Rocna or Manson Supreme? (OP Ducks His Head)

[merrydolphin]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

So Panope’s video is misleading, fake? I think not and the difference in experience must be bottom types, techniques etc.

The last 3 boats KP44. Cal 2-46 and Tartan 37 all came with genuine CQRs when I bought them. This is over a 35 yr period of cruising in multiple countries. And I usually live on the hook.
Every time I say OK ill give it a chance. There is enough money to spend on a new to me boat as it is. EVERY time I get the same results. Drag in any kind of even semi bad conditions. All over Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean and the US. In the Caribbean a standard way to anchor with the CQR is I would drop the CQR, snorkel over it and have my wife slowly back down. Drag drag, dive down and SHOVE it under. Then it would hold but still couldn’t trust it. And this is with all chain 3/8 BBB and plenty of it. It doesn’t take long before I am looking for a modern anchor, at any cost! Almost lost my Cal 46 anchored in a cove in Baja Mexico. Sailed back to La Paz and immediately ordered a Delta 55, my go to at the time. A far superior anchor. That big knuckle is a pain in the but to launch and retrieve too.
Before the more modern anchors came out, a friend of mine use to greatly improve CQRs by casting lead into the tip area. It really helped. But the newer anchors are the way to go. I have had wonderful results for a number of years with Spade. What ever anchor, tip weight and penetrating ability are critical of course along with fluke area. I prefer to stay away from hoops. Good tip weight is superior. But no thanks to CQRs. There is a reason that practically all older used yachts for sale come with a CQR as the primary. Nobody wants them. They keep their newer anchor or sell it separately. Let the old CQR go with the boat.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by merrydolphin

The last 3 boats KP44. Cal 2-46 and Tartan 37 all came with genuine CQRs when I bought them. This is over a 35 yr period of cruising in multiple countries. And I usually live on the hook.
Every time I say OK ill give it a chance. There is enough money to spend on a new to me boat as it is. EVERY time I get the same results. Drag in any kind of even semi bad conditions. All over Mexico, Central America and the Caribbean and the US. In the Caribbean a standard way to anchor with the CQR is I would drop the CQR, snorkel over it and have my wife slowly back down. Drag drag, dive down and SHOVE it under. Then it would hold but still couldn’t trust it. And this is with all chain 3/8 BBB and plenty of it. It doesn’t take long before I am looking for a modern anchor, at any cost! Almost lost my Cal 46 anchored in a cove in Baja Mexico. Sailed back to La Paz and immediately ordered a Delta 55, my go to at the time. A far superior anchor. That big knuckle is a pain in the but to launch and retrieve too.
Before the more modern anchors came out, a friend of mine use to greatly improve CQRs by casting lead into the tip area. It really helped. But the newer anchors are the way to go. I have had wonderful results for a number of years with Spade. What ever anchor, tip weight and penetrating ability are critical of course along with fluke area. I prefer to stay away from hoops. Good tip weight is superior. But no thanks to CQRs. There is a reason that practically all older used yachts for sale come with a CQR as the primary. Nobody wants them. They keep their newer anchor or sell it separately. Let the old CQR go with the boat.

Yes, on harder sand you can drag them over for hours without ever setting. Most have a very blunt point though…

A friend had an 80’ steel ketch and a 240lb CQR and it held even during 70+kts squalls. This was in the Abacos.

[thomm225]

Side by side comparison 20 lb CQR and 25 lb Mantus M1

[Nicholson58]

They are both about on par. Both good. We have a 54 kilo Rocna that has been without fault. We have lived on the hook on the Caribbean for six seasons. It sets instantly in anything but rocks or hard pan. Just get the biggest you can accommodate, hopefully, at least one size larger than the maker recommends. The heavy Rocna will punch through grass if necessary but always look for a previously disturbed open spot.

Our first anchor was 74# CQR. The worst, most unreliable anchor ever. Plows the bottom into tractor furrows.

54K (121#) Rocna & 54# Bruce
Anchor Forerunner
Special anchor placement accessory

[Chotu]

Well, I like to follow up with threads to talk about the results.

The Rocna, on its first real test is doing just fine. It doesn’t feel any different than the beloved Manson supreme so far.

I am out here in the storms that are crossing Florida now. Some OK wind to test out things.

I have pivoted around with wind and current facing in different directions and the anchor has reset reliably. To tell you the truth, I couldn’t even tell you the difference between these two anchors if they were both underwater.

