Being more positive on CF

[El Pinguino]

Oh Dear.... here we go again.......
South of the campo the speed limit is 100kph.... the road to the next town in that direction is steep and serpentine.... for much of it 50kph would be to fast...
In the opposite direction flat and mainly straight with little traffic... some local yokel doing 80kph would not be an issue...
Me? I drive to the conditions... EDIT.... while around here with the speed limiter set to 100kph... don't ask how i found that was a good idea...

But what really truly pisses me orf is cyclists.... the plicks in lycra that think they are in the tour de france.... those plicks are a curse upon the face of the earth. The barstewards now have pole position outside the local coffee shop..... where the cripple parking used to be.

Meanwhile... back on track... what ever happened to our resident CF speling and grama polis?

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

….1. Dingbat gets on the highway from the ON ramp with plenty of room to spare, little traffic ahead or coming, and promptly swerves into the left lane and stays at either just the speed limit or just below it.

2. Dingbat (same one or different oneS!!!) start to pass a truck on said two lane highway, and actually SLOWS DOWN while passing the truck, almost matching the truck speed - which is usually posted ten mph below the automobile speed limit - and stays there!!! And sometimes this happens when it's raining!!! Like that's normal for this neck of the woods.

Both are truly scary.

Thanks Stu, and I agree that slow moving traffic can be a hazard, especially given these scenarios. Left-lane hoggers are bad. It’s called the passing lane for a reason.

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

When discussing this, in combination with your comments on Southern Ontario, if you're on the QEW/Gardner Expressways there's no point is talking minimum limits let along maximum speed limits. Unless it's 04:00, there's too much traffic to do much more than a slow jogging pace!! The word expressway should NOT be used in combination with the QEQ or the Gardiner.

I used to live in London Jr. so would frequently have to drive to TO for business. I recall sitting in the parking lot called the QEW one Sunday afternoon, stewing about where the heck all these cars came from.

Originally Posted by RaymondR

Folks I'm gunna throw a spanner in the works.

The reason I drive 10-15 kilometres per hour below the speed limit is to lessen my contribution to global warming/climate change.

GAME ON .

Originally Posted by s/v Beth

I like being a grumpy old man. If I can save one person from going out in the Pacific NW above 40 Lat in a unprepared old sailboat then I have not wasted my time.
If they just think they know better, well at least I tried.

If they haven’t yet procreated, then I say let them follow their dreams. Let Darwin sort it out .

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

Folks I'm gunna throw a spanner in the works.

The reason I drive 10-15 kilometres per hour below the speed limit is to lessen my contribution to global warming/climate change.

Well-played, sir. It would indeed reduce your contribution.

Unfortunately, if it's a busy road, those behind you now have to start jockeying to pass, and the net contribution from all of you goes up. Plus the extra energy expended if an accident occurs.

Originally Posted by senormechanico

When they come to a turnout for slow vehicles, they stay in the fast lane and speed up until the slow lane ends.

Then they slow down again.

Agreed - that is supremely ignorant behaviour. Right up there with moving into the fast lane and just parking there.

And yes... Toronto's QEW, 401 and DVP are usually misery, and I live here. I avoid them during regular hours as much as possible. When travelling, we'll hit the road at 4 AM.

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by Sojourner

To the lovely human proud of driving a solid 15kph under the limit: Yes, this causes accidents. Yes, other people have to get to work, or doctor appointments, or home to their kids or wives. Do you even understand that public roads are SHARED RESOURCES? You do not own them, you do not control them. Just because you might not want to ever get where you are going doesn't mean all of us should suffer for your lack of enthusiasm. If someone speeds past you and you really want to be an ahem good samaritan, call their tag in to the cops, wait for them to stop laughing, and let the rest of us go about our day at the LEGAL speed limit.

Alright you organizational disaster.

The prudent option would be to go to bed at a reasonable time rather than staying up to watch reruns on TV until midnight and then you would not feel the need to sleep in and instead have a more relaxing breakfast and trip to work.

Similarly you could allow more time for the visit to the doctor and go straight home after work instead of hanging out in a bar with your mates after work.

Speed limits are set by the road transport authorities at their perception of the maximum speed the average motorist can manage to keep the accident rate within reasonable limits. All it takes to upset the system is one ducking, diving maniac wending their way through the traffic stream to disrupt the system and render it unsafe. The resulting wrecks are far more survivable at speeds lower than the limit. If the authorities were to redesign for worst case survive ability the limits would be significantly reduced.

[sailorboy1]

I'm POSITIVE that we should talk more about boating and not driving.

One thing that could be improved in the positive direction is:

When you post about a problem/issue etc. that you remember to come back and update the thread with what turned out to be the answer/solution. Yes than may be months of a year since the last post, but so what! Some really do use the search plus lots of the threads show up as the best match on google searches (I had one today from a google search and I even posted on 5 year old thread with how it worked out for me).

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

Alright you organizational disaster.

The prudent option would be to go to bed at a reasonable time rather than staying up to watch reruns on TV until midnight and then you would not feel the need to sleep in and instead have a more relaxing breakfast and trip to work.

Similarly you could allow more time for the visit to the doctor and go straight home after work instead of hanging out in a bar with your mates after work.

