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05-04-2016, 07:35
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: On a boat
Boat: 1987 Cabo Rico 38 #117 (sold) & 2008 Manta 42 #124
Posts: 4,174
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Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
All,
I am wondering if anyone has any feedback on quality differences between different brands of fixed bronze props?
We are considering a Michigan Wheel prop but I have no data points for comparison between that manufacturer and any another.
- z
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05-04-2016, 07:56
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#2
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Hull Diver
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Under a boat, in a marina, in the San Francisco Bay
Posts: 5,437
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Quality of manufacture? Not an issue, IMHO. In the 21+ years I have been cleaning boat bottoms, I have put my hands on several thousand different, individual props. I have never, ever seen a fixed blade prop that failed due to anything but lack of maintenance by an owner. I think if you buy a prop from any of the major American manufacturers, you will be happy.
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05-04-2016, 08:15
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#3
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Orleans
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.
Posts: 3,974
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Z,
I have never bought a fixed prop other than used. And have no sense of quality amongst them. Last time I was looking for a fixed I was in Stewart Fl and the used boat gear shop had a dumpster full of them they sold by weight (they were headed to a scrap yard anyway). I think I paid $15 for a 14" wheel.
__________________
Greg
- If animals weren't meant to be eaten then they wouldn't be made of food.
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05-04-2016, 08:34
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 25,541
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
There's the "sailor" model and another. I didn't see much difference in performance between them. I think maybe the sailor is designed for less drag/smaller blade width maybe. Campbell manufacturer I think. I will say a 3 blade is a lot better than 2 blade at stopping the boat, Not sure the less drag of a 2 blade is really that much of a benefit.
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard
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05-04-2016, 08:52
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: On a boat
Boat: 1987 Cabo Rico 38 #117 (sold) & 2008 Manta 42 #124
Posts: 4,174
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako
There's the "sailor" model and another. I didn't see much difference in performance between them. I think maybe the sailor is designed for less drag/smaller blade width maybe. Campbell manufacturer I think. I will say a 3 blade is a lot better than 2 blade at stopping the boat, Not sure the less drag of a 2 blade is really that much of a benefit.
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Indeed.
I was speaking to a prop guru up in the Chesapeake and he was recommending that we move to a 4 blade prop over a 3 blade. I guess his reasoning is that most sailors motor a lot any way and most cruisers are heavily loaded thus you can increase milage and thrust with a 4 blade.
The small increase in drag from a 4 bladed prop equates to a slight decrease in overall speed when sailing at slower wind speeds and only makes a significant impact in time over long passages. However, I am sticking with a 3 blade because I really don't need anything else slowing my boat more than it already is!
The 4 blade is appealing however.
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05-04-2016, 08:58
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 25,541
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Yeah, I'm not sure about blade performance, just don't know. My gut says getting over 3 blades for a slow moving boat is past the point of diminishing returns. A 2 blade moves your boat at hull speed as well as any, but stopping is not that good. :>)
Most comparison of 3 vs 4 are on planing power boats , and the 3 blade is faster, but the 4 blade better in heavy chop.
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard
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05-04-2016, 09:23
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#7
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Orleans
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.
Posts: 3,974
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
As I mentioned, go get a bunch of different designs in the right size from a boat scrap yard and test them all to see which you like more. At least the one I went to would let you 'buy' a bunch and return all but one (we weren't sure of the key way size at the time). In your case get a two, three, and four (if you can find it) of the right size and try them out. Your paying a little over scrap metal prices anyway so there's no loss.
__________________
Greg
- If animals weren't meant to be eaten then they wouldn't be made of food.
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05-04-2016, 13:53
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Lake Erie
Boat: H36
Posts: 384
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Be careful not to over prop when going to more or bigger blades. This can destroy or reduce life of a motor.
Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
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05-04-2016, 20:32
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: On a boat
Boat: 1987 Cabo Rico 38 #117 (sold) & 2008 Manta 42 #124
Posts: 4,174
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stumble
As I mentioned, go get a bunch of different designs in the right size from a boat scrap yard and test them all to see which you like more. At least the one I went to would let you 'buy' a bunch and return all but one (we weren't sure of the key way size at the time). In your case get a two, three, and four (if you can find it) of the right size and try them out. Your paying a little over scrap metal prices anyway so there's no loss.
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Ohhhh... thats a great idea.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor Doug
Be careful not to over prop when going to more or bigger blades. This can destroy or reduce life of a motor.
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Yeah... Michigan Wheel recommended a three blade 18x10... we currently have a 17x9 and the result is that we have to run at just slightly over the recommended cruising RPM.
