Greta hitches a ride on La Vagabonde

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Reefmagnet

Yes. There's a lot of "we must do something" yet little of "I must do something" or, even better, "I am doing something". I don't understand the mindset of those that accept that the earth is being destroyed by trace gasses and make the effort to berate others that don't agree with them and yet make little to no effort to actually make changes to their lifestyle to reduce their personal contributions to the alleged problem.

Kudos to Greta for practicing what she preaches.

Indeed, she is courageous in that regard. She is perhaps aware that if she flew, people would be up in her face about it. Too bad she's taking an elevated risk to pass somebody's purity test. Hope she's enjoying the sail.

Re the "mindset" - you're just playing a word-game: fat people can't be nutritionists. A wealthy businessperson can't advocate for social justice. And so on.

It's an unwinnable game - there's no level of personal action short of martyrdom that would ever move the needle for those who make that argument.

And most important, you can't solve a systemic problem just with voluntary individual action.

This sums it up nicely.

[DeepFrz]

Originally Posted by Reefmagnet

The Ash Wednesday fires in 1983 were far more devasting then the current fires People these days seem to suffer from short memories and just swallow what's fed to them. No one blamed "climate change" in 1983 and earlier for devastating bush fires. Yet they're all caused by the same thing. An extended drought, low humidity and a period of no rain with high winds.

Gee, Ash Wednesday fires, Black Friday fires all worse than the fires of today? Not according to the people who are out there fighting today's fires or those people who fought the fires decades ago and have since retired. The word "catastrophic" was not used in relation to forest/bush fires until recently and people are saying they have never seen "fire tornadoes" until recently.

The thing is these fires are getting worse all over the planet. Rain forests that have never before or very seldom have burned in the past are burning in many parts of the world.

Sorry, but you deniers are missing it all. You stick your head out the window and say to yourselves and everyone else around things like " no problem here so things must be AOKAY". Things are not AOKAY with the world and scientists from all corners of the earth are telling us that.

You are entitled to your beliefs but the fact that you always show up anytime that climate change is even mentioned with your uninformed rhetoric makes me suspicious of your motives and your beliefs.

[a64pilot]

The issue as I see it hasn’t changed, many run around screaming “something must be done” congratulate each other, jump into their SUV’s and drive home to the McMansion and feel smug.
However none of them actually DO anything except feel smug and make demands.
But the real core of the problem is when to comes to defining what exactly must be done. Then it breaks down, it seems that what must be done is enact taxes, I guess so that the rich can get more government subsidized solar roofs, and buy a Tesla that’s also subsidized by the taxpayer, which Joe average can’t afford to buy a Tesla, but he can afford to help a rich guy buy one, so they can feel smug.
Then the same Tesla is exempt from highway use taxes, let the lady that waits tables for you pay for that, and the guy who cuts your grass, you should get a free pass, you know, to solve global warming.
They however I guess aren’t as deserving as you.
Want to go a long way towards reducing Fossil fuel consumption, it’s simple. Every adult gets 25 gls of fuel ration cards that they can buy 25 gls of whatever they pease for $2 a gl each month. They can still buy as much as they want, but at $10 a gl.
I don’t care what you do with the money, free cell phones for everyone, free internet for the masses, free college, I don’t care, but I guarantee you will reduce the consumption of fossil fuel by a lot.
I’m sure the politicians can find a fast way to spend the money, certainly not pay down the debt.

But end subsidizes for Solar panels, and electric cars, cause your not really subsidizing those industries, your just making it cheaper for the rich guy to buy them is all, if you want to subsidize industry, then you pay the manufacturers, not give rich people a tax break for buying them.


However this won’t happen, you want to know why? Cause that same person that was protesting doesn’t want to pay more than $50 to fill up their SUV, and they want cheap solar to brag about at the country club, and they want that Tesla as a status symbol, it really is as simple as that.


Now you guys in boats who say you want to be green. I can tell you exactly how to do that, send Boat Alexandra a PM, I’m sure he can tell exactly what to do, and likely exactly how to do it.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

The issue as I see it hasn’t changed, many run around screaming “something must be done” congratulate each other, jump into their SUV’s and drive home to the McMansion and feel smug.
However none of them actually DO anything except feel smug and make demands.
But the real core of the problem is when to comes to defining what exactly must be done. Then it breaks down, it seems that what must be done is enact taxes, I guess so that the rich can get more government subsidized solar roofs, and buy a Tesla that’s also subsidized by the taxpayer, which Joe average can’t afford to buy a Tesla, but he can afford to help a rich guy buy one, so they can feel smug.
Then the same Tesla is except from highway use taxes, let the lady that waits tables for you pay for that, and the guy who cuts your grass, you should get a free pass, you know, to solve global warming.

