Long distance sailing in small yachts

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Well I am picking up a Sigma 33 here in Bangor, N Wales (just waiting for owner to show), supposed to be a fast strong boat so will let you know what I think when I get to Lanzarote in the Canary Islands..
Thats if you think 1700nm qualifies as long distance.

Why, yes, dear Phil, it is a longish distance. Sounds like a fun trip, if you pick a good weather window.

Ann

[peter loveridge]

Eric Hiscock's Wanderer 111 was less than 31 feet LOA and just over 8 feet beam, he went everywhere for decades in it

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by peter loveridge

Eric Hiscock's Wanderer 111 was less than 31 feet LOA and just over 8 feet beam, he went everywhere for decades in it

Yeah, but his boat had a displacement of around 7.2 tons which is quite unlike your average 30 footer.

Wanderer III - Classic Yacht Info

[Scout 30]

Originally Posted by peter loveridge

Eric Hiscock's Wanderer 111 was less than 31 feet LOA and just over 8 feet beam, he went everywhere for decades in it

Eric should never be mentioned without including Susan.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...k-1589058.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_RHHIV4u1k

[Sailor 99]

Originally Posted by wingssail

We too choose our passages for times when the winds are favorable. However we wind up going upwind surprisingly often. And in my experience most cruisers, except for ocean crossing passages, don't wait months for favorable winds, they turn on the engine, head out against the wind and waves if they need to, and call it motor sailing. Which, in my mind, isn't that pleasant either.

And, in fact, many, if not MOST cruisers wind up quitting in a rather short time after they commence their intended world circling journeys. They just don't find it that much fun. Not like the magazine photos of arm around their girl and a glass of wine in hand while gently sailing into the sunset.

But maybe if they had boats with good performance, and that includes big enough rigs, they might find that sailing IS fun, and going to windward successfully is more fun than bashing against the wind with the motor struggling.

Hear hear. When I was looking for the current boat the requirements were that it had to be sea kindly and fast. No way was I going to go out cruising in a slow boat. Sailing in a Bayfield 29 may still be sailing but it is not fun sailing and if you have to go up wind, well good luck under motor or sail.

I have no intentions of bashing into the wind and waves with the engine on. The boat would rather sail and so would I.

Big rigs are good. When you need the canvas you can always put it up and if needs be reef it down.


Horses for courses though. Some people are afraid of a large rig and for them its going to be a problem reefing all the time.

[picklesandjesse]

[QUOTE=Scout 30;2880396]Eric should never be mentioned without including Susan.

Met them once after their passage from NZ to Coffs Harbour in their last boat. It had major rudder problems. Susan could find anything on that boat in seconds, I'm pretty sure that in later years at least, that she was the more capable.

[JPA Cate]

Yes, Eric was a writer, Susan, a sailor!

Ann

[Painted Skies]

On the topic of sailing long distances in small yachts, my kudos go to a British couple we met in Mooloolaba who had sailed to Australia on their 24-ft boat "Summer Wind" along with 2 children, 2 dinghies, a cat and a hamster!

Not the greatest photo, but here is the evidence:

[Sojourner]

I think most of us who are old enough to buy a boat are old enough to understand ourselves enough to know the difference between what we need, what we want, what we can't live without, and what would be nice... just go sit under a tree with a coffee for a few hours and think about how you live on land. Then reason from there, backward, until you distill who you are and what it is you are looking for. Then take off them rosy shades and squint into the sun. Another hour online to get a grasp of what boat costs are vis a vis size differences....marinas, sails, haulouts. Then a look at your bank account to see if it matches your ideas. Simple stuff.