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06-04-2016, 09:48
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#10
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Olympia WA
Boat: Cascade 36
Posts: 104
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
You might want to check out a Campbell Sailer prop from Canada. See West By North
I replaced a Michigan Wheel "Sailer" 2-blade with a Campbell 3-blade last fall. The Campbell is a jewel of engineering and construction.
Amazing reduction in drivetrain vibration (evidently caused when a 2-blade aligns with the dead water behind the keel and then emerges to "bite" the water flowing outside the keel). Also, much greater thrust and increased speed when powering into a chop.
Haven't yet had much experience with the increased drag to be expected from a 3-blade when sailing....
I think I'd be wary of relying on a prop from a junk bin. A blade might be irretrievably bent leading to excessive vibration, or the prop may be de-zincified from poor maintenance. YMMV.
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06-04-2016, 10:06
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#11
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Jacksonville/ out cruising
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 31,351
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Junk Bin sure sounds like a good place to get a spare though, I need a spare as I was horribly over propped, engine would only turn 2,400 RPM out of 3,600 when I bought the boat, that is now my spare, but I ought to get a proper one, hadn't though about recycle.
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06-04-2016, 10:18
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Alaska
Boat: Boatless
Posts: 928
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
I'm a fan on fixed props and agree that all are basically equal. That being said proper pitch for your engine is important. On our older Hughes 40 we took the prop back and forth to prop shop several times to tweak that just right (to engine manufacturers recommended specs) and were very happy happy happy after getting her right.
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"Take it all in, it's as big as it seems, count all your blessings, remember your dreams" JB
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06-04-2016, 10:34
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Bay of Fundy,Grand Manan,N.B.,Canada N44.40 W66.50
Boat: Mascot 28 pilothouse motorsailer 28ft
Posts: 3,353
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Some light reading
http://www.akcaymarin.com/Products/%...%20klavuzu.pdf
Please look in that junk bin for a 17LH12-13 for 25mm metric taper
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My personal experience & humble opinions-feel free to ignore both
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06-04-2016, 13:05
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Columbia, SC
Boat: Sea Ray 270
Posts: 100
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
I am getting ready myself to switch from a 2 blade to 3. I currently have a 2 blade, 15" RH. I have done a lot of research about this, and from what I have found, for me anyway, is it comes down to 2 choices. Either a Michigan Wheel, or a Campbell sailor. The Campbell sailor has really good reviews from every where I can see. It has less drag as well. It costs more though. To get the Campbell Sailor they recommended ( I would have do a prop calc for you, its free and they get right back to you) a 14", 7.5" pitch, for $695 (includes shipping). I can get a Michigan Wheel 15" 3 blade for about $500. Campbell has a unique design with cupped blades that supposedly reduces drag. This is what the rep said;
"The Campbell Sailer has cupped blades and a leading edge foil. This produces greater thrust and reduces the slip rate. To account for this, we often size smaller than other manufacturers for a given installation.
Many users report greater thrust, improved maneuvering and a smoother running installation with a Campbell prop. Also, the narrow blade profile allows for reduced drag under sail. Up to 35-40% less when compared to equivalent size units from other manufacturers."
I think I am going to go with them because all I have heard is good reviews about their props.
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06-04-2016, 13:25
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Bay of Fundy,Grand Manan,N.B.,Canada N44.40 W66.50
Boat: Mascot 28 pilothouse motorsailer 28ft
Posts: 3,353
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Re: Prop Manufacturer Quality - Fixed props
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackheape
I am getting ready myself to switch from a 2 blade to 3. I currently have a 2 blade, 15" RH. I have done a lot of research about this, and from what I have found, for me anyway, is it comes down to 2 choices. Either a Michigan Wheel, or a Campbell sailor. The Campbell sailor has really good reviews from every where I can see. It has less drag as well. It costs more though. To get the Campbell Sailor they recommended ( I would have do a prop calc for you, its free and they get right back to you) a 14", 7.5" pitch, for $695 (includes shipping). I can get a Michigan Wheel 15" 3 blade for about $500. Campbell has a unique design with cupped blades that supposedly reduces drag. This is what the rep said;
"The Campbell Sailer has cupped blades and a leading edge foil. This produces greater thrust and reduces the slip rate. To account for this, we often size smaller than other manufacturers for a given installation.
Many users report greater thrust, improved maneuvering and a smoother running installation with a Campbell prop. Also, the narrow blade profile allows for reduced drag under sail. Up to 35-40% less when compared to equivalent size units from other manufacturers."
I think I am going to go with them because all I have heard is good reviews about their props.
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If they are made in Canada-you get 25+% off for $US & no duty ( NAFTA)
__________________
My personal experience & humble opinions-feel free to ignore both
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