Want to go a long way towards reducing Fossil fuel consumption, it’s simple. Every adult gets 25 gls of fuel ration cards that they can buy 25 gls of whatever they pease for $2 a gl. They can still buy as much as they want, but it’s $10 a gl.
I don’t care what you do with the money, free cell phones for everyone, free internet for the masses, air free college, I don’t care, but I guarantee you you will reduce the consumption of fossil fuel by a lot.

But end subsidizes for Solar panels, and electric cars, cause your not really subsidizing those industries, your just making it cheaper for the rich guy to buy them is all, if you want to subsidize industry, then you pay the manufacturers, not give rich people a tax break for buying them.


However this won’t happen, you want to know why? Cause that same person that was protesting doesn’t want to pay more than $50 to fill up their SUV, it really is as simple as that.

Yep, we all burn fossil fuels and want it as cheap as possible, real simple. Let's not forget how fully attached our economy is to fossil fuel burning, and how fragile that is, let's double the price of fuel and see what happens to the economy.

I love the idea of solar ,batteries and sails, hey that's how I live , I get that nice warm I'm a good person feeling deep inside, I most likely have a much smaller foot print than most in the western world BUT I'm honest, I'm part of the problem (assuming there is one) I dont kid myself that I'm anything else than a consumer, if your serious then stop consuming, if you dont your a hypocrite, dont blame big business or government, own it ,its you, take responsibility or be honest, your call.

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by Morgali

Bieber has sold an estimated 150 million records, making him one of the world's best-selling music artists. His US album and singles sales total 44.7 million.[8][9] He became the second person to reach 100 million followers on Twitter in August 2017 after Katy Perry. Bieber has won numerous awards throughout his career, including an American Music Award for Artist of the Year in 2010 and 2012, a Grammy Award for Best Dance Recording for the song "Where Are Ü Now", and a Latin Grammy Award.[10] He has been listed three times by Forbes magazine among the top ten most powerful celebrities in the world, in 2011, 2012 and 2013.[11] In 2016, Bieber became the first artist to surpass 10 billion total video views on Vevo.[12]

You equate personal success with money and fame ? No comment on his run ins with the law, mental breakdown, drugs and alcohol ?

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by hamburking

Hysterical is the appropriate delivery. That's the whole point! Ask the people in Venice swimming in the streets if its time to get emotional! Your house is on fire all around you. Are you going to remain calm? Think I'm exaggerating? Ask an Australian...or a Californian...their homes are literally burning.

Good For Greta. Good for Riley & Elayna.

So you are selling your boaty -its made of Crude oil and it burns crude oil -even the sails are made of crude oil plus there is no justifiable reason for any pleasure boat as they all pollute. And you had better move to higher ground as rising doom is headed your way, when are you moving?

[Hardhead]

Originally Posted by daletournier

100%, I'm neither right or left IMO, but I do notice the left throw alot of labels around while believing they have some moral high ground, here's another label, bullies, I've never liked bullies, regardless of their political beliefs they just encourage me to push back harder.

I think that applies to both sides of the issue. IMO, we're headed for some major political fireworks on this issue in the next 10 years. Likely there will be some legislative changes brought about by the increase in younger voters. From those that I know, their view is that social security is falling apart, they will never have the stable pensions of their grandparents, higher education has far outpaced the rate of inflation, and the environment is a low priority, so many don't feel they owe anything to the current status quo.

[250224]

Originally Posted by Macblaze

I'd just like to say, before I go read something about sailing and cruising...you know what this thread was supposed to be about,

They are offline, there's nothing to say about sailing

Originally Posted by Macblaze

that I have never in my life seen so many stubborn, arrogant, "triggered" people. On both sides.

You don't make friends with such statements...

Originally Posted by daletournier

The hypocrisy is often missed by those pointing fingers, truth is they are just as much part of the problem.

Very well said. Maybe they are only 87.3 % part of the problem, but still

Originally Posted by Reefmagnet

make the effort to berate others that don't agree with them and yet make little to no effort to actually make changes to their lifestyle to reduce their personal contributions to the alleged problem

Sorry but imho you don't understand the magnitude of the problem! It is not done with some changes to lifestyle.

