Is it too early to upgrade?

[Mountainbiker]

Was considering a Bene 423 and started to look around few weeks ago.

Background: We (my wife and I) are somewhat new to sailing. We took our ASA101 and 103 last winter, and then bought a Catalina 30 last spring and have about 80 hrs of sailing on it this season. The initial plan was to hold onto the C30 for a few years and then “move up". I do like the C30 and we bought it as a learning boat and to make sure my wife and I wanted to commit to sailing. We are certainly sold on wanting a boat and spending significant time on it.

Goal: In (+-) 5 yrs, take a leave from Work for a few months (hopefully more) and leave New England for a sail to Guadeloupe (having been French when I was young). Dream: When we retire or hit the jackpot, Atlantic crossing to sail Northern Euro (Ireland, Scotland, Faroe, Norway, Sweden) countries and then the Pays Basque and Portugal.

I am now "thinking" about a much earlier upgrade than initially planned. Boats obviously take a lot work. I don't mind it (and still have sooo much to learn), but would rather spend that time on a boat and systems that I am going to keep. Boats take a lot of money (duh!): I didn't quite realize how much... Again, would rather spend that on a boat I am going to keep. A C30 will only be worth so much regardless of what you replace/add to it (ie: will have to eventually replace the head, the hoses, the steering quadrant, the lines, the furler, adding a bimini, new bow roller for new anchor, more chain, new prop, etc) so don't want to to turn the C30 into a hole of no return.

Initial dream boat was a center cockpit boat but are now realizing ease of getting around is pretty important to both us (winch location, getting around the help, sugarscoop, companion way, etc...), as is having a berth w/ a hatch right over us (she gets hot and I am terrible sleeper so watching the starts rock back and forth is awesome). Though if I could find a Taswell 43 or a Contest 44 or even 43, on the East US coast, I would buy that instantly.

The 473 from the seat of the interweb looked like a great boat but having looked at a 461, it’s just way too big and will end being way too much boat (even w/ lots more experience) and out of our budget (especially with marina cost going up). We recently had the chance of going on a 2004 423 (double berth) at the dock and really like it. Would have preferred a double helm but cockpit space seemed otherwise good and quality for a Bene looked great (more storage for clothing would be nice!). Looked at Sun Odyssey 42DS this weekend and though the cockpit was great, we really didn’t like the rest of the boat.

Anyways, (sorry to drone on) I now find myself of two minds and totally torn: On one side, I worry that moving to a 42 ft boat is too big of a leap this early, especially the part where we are on a mooring ball and have only docked the C30 a few times, and it will be also too big of a boat to manage: you can’t control all the variables and s**t is going to happen that you are not ready for, even when you have tried hard to account or prepare for it ahead of time!. Also, now is not the time to buy a big boat as the market is inflated.

On the other hand, other than docking (though it has a bow thruster), the bene would actually be much more of a predicable boat even though it will be/feel bigger. The C30 felt huge on our first few sails but we got used to it. As mentioned I would much rather spend this winter time and money on a boat I am going to keep “forever”. Now to make matters worse, a 423 is now listed for sale 15 mins from our home and looks to priced very right, in good condition, w/ most of the extras we were looking for on boat.

So, is God testing me with temptation I should resist, or am I being offered a gift?

[sailormed]

NO!
What you are feeling as the best approach is exactly how I proceeded with my first cabin cruiser. I sailed a lot of small boats but no longer sailed since I was in my twenties.
I decided to buy a boat to sail the med and was looking for something around 10m overall. On this forum the “general advice” is to start small and buy a bigger boat once you are experienced.
I bought a 38ft Hunter that ticked all the boxes when I was 65, although I only sailed dinghies.
The beginning was hard, especilly the med mooring and harbour in/out manoevres. Take it slowly&cautiously and you will get there.
But now 12 years later I have a boat with a LOT of upgrades that I know every bolt and screw of and all the mistakes the yard people made back in 2004.

[Knotical]

I felt the same a year after buying our current boat, feel the same with cars too but I resist the temptation, I have started asking what can the current boat/car not do that I want the newer boat/car to do AT THIS TIME, I always decide to keep them, it has worked out well and we are still enjoying our boat 4 years out. Your C30 is perfectly capable of coastal cruising, take her out and go places, when you feel you are being restricted by it then get a new one.

Ultimately it comes down to - your money, your call!

[leecea]

I can't answer the question for you and I'm sure you'll get many helpful responses. Here are the things I'd think about...

First thing I think is to check that your insurance provider will be OK with the move to a bigger and more expensive boat.

If you are worried about close quarters you could see if there is a place to do ASA 118 on a 40ish footer. Try to find someone who uses a fin keel boat if that's what you plan to buy. We did 118 and found it useful.

A bow thruster makes life much easier.

The sails will be heavier and maybe harder to handle depending on your fitness. Is it a furling main? Does it have electric winches? Or you can buy a WinchRite which my wife uses when she wants help.

Many things will cost more for the bigger boat. Just do a reality check on your budget.