The one thing I disagree with a lot is buying a small, starter boat. If you do the above honestly, you'll know if you'll like it, so get what you need if you can afford it. For me, before our boat, I loved tinkering with old VWs, motorbikes, and old houses. I loved living in a VW for years at a time. I loved camping, camp cooking, fishing. I loved backpacking the world and didn't mind washing my clothes in a sink or not showering for a few days at a time. I loved living like this with my first wife and then my/our second, 24 hours a day. This is all apart from the obvious one of loving sailing and being on the water. In short, I knew if we relocated onto a sailboat, the CORRECT sailboat for our needs, we'd be just fine. A year and a half on, we're just exactly where we thought we'd all be. No, much better even than that...the only surprises were good ones.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Sojourner

I think most of us who are old enough to buy a boat are old enough to understand ourselves enough to know the difference between what we need, what we want, what we can't live without, and what would be nice... just go sit under a tree with a coffee for a few hours and think about how you live on land. Then reason from there, backward, until you distill who you are and what it is you are looking for. Then take off them rosy shades and squint into the sun. Another hour online to get a grasp of what boat costs are vis a vis size differences....marinas, sails, haulouts. Then a look at your bank account to see if it matches your ideas. Simple stuff.

The one thing I disagree with a lot is buying a small, starter boat. If you do the above honestly, you'll know if you'll like it, so get what you need if you can afford it.

Many of us though do not know whether we would like it or not so a lower priced starter boat is sometimes the perfect thing.

I bought a starter boat that is capable of crossing oceans, but I was a racer on very fast sailboats before that so I didn't know if I could adjust to slow boat sailing

But that was eight years ago (when I bought my starter boat) and now I found that I do sort of enjoy untying from the dock and leaving this area of almost 2 million and being out basically in the boonies in 4-5 hours of sailing

Plus my starter boat can handle most any weather and sea I have encountered so far. There's no need to own a big boat until you actually plan on cruising long distance I'm thinking unless you routinely sail with lots of crew

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Sojourner

I think most of us who are old enough to buy a boat are old enough to understand ourselves enough to know the difference between what we need, what we want, what we can't live without, and what would be nice... just go sit under a tree with a coffee for a few hours and think about how you live on land. Then reason from there, backward, until you distill who you are and what it is you are looking for. Then take off them rosy shades and squint into the sun. Another hour online to get a grasp of what boat costs are vis a vis size differences....marinas, sails, haulouts. Then a look at your bank account to see if it matches your ideas. Simple stuff.

The one thing I disagree with a lot is buying a small, starter boat. If you do the above honestly, you'll know if you'll like it, so get what you need if you can afford it. ...

By your own description, you’ve not only spent a lot of time thinking about your needs, you’ve also had a lot of actual applicable experience. And lets face it, yours is not the typical path in life . You’ve probably spent a lot more time and effort understanding who you are and what you need in life compared to most of of us.

While I think it is certainly possible for people to reason their way to the right answer for them, I’ve found that actual experience is the best teacher for most people. Which is why I recommend the small and inexpensive route.

But as I am fond of saying, there is no One Right Answer for everyone. Knowing thyself is key.

[Exile]

Speaking of the small & inexpensive route, I recently stumbled upon this youTube channel of a guy who has lived aboard for many years -- as well as circumnavigated -- on his 31' Gilmer(sp?), a gaff-rigged variant of a Hans Christian. And get this, he has done it solo and engineless! At first I thought the whole deal rather odd and not relevant to my own particular choices, but then I realized what extraordinary seamanship skills he possesses, along with the upside of having such a simple & inexpensive lifestyle. Not for everyone obviously (incl. me), but I found most of his videos most interesting, instructive, and inspiring.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTm...f_7nTLw/videos

[HappyGuy]

[QUOTE=Painted Skies;2880482]On the topic of sailing long distances in small yachts, my kudos go to a British couple we met in Mooloolaba who had sailed to Australia on their 24-ft boat "Summer Wind" along with 2 children, 2 dinghies, a cat and a hamster!

I say good on them. Their boat looks very practical. Great achievement!!

As I said in an earlier post - size has little bearing on seaworthiness, The important thing is good design and sound construction.

Almost two and a half years ago my son and his wife and their three boys aged 8yrs, 6yrs and baby 6 weeks old took the Sparkman and Stevens 24 foot yacht that I owned at the time cruising on the Queensland coast from Manly (Brisbane) as far north as Bundaberg and then out to Lady Musgrave Island north of Bundaberg and then back to Brisbane.
A fair proportion of their sailing was in open waters and they had a great time - with no issues.
Certainly it was a bit cramped - esp with having a young baby on board - but they coped well for the three months they were away.

