Edit:
If the type to want to DIY something, there is an opensource Actisence clone based on an ESP32. I've not tried it, and no little about it.

[barcoMeCasa]

Originally Posted by petit bateau

.... Whether that is a Pi or a Win10 machine is a future decision but I mention it in case it is relevant.

So the next key decision is how to connect the STng (or perhaps NMEA2000) network to OpenCPN, and indeed anything else (future tank sensors, power system, etc).

This might be worth a look >>
https://shop.openmarine.net/home/23-macarthur-hat.html

Add a Pi4 & monitor.
Useful having thermometers attached to various bits of the engine/exhaust to keep an eye on things. Also the Pi4 running openplotter will take data from Victron bluetooth devices with no wires needed.

[champ8242]

Originally Posted by wholybee

Edit:
If the type to want to DIY something, there is an opensource Actisence clone based on an ESP32. I've not tried it, and no little about it.

Nothing DIY, productized! https://shop.hatlabs.fi/products/sh-wg
Just been looking at the HW and SW, looks real good.

Thanx for the tip!

[petit bateau]

Thank you everyone.

Given the feedback I'll go wireless.

In my case I'll likely go with the Actisense W2K-1 gateway.

Playing around with Pi's etc is not appropriate for me at the moment. My boat is 2,000 miles away from where I live. I might think differently if it was 10 miles away. It was interesting that none of you pushed the CANbus/TwoCan pathway.

Many thanks for all your thoughts, I'll see how it goes in due course.

Updated drawing is below for anyone else thinking this through.

[nohal]

TwoCAN plugin was essentially a workaround solution before OpenCPN supported NMEA2000 natively, there is not much reason for it nowadays, except maybe when you want to use SocketCAN compatible devices on Windows...

[mgrouch]

For NMEA 2000 you can build your own USB gateway
with m5stack atom

https://github.com/bareboat-necessit...-usb-gw-m5atom

[stevead]

TwoCAN plugin was essentially a workaround solution before OpenCPN supported NMEA2000 natively, there is not much reason for it nowadays, except maybe when you want to use SocketCAN compatible devices on Windows...

Them there are fighting words.....

TwoCan provided OpenCPN with NMEA 2000 support about three or four years before the OpenCPN developers were dragged kicking & screaming to support it natively.

TwoCan provides the following:

1. Bi-directional gateway between NMEA 2000 and NMEA 0183. The native support for NMEA 2000 in OpenCPN does not.
2. Supports a wide range of inexpensive CAN bus adapters on Windows & Mac. OpenCPN only supports Actisense & Yacht Devices adapters on Windows & Mac. Both support any adapter that supports SocketCAn on Linux.
3. Automagically detects the COM Port/TTY device for USB devices on Windows & Mac making it easier for end-users.
4. Logs and plays back data using several log formats including candump, canboat, Yacht Devices, Raymarine and PCAP (used by B&G)
5. Displays information about all NMEA 2000 devices on the network.
6. Decodes and encodes more NMEA2000 Parameter Group Numbers (PGN's) than OpenCPN. OpenCPN does not receive DSC alerts, MOB alerts or AIS Class B Extended Position Reports.
7. Import waypoints transmitted using PGN 130074 into OpenCPN.
8. Control B&G NAC-2/3 autopilots and Fusion Media players. Export waypoints to B&G MFD's, Change brightness & day night mode on Garmin, Raymarine and Navico (Simrad, B&G) instrument displays. (unannounced & unreleased enhancements)

I'll readily admit I've been busy on a few other projects and haven't updated TwoCan, as I should have, but it isn't dead yet.

I should add that elements of the TwoCan code base were appropriated by the OpenCPN developers, albeit without any attribution!

[petit bateau]

Originally Posted by stevead

Them there are fighting words.....

TwoCan provided OpenCPN with NMEA 2000 support about three or four years before the OpenCPN developers were dragged kicking & screaming to support it natively.