[svadagiomaine]

I bought a 28 footer thinking it would be 5 years but sold it 2 years later and went to a Beneteau 343. It felt big to me for about 2 hrs. You adjust quickly. And bigger feels safer and a lot more stable.

Just get the right tool for your needs at the time.

The only problem with selling and buying another boat quickly is if you put a bunch of money into the boat you are selling. You don’t recoup much of that. I put $30k into my Beneteau so if I sold that inside of a couple years I would have lost a bunch.

[Jammer]

::shrug:: People have sailed larger boats with less experience.


Money and time should inform your choice. The advice upthread to be sure of your insurance early, is good advice.


42' is on the large size for two people. Be sure you can find dockage. Be aware that physically handling the sails is a more athletic undertaking on this boat, either when bending them on or removing them for maintenance, repairs, or seasonal storage, or dealing with a tear or something at sea.


Enjoy the journey

[Pizzazz]

You want to buy your final boat as quickly as possible, exactly for the reason you mention. It takes a lot of work upgrading the systems, you get attached to the boat, you will not get anything for the upgraded systems in a resale... basically, it is a waste of time and money to be in a smaller boat that you want and can afford. My advice would be to upgrade now.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

You want to buy your final boat as quickly as possible, exactly for the reason you mention.

You also want to be careful not to spend $350,000 on the wrong boat.

[hlev00]

I tend to agree with others. Upgrading now does not sound too early. I own a 423 and love it. We have been making little upgrades all along and really know the boat, and have taken her on two trips to the Bahamas.

If you want to meet some other 423 owners online, there is a very active community on groups.io. It started as a yahoo group about the time of hull #1 and migrated to groups.io when yahoo shut down their groups service. https://beneteau423.groups.io/g/main/topics

Harry

[Brioche]

I think you are in the perfect spot. You have something you can sail in, you aren't under pressure, and you have the luxury of looking at other boats without a compulsion to get something immediately. That gives you a chance to find a boat you really like and that is also well priced. While you are kicking tires, so to speak, you also have a chance to try larger boats and decide what you like and what you don't like. If something perfect comes along, there is no reason to delay, but if not your ongoing search will be instructive. I have found that when I was under pressure to buy a boat, I never came out as well as when I could wait.

[letsgetsailing3]

Bigger boats have significantly bigger carrying costs. And who is to say that the next boat you buy will be the right one in 5 years?

Get the boat you need for your current use. The future will take care of itself.

[JPA Cate]

No one can tell you what to choose: people are so very different, and also, times have changed, and thoughts will vary, as well.

Our background: Jim went from his Yankee 30 to a PJ 36, that we lived aboard and cruised in from 1983 to 2003. Then we sold the PJ, and bought this boat, which we have also lived aboard and cruised, from 2003 to now. The biggest difference for me was with docking, in that if the wind were trying to blow the larger boat off, you'd better get the dock line around the cleat, RIGHT NOW, full turn, please. This boat has a lot more freeboard.

From what you wrote, I would advise waiting perhaps one more year, till you have come to have more confidence. Push your limits a bit with your present boat, and maintain her in good sailing shape, and put aside and save the money you might have spent on "improvements." Take your boat out in boisterous weather, and learn to handle her in heavy weather, and you will find some of your thinking changing.

You already have some fairly clear cut ideas of what you'd like to have, so keep your eyes out for exactly what you prefer. Prepare to move quickly if it becomes available.

You will find that with a larger boat, insurance and berthing costs will increase, and when you move aboard that liveaboard charges are often purely ridiculously high! Phone around and find out what your preferred 44 ft. boat's berths will cost in your area, find out about liveaboard fees. [For me, being slow to make decisions has generally come from not having enough knowledge yet. So I'm fixing you up to get experience/knowledge, and costs knowledge.]

Good luck with it. When it comes time, you'll find that cruising and living aboard is an interactive practice. What you experience changes you, and how you think about and do things. You'll see.

Ann

[Jim Cate]

Let me add this to Ann's good post above...

Keep the Cat 30 and sail her a lot, but DON'T make "improvements" for her, even though you just know that they would add performance or livability. This boat is a tool for you to use, not a project to complete. Do the necessary and routine maintenance , for these things will reduce depreciation and make reselling easier when the time comes.

The urge to improve is strong, but the costs will not be reflected in the price you eventually get for her a few years later. Use the tool and then pass her on to another newbie sailor at a reasonable price while you use your newly gained knowledge and experience to select your "forever" boat. And then improve to your heart's content, for at that point you may actually know what you are doing!

Good luck, and enjoy the process.

Jim

[Celestialsailor]

First...Welcome to the forum. You are doing it right with the C-30 and now looking for a more "robust" vessel and my opinion is a boat 38'-42' is about right for two. Not knowing your ages, that could change your parameters.

[admiralslater]

When asked I have always said get” the biggest boat you can aford” . I say this because changing boats is expensive. As for being inexperienced taking classes on your own boat is a great way to learn it . We live aboard three months a year in the Caribbean and many live aboard couples are on boats longer than 40 feet . As long as the boat is sound I say go for it