I’m probably more concerned with my ace hardware shackle. They didn’t have any of my usual Crosby ones in stock anywhere.

But the one in ace hardware certainly beat out the cheap Chinese ones I was seeing everywhere in the marine stores.

[Sam Woodbridge]

Vulcan

Watch Panope’s videos.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Yes, on harder sand you can drag them over for hours without ever setting. Most have a very blunt point though…

Yep, a lot of hard sand where we cruise, plough never held the last boat but the Manson Supreme on this one sets 1st time every time

A friend had an 80’ steel ketch and a 240lb CQR and it held even during 70+kts squalls. This was in the Abacos

.
That's a mooring block
A mate of mine swears by his plough, his is even more ridiculous at 300lb on a similar vessel to ours.

In comparison, we have 150 lb of anchor that actually works, has held us in 80+ knots

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Sam Woodbridge

Vulcan

Watch Panope’s videos.

Yeah, but I probably couldn’t tell that was on the end either. Once they are underwater, they all seem to work about the same. At least these two to do.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Sam Woodbridge

Vulcan

Watch Panope’s videos.

Yes, but he already has the Rocna. Won't be many people changing from one to another, although we did (post 172) but only because Amazon UK were giving away Vulcans for a short period of time pre-season. And no we can't tell the difference, although the Vulcan is shorter and a better fit in the anchor locker.

Pete

[Sam Woodbridge]

I had the Rocna roll bar style anchor on my sailboat. I didn’t care for it, I felt a old style spade anchor was better. I upgraded to a Vulcan 55 lbs for a 38 foot boat.

I see his question Rocna or Manson. I really have come to the conclusion some anchors are better than others for different sea beds. I mention Vulcan because it has worked for me and I like to sleep well at night on anchor.

Sorry not much help Chotu - good luck with everything! I see a lot threads with your name on them lately.

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Yes, but he already has the Rocna. Won't be many people changing from one to another, although we did (post 172) but only because Amazon UK were giving away Vulcans for a short period of time pre-season. And no we can't tell the difference, although the Vulcan is shorter and a better fit in the anchor locker.

Pete

We switched from Rocna to Mantus as we do a lot of soft mud when we are on Chesapeake- and have found a large difference between them in mud (ie Rocna struggled to set/reset for us)
But when we cruise further north in NE in harder or sandier substrate I bet there’s not as much difference.

But FWIW Rocna does perform pretty mediocrely in Panope’s tests; and Morgan’s Cloud took Rocna off their “recommended list”

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by malbert73

Morgan’s Cloud took Rocna off their “recommended list”

Surprised it was ever on his list following his staunch support for Spade anchors, for a while, it was Spade or nothing.

I cancelled my subscription after disagreeing with him over a number of items. Sometimes 90% is good enough particularly for those on a budget.

Pete

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Surprised it was ever on his list following his staunch support for Spade anchors, for a while, it was Spade or nothing.

I cancelled my subscription after disagreeing with him over a number of items. Sometimes 90% is good enough particularly for those on a budget.

Pete

And the Spade rusts too much to be considered imo

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

And the Spade rusts too much to be considered imo

I'd definitely take a Vulcan over a Spade for a few reasons, that one included. Based on the SV Panope testing, the Vulcan is a more well-rounded performer (slightly worse in some tests, but its worst categories are significantly better than the worst for the Spade). It's a more durable construction, and it's also significantly cheaper. I've personally been very happy with the Vulcan on my boat.

The Mantus M1, M2 and Viking are also excellent performers (the Viking coming out pretty much on top in the SV Panope tests), but none of them are as durable. The Sarca Excel would be another good pick and is of durable construction.


The Spade's 2 biggest flaws are the rust issues and the price. It was one of the best you could get at one point, but its higher price can no longer be justified compared to other options on the market in my opinion.

[CarinaPDX]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

The Spade's 2 biggest flaws are the rust issues and the price. It was one of the best you could get at one point, but its higher price can no longer be justified compared to other options on the market in my opinion.

The original Spade was a 2-piece forged anchor and was very strong and durable. The current one is nothing like the original; I don't entirely trust the welded triangular shank. Generally speaking welds are more prone to corrosion. The original's expense could partially be explained by the forging process but the current one is very overpriced. I'm looking at a Vulcan...

(I owned an original until it went walkabout, and replaced it with the newer design about 15 years ago - a disappointment).

Greg