If you take to heart what e.g. Rees wrote, it would mean uttermost intrusion in the current way of living (which neither Obama, Trump or Sanders could dictate). What to do with SEA, Africa population dynamics? Likely our (EU, US) economies would collapse, 80 % of cruisers here gone. Nobody wants this and so the problems maybe will aggravate in 2050 (when many current politicians and cruisers are, sorry, already (almost) dead).

This is not to say that I don't try to minimize my personal emissions and hope that many others do the same!

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Hardhead

I think that applies to both sides of the issue. IMO, we're headed for some major political fireworks on this issue in the next 10 years. Likely there will be some legislative changes brought about by the increase in younger voters. From those that I know, their view is that social security is falling apart, they will never have the stable pensions of their grandparents, higher education has far outpaced the rate of inflation, and the environment is a low priority, so many don't feel they owe anything to the current status quo.

If people truly understood the size of the unfunded liabilities they'd be shocked.

Natural selection is real, it applies to finances and the environment not just creatures in a jungle, theres consequences regardless of whether they are convenient.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by Budawang

Most deniers believe there is one kind of conspiracy or another to explain away the overwhelming scientific consensus that AGW ìs real and a serious threat. Favourites include weather data tampering, globalists trying to take over the world, scientists are corrupt and only care about grant money and leftists cynically using it as a Trojan horse to push through crazy leftist policies. It would be comical if the consequences weren't so serious.

Yep no tampering or corruption in the science going on here. We must believe "the scientists" unquestionably.


p.s. You forgot to include Big Oil's subsidisers. You know, those that fill their boats and cars up with the stuff.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

Gee, Ash Wednesday fires, Black Friday fires all worse than the fires of today? Not according to the people who are out there fighting today's fires or those people who fought the fires decades ago and have since retired. The word "catastrophic" was not used in relation to forest/bush fires until recently and people are saying they have never seen "fire tornadoes" until recently.

The thing is these fires are getting worse all over the planet. Rain forests that have never before or very seldom have burned in the past are burning in many parts of the world.

Sorry, but you deniers are missing it all. You stick your head out the window and say to yourselves and everyone else around things like " no problem here so things must be AOKAY". Things are not AOKAY with the world and scientists from all corners of the earth are telling us that.

You are entitled to your beliefs but the fact that you always show up anytime that climate change is even mentioned with your uninformed rhetoric makes me suspicious of your motives and your beliefs.

What a fool. 47 dead in Ash Wednesday and around 3500 homes lost. Do some research instead of drinking the kool-aid.

[boatpoker]

I've needed a doctor, a mechanic and a building inspector. Not once in my life have I needed a celebrity or oracle.

[Hardhead]

Originally Posted by daletournier

If people truly understood the size of the unfunded liabilities they'd be shocked.

Natural selection is real, it applies to finances and the environment not just creatures in a jungle, theres consequences regardless of whether they are convenient.

What young people see is that the wealthy are getting far wealthier, and the middle class is dying. Most of the middle class remaining have very tenuous financial security. A few missed paychecks, or a large medical bill, and it can all dissolve. Unfortunately, it's hard to know which way economic natural selection will go.

[Reefmagnet]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Indeed, she is courageous in that regard. She is perhaps aware that if she flew, people would be up in her face about it. Too bad she's taking an elevated risk to pass somebody's purity test. Hope she's enjoying the sail.

Re the "mindset" - you're just playing a word-game: fat people can't be nutritionists. A wealthy businessperson can't advocate for social justice. And so on.

It's an unwinnable game - there's no level of personal action short of martyrdom that would ever move the needle for those who make that argument.

And most important, you can't solve a systemic problem just with voluntary individual action.

This sums it up nicely.

Well I've just been called a denier with apparent sinister intentions (^^^) yet if I lived any greener than I do at the moment, I'd be living in a bush camp. And I've been doing so for a number of years now and this was a decision based on lifestyle and conservation and not necessity.


So I'm quite happy to practice what I preach and take conservative action for the good of the planet even if I haven't swallowed the climate change blue pill.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

You are entitled to your beliefs but the fact that you always show up anytime that climate change is even mentioned with your uninformed rhetoric makes me suspicious of your motives and your beliefs.

EXACTLY what many are likely thinking about you! Why is it so difficult to accept that not everyone thinks alike without impugning their motives & beliefs??