Oil for Danfoss BD50 compressor

[MJ360]

Can anyone point me to a source for compressor oil? The Secop site says to use a POE with a viscosity of 15 cSt. They list some examples:

Emkarate RL15H, manufactured by Uniqema
Mobil EAL Arctic, manufactured by Mobil Chemicals
CP2915AS, manufactured by CPI

but none of these seem to exist.

I am replacing evaporators in the hope of beating the cursed capillary tube blockage. Thought it might be wise to replace the oil along with any adsorbed water and acid.

[MJ360]

This a is refrigeration compressor rather than an air compressor.

[tkeithlu]

I am sorry strike my response.

[tkeithlu]

Honda seems to be a good source of POE oil. Here's some on eBay.

https://www.ebay.com/p/1239852335

[Scubaseas]

NAPA or your FLAP store.

[MJ360]

Thanks all. Finding POE oils is not the problem. Finding one with a viscosity of 15 cSt is the issue. The POE oils are either not listing a viscosity or they doe so in units that don't seem to have a conversion to cSt.

[OzeLouie]

Originally Posted by MJ360

Thanks all. Finding POE oils is not the problem. Finding one with a viscosity of 15 cSt is the issue. The POE oils are either not listing a viscosity or they doe so in units that don't seem to have a conversion to cSt.

Yes it gets confusing! Suggest going to a refrigeration wholesaler and advise them of the refrigerant you use (most likely R134a) and the compressor model etc. They should be able to help, and may I suggest getting a proper filter dryer (032 or 052 flared) while there!!

Cheers OzeLouie

[Richard Kollmann]

Originally Posted by MJ360

Can anyone point me to a source for compressor oil? The Secop site says to use a POE with a viscosity of 15 cSt. They list some examples:

Emkarate RL15H, manufactured by Uniqema
Mobil EAL Arctic, manufactured by Mobil Chemicals
CP2915AS, manufactured by CPI

but none of these seem to exist.

I am replacing evaporators in the hope of beating the cursed capillary tube blockage. Thought it might be wise to replace the oil along with any adsorbed water and acid.

Without knowing why you suspect the oil is contaminated, and actual system model and system manufacture it is not possible to provide good advice.
POE oil is hygroscopic that means exposed to air it absorbs moisture. And yes combination of the three air, moisture and oil will form acid. There is a reason why this synthetic's Ester oil is contained in only metal containers sized for different sized systems. Moisture in POE oil is extremely difficult to remove.
There are standard brands of POE available like from parts stores I have used Texico and Castrol 100 POE oil.

The only Danfoss BD compressors that end up with capillary tube material blockage are after excessive compressor overheating. Once these small units are contaminated its a waste of money to think you can clean them up. It is simple to rule out moisture with a simple test. If problem is moisture only Super Dehydration without opening system and changing filter dryer is proper solution. If your problem is sludge from acid blockage flow would not be blocked all the time and and amp draw would be above normal.

If this is a Keel Cooler system or one without an air cooled fan condensing unit your recommission plan will only be a temporary fix. I have been following this problem for 18 years I hope I am wrong this time.

[grahamb]

Oil for use in refrigeration/air conditioning systems must be of the type that is wax free..... the oil is circulated through the entire system entrained in the refrigerant and when passing through the capillary or T X Valve ...there is a substantial pressure and temperature drop.....and any wax will immediately freeze...and probably block the refrigerant flow.....leading to other problems......

[Ninedotsix]

Originally Posted by grahamb

Oil for use in refrigeration/air conditioning systems must be of the type that is wax free..... the oil is circulated through the entire system entrained in the refrigerant and when passing through the capillary or T X Valve ...there is a substantial pressure and temperature drop.....and any wax will immediately freeze...and probably block the refrigerant flow.....leading to other problems......

And, since the oils considered are POE series, any mineral oil added to the system with HFC refrigerant will gel in the evaporator, interfering with heat transfer and restricting refrigerant flow.

A couple observations -
In USA, Emkarate label is distributed by NuCalgon brand.
The lowest series number I've seen is 22, albeit in medium temp refrigeration.
Also, there is a number missing from the Mobil EAL Artic series you quoted, but Mobil has stopped offering the EAL 15, and the document look up on the website returns a 404 message. EAL 22 is still available.

Overall in light of info provided, my experience has always referred me to SUS viscosity, not Cst, so I may need an education about this. If I did the conversion correctly, 15Cst is something above 77 SUS.

You need to obtained your oil in small tin size, not gallon cans or large drums.

That said, I would be inclined to find the Danfoss tech support and locate a service center than can supply a small tin of the right oil.