TwoCan provides the following:

1. Bi-directional gateway between NMEA 2000 and NMEA 0183. The native support for NMEA 2000 in OpenCPN does not.
2. Supports a wide range of inexpensive CAN bus adapters on Windows & Mac. OpenCPN only supports Actisense & Yacht Devices adapters on Windows & Mac. Both support any adapter that supports SocketCAn on Linux.
3. Automagically detects the COM Port/TTY device for USB devices on Windows & Mac making it easier for end-users.
4. Logs and plays back data using several log formats including candump, canboat, Yacht Devices, Raymarine and PCAP (used by B&G)
5. Displays information about all NMEA 2000 devices on the network.
6. Decodes and encodes more NMEA2000 Parameter Group Numbers (PGN's) than OpenCPN. OpenCPN does not receive DSC alerts, MOB alerts or AIS Class B Extended Position Reports.
7. Import waypoints transmitted using PGN 130074 into OpenCPN.
8. Control B&G NAC-2/3 autopilots and Fusion Media players. Export waypoints to B&G MFD's, Change brightness & day night mode on Garmin, Raymarine and Navico (Simrad, B&G) instrument displays. (unannounced & unreleased enhancements)

I'll readily admit I've been busy on a few other projects and haven't updated TwoCan, as I should have, but it isn't dead yet.

I should add that elements of the TwoCan code base were appropriated by the OpenCPN developers, albeit without any attribution!

Steve

Thank you.

I myself looked hard at TwoCan over the years but on this, my first go, could not bring myself to go that route. It would be hugely helpful to someone such as me if you could do a version of my idiots block diagram to show how the bits will all fit together for anybody going that way. (If you PM me I can share my ppt with you to make side-by-side comparison easier wen i/you/we post it).

Also I am still struggling to understand where the gotchas are in the pathway I have selected. You have I think one on the head, namely the matter of bidirectional comms and autopilots. What are the pros and cons of the options I have set out please.

[rgleason]

petit bateau You are approaching this the right way. I like your diagramming approach. I have not inspected it however this is the way to go.

You may be interested in this information.

I still have ST60 seatalk instruments. I got a Raymarine ST1/STng converter and used the ST1 Daisy chain connectors to connect to the one ST1 connection on the converter. I powered the converter with 12vdc as directed.

Then since STng is the same as Nmea2000 I took the loose end of the STng wire, cut it off and rewired with a Nmea2000 connector which now works on a nmea2000 network. The only real difference is the Raymarine plug is smaller so you don't have to drill as big a hole in stuff.

I will try to find the details.
However I like Pavel and Dave's suggestion.

PS: RE:

Quote:
TwoCAN plugin was essentially..
Them there are fighting words.....

Stevead I am very happy you have maintained your sense of humor. You've been instrumental in moving things forward there is no doubt about that. This entire project is supposed to be fun and a broad community effort, and I am certain that your plugin will continue to have great use for others. Remember that every person and boat is different.

[petit bateau]

Originally Posted by rgleason

petit bateau You are approaching this the right way. I like your diagramming approach. I have not inspected it however this is the way to go.

You may be interested in this information.

I still have ST60 seatalk instruments. I got a Raymarine ST1/STng converter and used the ST1 Daisy chain connectors to connect to the one ST1 connection on the converter. I powered the converter with 12vdc as directed.

Then since STng is the same as Nmea2000 I took the loose end of the STng wire, cut it off and rewired with a Nmea2000 connector which now works on a nmea2000 network. The only real difference is the Raymarine plug is smaller so you don't have to drill as big a hole in stuff.

I will try to find the details.
However I like Pavel and Dave's suggestion.

PS: RE:

Quote:
TwoCAN plugin was essentially..
Them there are fighting words.....

Stevead I am very happy you have maintained your sense of humor. You've been instrumental in moving things forward there is no doubt about that. This entire project is supposed to be fun and a broad community effort, and I am certain that your plugin will continue to have great use for others. Remember that every person and boat is different.

The updated diagram went AWOL for some reason. Here it is again,



Re ST60 I am afraid that almost everything in the boat's old ST60 instrument suite had died, the exception being (seemingly, but oddly) the autopilot. Well the autopilot had died, then we resuscitated it, and now we are unsure. Long story and in due course I will sell the old one with a full disclosure on its status. Hence switching to new kit.

[rgleason]

"... autopilot had died, then we resuscitated it, and now we are unsure.."
Our 1995 ST4000 Wheel filled with water from the cockpit twice. Took it apart and cleaned, dried and restored it. Still working. Raymarine AP and Fluxgate uses nmea013. I think a new AP is also in order.


Your STng <--> Nmea2000 connection can be wired carefully.