In 2007 - Andrew Fagan - a New Zealand Rock Singer sailed his 18 foot plywood yacht "Swirly World" around NZ and down to the Auckland Islands at latitude 51 deg South - through the roaring forties and into the howling fifties. He encountered a force 10 gale and icebergs in the Southern Ocean.
He wrote of his voyage in a book titled "Swirly World Sails South"

Quite a few years before this he also sailed from Auckland to Raoul Island in the Kermadec group north of NZ and return.

Later on he did the Trans-Tasman yacht race from New Plymouth to Mooloolaba on the Queensland coast. Then he did a return voyage back to NZ, all in this boat - thus proving small boats can cross oceans safely if of good design, set up properly and the skipper is well experienced.

[curtis742]

I ran into a couple from Denmark while in Savannah who crossed in a 29 ft boat . See Uden bagkant mod horisonten – Et nyt liv på ryggen af S/Y Loa

[Seeking Solace]

Long distance sailing ins't cruising, luxury, or anything but sailing a long distance. Compound that with sailing in a small yacht. What's the difference between sailing a large vs small boat? It really depends on your personality almost entirely.

I can give my perspective of sailing a long distance in my Moody 27. Beyond that I couldn't say it was better or worse than any other boat on the planet. It doesn't like a following sea. It sails nice close to the wind. I prefer to move near hull speed over heeling hard and sailing fast. It holds 16 gallons of water and if you use the sinks for dishes you won't have any to drink. There is no windlass so pulling up the anchor sucks, period. If it's high wind you're going to have to either balance motoring toward the anchor while pulling it up or waiting for it to die down.

You can be 1 foot outside of cell service and have no comms without a VHF or HF radio. The ocean is bigger than you and all the planning in the world doesn't mean squat. If you want to be a sailor you had better have the ability to turn an aluminum can into about anything you can think of, including a hinge pin. It's hard to cook in rolling seas. If the idea of a swell that is taller than the mast makes you afraid, buy an RV. They are always bigger in the dark. Auto tiller? What auto tiller. You can't trust it and you sure as heck better not think you can trust your GPS, cellphone, tablet, autopilot, vhf, rigging, engine, or anything else. There's not enough room for spares of everything.

Even on a 100' yacht you're going to get wet sometimes. We live on a planet mostly covered with water. At 27 feet there are vast areas that my boat can't go because although it's miles across it's only a few feet deep. Docks are for people who live in houses and don't want to check on the boat everyday. If you stay at a dock the wind will never go into the hatches. A/C is a major luxury. So is ice, fresh water, pumping out, and having gas to cook. A guitar will always need strings.

The more things that break, the better you will be able to fix the systems on your boat. That is if you fix things yourself. If you like headroom and you're over 5' 10" you should again buy and RV. You're never rich enough to be important to a marina. If you live aboard and own a car the car is always a security concern. Thieves will steal your outboard, your tender, paddles, even sunscreen. You need a bag dedicated to shampoo, soaps, and toiletries wherever you go or you will soon find you have none of those things.

No matter what size your boat if you sail in open ocean you will soon find that the world is smaller than you realized. You will see amazing things you can't explain. You will be humbled by the power of the sea and it's inhabitants. There's always something bigger out there. There's danger everywhere, more so in your apartment.

If you buy what you can afford you will find yourself lacking and likely cramped. If you don't have to fix it you are making a mistake. If it has to be new you are far too rich to enjoy sailing. If you're sensitive to smells you had better be cleaning non-stop.

How fast you get there is not something you can calculate with ratings or weather planning, much less racing handicaps. It is luck pure and simple. Just like the possibility you can lose everything in a moment on land you can watch your life slip below the sea. Know it's a possibility and go on living knowing that you can always replace a boat and possessions.

2 foot to 100 foot, doesn't matter. Don't spend your life planning and never leaving the marina. Set goals, know your limits. Then try your best to forget you have limits and do the things that are hard because you will quickly find that they are possible.

I'm guessing I'm close to 3000NM of sailing in two years. Only one long passage (1703NM). I don't miss electricity, television, and get seasick when I'm on the land now. I've been living on the boat since January. I prefer being at anchor over the dock by far.

If you're at the helm there is plenty of headroom.