It will seem extra expensive, but you will be wasting any leftover, since POE oil has limited shelf life when sealed, and practically zero shelf life after opening.

JMHO, Cheers
9.6

[MJ360]

Hi Richard. It is a pleasure to hear from you. Over the past 4 years, I have read every word you have written on the frigoboat capillary tube blockage issue. Mine is the infamous keel cooler version.

Like so many before me, I have been chasing this problem for a long time. I was going to replace the entire system with a reqular water-cooled, but marine reefer units are backordered until doomsday. At this point I am willing to risk the price of a new evap so as to get to sea next month. I understand the issue may well not be resolved by a new evaporator (from reading some of your responses over the years).

I figured while the system is open, replacing the compressor oil might help if the issue is all, or part moisture. I intent to install a filter/drier just before the cap tube.

[MJ360]

Thanks OzeLouie! I had been hunting for the proper filter/drier, with no luck. The ones you recommend are readily available.

Do you recommend the flare version over sweat for purposes of easier replacement?

[MJ360]

nine.six,

Thanks for the reply. I found a conversion table that verifies your calculations. 15 cSt ~ 77 SUS.

Sadly, many POE products either omit the units, or viscosity altogether.

I have an email in to Secop to see if they can provide some certainty.

[Ninedotsix]

I had to catch up on my own background.

ISO designations are equivalent to centi-Stoke values.

So: ISO 15 ~ 15cSt

That said, the lowest ISO I could find is 22 (it’s really rather thin).

Emkarate and Mobil both list 22 as a current product.

I frankly found that in applications where the engineers at the plant I provided field support to, chose to drop from 32 to 22 to increase oil flow and therefore better cool high speed bearings, that the lower viscosity caused problems at low speed, with lower hydrodynamic support of rolling load.
The result was wear, galling, and snagged/spun bearings.

Don’t know if any of this matters in your situation.
But I’m wondering if you have a variable speed application, or fixed speed?

I bet the ISO 22 would work, but hesitant to put you at risk, so talking to the factory as you’re doing is a best bet.

I’m also wondering how you’re going to get the old oil out of the compressor and other components.
According to the Danfoss specs, the oil charge is 5 oz.
You may need to dismount the compressor and tip it so the oil drains out the suction connection. It will drip for a long, long time.
You might want to adapt an automotive a/c flush kit to flush the evaporator, condenser and interconnected piping.
My apologies for the long post.
If you want to discuss details, you can PM me anytime.
Cheers ~ Pete

[Richard Kollmann]

[QUOTE=MJ360;3560802]Hi Richard. It is a pleasure to hear from you. Over the past 4 years, I have read every word you have written on the frigoboat capillary tube blockage issue. Mine is the infamous keel cooler version.

Like so many before me, I have been chasing this problem for a long time. I was going to replace the entire system with a reqular water-cooled, but marine reefer units are backordered until doomsday. At this point I am willing to risk the price of a new evap so as to get to sea next month. I understand the issue may well not be resolved by a new evaporator (from reading some of your responses over the years).

I figured while the system is open, replacing the compressor oil might help if the issue is all, or part moisture. I intent to install a filter/drier just before the cap tube.[/QUOT

MJ, Other boaters and many technicians have failed in their attempts to solve this design problem created by overheating of compressor oil. There have been attempts to replace the evaporator more than three times on the same boat, filter dryers were added several times with larger filters and one machine shop cut the dome off the compressor and removed and cleaned the compressor assembly. If it is possible to sterilize and clean all components in a complete refrigerant loop this problem could be eliminated. But to prevent a recurrence the compressor overheat condition must be corrected

Refrigerant Filters are designed to collect solid material above the lever of 4 micron. The damaged oil in high pressure side interring to capillary tube transformers this contaminated liquid from solid liquid allowing contaminants to crystallize and start restricting flow while inside the outlet end of cap tube. The first sign you would be advised of a problem would be poor cooling performance indicating loss of refrigerant, solution at that point is add refrigerant to bring back normal performance. In one case this problem and solution was repeated several times resulting in the end where the current draw of this system reached 18 amps to get normal cooling. Two boaters sent me their complete length of cap tub and aluminum at the evaporator, I Found cristales in over a two foot length of tube starting at the evaporator end.
I ran a search of my hard drives and found 200 emails and forum posts regarding this problem,
I met with their company engineer about oil overheating problem who did not consider it a problem. I contacted his home office and was informed there was a screen before entrance of cap tube which I did not find on either the cap tube or line I examined.
This Keel Cooler system is a good and efficient system with thousands installed in the right applications where compressor limits are not exceeded.