Installing Head and Shower in an Old Boat

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by HobieFan

I can only scrape up about $5k,

Do a spreadsheet. Lable one column: Reality





Hate to tell you that a boat, anything that floats is NOT cheaper than renting an apartment.

[shipofools]

here is a good option for a head that is easy to plumb - RM-69 marine toilet with holding tank

I personally went with a Lavac, but it was a chore to install.

[imagine2frolic]

There's no room for a sump between the liner floor in the head, and the bottom of the hull. If you let the shower drain into the bilge it will be stinky, and gawdawful. You would have to buildup the head floor, and that depends on your heigth.

I lived, and cruised on this exact boat. I showered in the marina, and while cruising showered in the cockpit after installing a shower head right next to the manual bilge pump.....i2f

[roverhi]

Don't know what you'd be paying for a Columbia 30 but when all is said and done, it would still be a Columbia. It's a boat that didn't sell well when it was new and doubt that it has picked up a following over the years. Columbias of that era were mostly ugly and not very well built, owned a 26 MkII and it was a POS but had a lot of room for it's length. Columbia went for interior volume, not quality, seaworthiness or looks. Even if you fixed it up, it may not be worth more than what you'll be paying for it. One thing you have to take into count is the costs of selling the boat. Broker commisions, repairs detailed in new buyer's survey, etc. On an inexpensive boat that needs work, these can easily add up to more than the boat is worth.

Might want to see if there is another boat out there that you could get into. From experience, can tell you that rehabing a boat is always about 3 times as expensive as you planned. If you can control yourself and just liveaboard doing clean up, painting and varnishing, and other low/zero out of pocket costs it could work out for you. As soon as you have to add something major, it will probably blow your budget and profit potential. If it's a matter of dropping a few thousand in the boat and paying a reasonable slip fee vice dropping $1500 a month in apartment rent, there is something to be said for your idea.

Aloha
Peter O.

[HobieFan]

Originally Posted by roverhi

Might want to see if there is another boat out there that you could get into. From experience, can tell you that rehabing a boat is always about 3 times as expensive as you planned. If you can control yourself and just liveaboard doing clean up, painting and varnishing, and other low/zero out of pocket costs it could work out for you. As soon as you have to add something major, it will probably blow your budget and profit potential. If it's a matter of dropping a few thousand in the boat and paying a reasonable slip fee vice dropping $1500 a month in apartment rent, there is something to be said for your idea.

Exactly.

I don't plan to profit on the boat. I plan to lose money on it! But I figure the money lost living on it and working on it for a year will be far less than the roughly $18,000 lost by renting an apartment for the same period.

And I can probably sell the boat for exactly what I paid to buy it, if not a hair more.

Even if it sinks after a year (provided my personal items aren't onboard), it will likely have been the cheaper than the cost of getting my own apartment ($18,000 per year, roughly).

That's the appeal of a 35 year old boat.

Plus, I'll get to be out on the water now and then.


If I was sinking $150k into a brand new Columbia, maybe it would be a different story as for economy and depreciation over the next year or two, but in this case, I don't see the financial side being a big issue.

I'm more concerned about being comfortable and safe. if I buy the boat for $5,000, that $18k budget will allow me $13,000 to upgrade and get equipment that I may be able to bring with me to the next boat. I'm thinking.. handheld VHF, handheld GPS (backups to the older onboard systems), Radar system (included with the boat), fancy oversized ground tackle, etc, that will all come with me after I upgrade to a 40'.

Or maybe in a year I'll hate boats and sell it and move on.

Gotta try, eh? :-)

[snort]

Talbot,
If I may ask, how much trouble was it to install your shower, and how much did it cost in terms of money and hours of labour?
Thanks!

[Talbot]

Originally Posted by snort

Talbot,
If I may ask, how much trouble was it to install your shower, and how much did it cost in terms of money and hours of labour?
Thanks!

My boat was very easy. I already had a gas hot water heating, so I tapped into the hot water system and connected it through a tap to a standard home shower fitting on a height adjustable bar. I used a direct connection, because it was easier to adjust the water temperature directly on the heater, and thus get the best flow rate, but was peculiar to my installation.
I found a shower curtain track that was basically a large circular bar, again for home use over a bath. It fit my heads compartment beautifully - a 9m catalac catamaran has a nice large full height heads compartment!

A standard shower curtain fitted the track, and covered everything else in the compartment.

There was already a vent in the deckhead above the shower position.

That just leaves the sump. The compartment already had a fibreglass floor which could easily be used as the tray of the shower. This had a large wooden hatch in it that was access to the through hulls. I lowered the wooden hatch slightly to provide an easier draining area, then fitted a normal household shower U bend and drain recessed into this wooden hatch. I sheaved the hatch with GRP and then sealed it back into the deck with boat seal. This left the issue of where to drain the water. I fitted a johnson shower sump and pump (see earlier post) connected it up to the Shower U bend, and also to a convenient drain above water level (dont need through hulls for this in a catamaran!) I connected in a suitably placed switch to turn on the shower sump, and that just left access to all the through hulls and to the shower sump and U bend underneath the shower tray. I fitted a dinghy waterproof hatch for this.

Thus the base of the shower tray was very functional, but not as aesthetically pleasing as it could be. The GRP could also be a bit slippery, and I dont like paddling in water when trying to dry, so I fitted a plastic grid over the shower tray :


This allowed all the water to drain perfectly, but I then found a beautiful matting designed to fit into caravan showers and provides a comfortable, aesthetically pleasing finish.

After a shower, I would always pass an extra pint of fresh water through the sump in order to displace all the soapy water, thus reducing possibility of smells, and also lifted the mats on their sides until they were dry - hence no mildew.

As for cost, I have no idea, and I did bits of this around other jobs so cannot really estimate time taken, but not very long.

To do the same in a different class of boat - probably a lot more difficult and longer. 9m Catalacs are not the best sailing boats, but for their size they are one of the best liveaboards you can find!

[imagine2frolic]

There is a drain in the head for a shower, but there is not a enough room to put your hand between the hull, and floor pan. It would have to drain to the bilge. No where in the bilge is there room for the sump. There is barely enough room for the shortest bilge pump in the sump area for the bilge 10 ft. away. I put a shower in the cockpit, and usedit while cruising Mexico where it was warm........i2f

[Mule]

Heed this; in the real world, really doing it it works out something like this; you are spending Marine Dollars, (ONE marine dollar=100 American Dollars). This realization, for the first time, comes to you after the project has started, too late to back out and the only way to continue is full speed ahead with the greening of West Marine and the like.

[Intentional Drifter]

The space, maintenance, and comfort you will get in a $1500/month apartment (in just about any major city in the US) will seem like living in a penthouse compared to what you will put into this boat. Given how you are describing the boat, it seems easily possible that you would put in at least the difference and quite likely, far more, into making it tolerably liveable. Personally, I think you are seriously underestimating the importance of having a functional head system as well as the difficulty and cost of putting one in where it does not already exist.

ID

[snort]

Talbot,
Thanks very much! I hope to be buying a Catalac 9M very soon! (Apologies to all for a minor hijacking of a thread).