Speed limits are set by the road transport authorities at their perception of the maximum speed the average motorist can manage to keep the accident rate within reasonable limits. All it takes to upset the system is one ducking, diving maniac wending their way through the traffic stream to disrupt the system and render it unsafe. The resulting wrecks are far more survivable at speeds lower than the limit. If the authorities were to redesign for worst case survive ability the limits would be significantly reduced.

In fact, roads are engineered with maximum speed limits in mind. Naturally, the posted limits are always conservative, but the more people push beyond these rated limits, the smaller that the margin of error becomes.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

In fact, roads are engineered with maximum speed limits in mind. Naturally, the posted limits are always conservative, but the more people push beyond these rated limits, the smaller that the margin of error becomes.

The roads hereabouts were engineered before there were speed limits.... back in the days when all you had on the edge of town was a sign 'GRONG GRONG, Pop 11, Please Slow Down'

100kph is pretty much a blanket rural limit... regardless of whether the road is fit for 150k or 50k.... 'interesting bends' have precautionary signs.... very conservative but best heeded to some degree lest you find yourself being launched into the tree tops....

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

In fact, roads are engineered with maximum speed limits in mind. Naturally, the posted limits are always conservative, but the more people push beyond these rated limits, the smaller that the margin of error becomes.

Believe it or not but speed limits are often set based on observation of average speeds driven. Left to themselves the average driver will drive a safe speed.

[john61ct]

Yes, average people are hardly ever the problem, at least as individuals.

Although normal empathy really seems to take a nosedive while driving.

But a certain percentage certainly do get extraordinarily aggro, and they're the reason laws and cops become necessary

[AKA-None]

Something to think about, the intent of traffic or boating rules is to set expectations. If you don’t follow them then others don’t know what to expect from you. Would anyone take a ship in a seaway and go 2 knots when the traffic in the lane is going 6?
That’s like putting your wafi in front of a tanker and expecting the tanker to go as slow as your sailboat. Yet colregs say operate to reduce collisions and follow them so everyone knows what to expect. Driving to slow is just as bad as driving to fast. It screws up others expectations about what to do. Ymmv

[Sojourner]

Uhh, dear, I have no idea where anyone read that I prefer contributing to road accidents due to my poor planning and subsequent speeding... As I've mentioned a fair bit on cf, I owned and lived out of a 1977 VW bus. As for the holier than thou never even going the speed limit because they plan so well, a) I call BS. Or HS. Some kind of serious S. Doc was never late? Appointment never ran long? Family never got ill? And B) it's people like YOU who ruin the careful planning at the speed limit of others. I don't speed (couldn't speed in a VW if you tried). But ain't no one gonna regulate me on a public resource I also paid for when I'm acting legally.

[john61ct]

No one is criticising your driving.

Just responding to your criticism of those "holding you up."

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Believe it or not but speed limits are often set based on observation of average speeds driven. Left to themselves the average driver will drive a safe speed.

Yes, that is indeed one of the considerations when setting road speed limits. But there are many others, including the physical engineering parameters, weather and climate, volumes, and policy intent, just to name a few. That is why a posted speed limit is not something to be taken as mere suggestion.

Originally Posted by AKA-None

Something to think about, the intent of traffic or boating rules is to set expectations. If you don’t follow them then others don’t know what to expect from you. Would anyone take a ship in a seaway and go 2 knots when the traffic in the lane is going 6?
That’s like putting your wafi in front of a tanker and expecting the tanker to go as slow as your sailboat. Yet colregs say operate to reduce collisions and follow them so everyone knows what to expect. Driving to slow is just as bad as driving to fast. It screws up others expectations about what to do. Ymmv

Indeed, moving too slow can be a hazard on controlled waters as well as controlled roads. This is why all jurisdictions I know of actually have infractions for moving too slow in highways.

Just as the colregs define expected behaviour, so too to do posted speed limits. A speed limit is exactly that; the maximum one can drive on this roadway. It is not a mandatory speed, it is a maximum. Most roadways are governed by minimums as well, and some jurisdictions even post these. The ones I’m aware of include a lower range that is 40% below the MAX. The specific examples we’ve discussed considers someone driving 10 to 15% below, which is well within the normal operating range. So in your example it would be someone sailing at 5.4 to 5.1 knots, not 2 knots. Yet this is what has got some people all bent out of shape.

Originally Posted by Sojourner

Uhh, dear, I have no idea where anyone read that I prefer contributing to road accidents due to my poor planning and subsequent speeding... As I've mentioned a fair bit on cf, I owned and lived out of a 1977 VW bus. As for the holier than thou never even going the speed limit because they plan so well, a) I call BS. Or HS. Some kind of serious S. Doc was never late? Appointment never ran long? Family never got ill? And B) it's people like YOU who ruin the careful planning at the speed limit of others. I don't speed (couldn't speed in a VW if you tried). But ain't no one gonna regulate me on a public resource I also paid for when I'm acting legally.

No one has said anything of the sort. What they have said is that just b/c you put yourself in this late situation, doesn’t mean the rest of the world has to accommodate your choices. Unless you’re having a baby or a heart attack, you still don’t have the right to drive aggressively or beyond the posted speed limit. And someone driving 10 to 15% lower than the maximum is not an excuse to get angry.

[boatman61]

Ahhh.!!! The stress free joy of a motorbike.

[44'cruisingcat]

Haven't followed this thread, just had a quick look now.

Got to say, I'm impressed with all the positivity.