Solo Sailing without Auto Pilot?

[Tillerjockey]

If I'm understanding it you're planning on crossing the atlantic in a Grampian 23 ? IMHO this boat is in no way an offshore boat for such a passage. I had a Grampian 23 as my first cruiser. I enjoyed the boat for several years as a coastal cruiser. Depending on the wave period, once the wave height gets to be over about 1/3 the overall length the boat is very difficult to steer, as the outboard rudder doesn't have enough bite to keep the boat on course. Good luck but I'm with the others that sailing solo without a wind vane is a tough way to go. Also I don't believe that the capsize resistance is that of an offshore boat.

[JOHNMARDALL]

A lot of good information so far, but thinking outside the box- installing one of our excellent electric toilets as a helmsman's chair will greatly facilitate your single handed voyages without an autopilot.. It's certainly on the things-to-do list for my old boat.

Good luck.

John Mardall
Vetus Maxwell Grop.

[robert sailor]

Web Chiles is a wonderful offshore sailor..not sure where he is now but he was on a circumnavigation with Moore 24. He likes to have a half dozen of the cheap tiller pilots with him. The Grampian 23 is certainly as capable offshore as a Moore 24 but in these boats it's way more about the sailor than the boat.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by JOHNMARDALL

A lot of good information so far, but thinking outside the box- installing one of our excellent electric toilets as a helmsman's chair will greatly facilitate your single handed voyages without an autopilot.. It's certainly on the things-to-do list for my old boat.

Good luck.

John Mardall
Vetus Maxwell Grop.

I think the book you are looking for is "Self-steering for Sailing Craft" by John S. Lechter.

The other thing to remember, if you are planning to have no self-steering, is you'll be out all the time in whatever the weather is. Gotta have some sort of protection from the elements and sun, and some kind of really comfy lounge chair, you're gonna want to read a book or something once in a while with your foot or knee on the tiller and one eye on the sails and compass.
Really, the boat has to be able to steer herself one way or another.

EDIT! John S. Letcher

[TrentePieds]

Pete7 sez the OP's boat is a Grampian 23. I haven't been able to find that the OP sez so, so perhaps Pete has the information by virtue of being a moderator.

Should the OP indeed be proposing to cross big water in such a cockleshell while he feels the need to come here to ask how and with what to steer, I, meaning no disrespect at all but rather our of concern for the man's welfare, begin to worry whether he is, in fact, conversant with all the OTHER aspects of captaincy required to do the job safely.

What, for instance, is he proposing to do about navigation in a vessel so small that taking good sextant sights is a major feat that taxes even those who do it frequently? How does the OP propose to feed himself and with what? How will he stretch a supply of say 20 gallons of potable water to last the entire crossing?

Rhetorical questions, obviously, and they need not be answered for my sake, but I think there is a case to be made for the OP asking HIMSELF those questions. And then, perhaps, running the answers he will give himself past us to see if they are viable :-)!

TP

[roverhi]

You can probably do it but why??? Self steering vanes do it quietly, dependably and pretty cheaply if you buy a used one. With a few exceptions, getting a boat to self steer requires a serious hit on performance. Non vane/autopilot setups also often won't work over any reasonable length of time because they can't handle a small change in wind or sea conditions. If you must spend little money and a lot of time so the boat will maintain a course for a few minutes, have at it.

I've lived without autopilot but wouldn't go to sea without a selfsteering vane. With a working vane never touch the helm whether coastal or open ocean sailing. Once clear of the harbor, the vane does the job. The exceptions are hard on the wind and downwind with a dual jib and lines led to the tiller. The cost of the latter would probably pay for a good used vane.

Might look into a Tiller Tamer if you just want to keep the rudder in position for very short term heading control
https://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&ke...28a90732_e_p38

A tiller or wheel pilot will get you some freedom from the helm but may not work for other than powering and probably won't work when conditions get challenging. They are simple to install but don't have the oomph to steer a boat with a heavy helm or challenging conditions. For those conditions an under deck autopilot and a lot of battery capacity are needed.

[billknny]

Originally Posted by akprb

I would also encourage less browsing the internet and get out on the water and experience it as often as possible in as many conditions as possible on as many boats as possible with as many different people as possible.

I'll double up on that comment... and add a bit: Read everything you can get your hands on written on the topic. EVERYTHING. Old and new. The oceans haven't changed.

Asking questions on the internet doesn't count. You have no real way of evaluating the contradictory information you always get. Yes, you can get contradictory information from books, but you at least know the author's background, and hopefully can understand why he/she is saying what they are.

When it comes to learning how to trim sails, even reading only helps to a point, but until you are out there actually pulling lines...

"All advice on the internet (including mine) is worth exactly what you paid for it."

[donradcliffe]

Originally Posted by Don C L

I think the book you are looking for is "Self-steering for Sailing Craft" by John S. Lechter.

The other thing to remember, if you are planning to have no self-steering, is you'll be out all the time in whatever the weather is. Gotta have some sort of protection from the elements and sun, and some kind of really comfy lounge chair, you're gonna want to read a book or something once in a while with your foot or knee on the tiller and one eye on the sails and compass.
Really, the boat has to be able to steer herself one way or another.

Its John Letcher, not Lechter. A classmate and a very smart guy.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

Its John Letcher, not Lechter. A classmate and a very smart guy.

OOOPS!! Sorry! And I am holding the book! Where are my galsses?

[blueazimuth]

Borrow, beg or buy John S Letcher's book
"Self Steering for Sailing Craft"
It's the bible on self steering.

[hamburking]

I understand your question, and I commend your effort. Joshua Slocum sailed around the world alone without an AP, so it can certainly be done.

But a tiller autopilot is only a few hundred dollars. One of the greatest values in sailing. And if used correctly, uses hardly any electrical power at all on a smaller boat. Along with roller furling, it has changed solo sailing entirely. Solo sailing can now be done with little effort or stress. So why would you create a problem that could be so easily solved. I've owned and used autohelm 800, 1000, and 2000+. All excellent, reliable, and inexpensive.

[gjordan]

A boat that small can be steered by one of the early wind vanes that doesnt even have a paddle in the water. I have seen DIY plans on the net, so they should be easy to locate. It will still take good sail trimming, but much more veratile than sheet to tiller, and way more reliable than trying to keep a tiller pilot dry in a 23 foot boat. Just another opinion ______Grant.

[thomm225]

The new electric autopilots also use very little power.

On a sunny day your small 60-100 watt solar panel can easily power it (thru your battery)

You just have to get used to the noise.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhNQs1DUaDY

[grantmc]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

Its John Letcher, not Lechter. A classmate and a very smart guy.

Any relation to Hannibal ??

[Chuck Hawley]

I have sailed solo approximately 7500 miles in various smallish sailboats. The times I recall as being the worst were when the autopilot had either failed or the electrical system was sufficiently charged to operate the autopilot. I've used the Tillermaster (now that takes you back a few decades, eh?) and early versions of the Autohelm 2000. Current generations are far better, but they should be treated with care if you only have a single pilot and you have a large ocean.

It would have been very difficult to sail downwind to Hawaii in either of my boats without an autopilot. They responded to the swells too quickly, and I would have been going from accidental gybe to accidental gybe all the way to Hanalei. While I had my share of gybes with the pilots, at least they were trying to keep me headed in the right direction.

If you only have a single pilot, you may want to mount the drive unit below decks and use a Morse or Teleflex control cable to transmit the force to the tiller.

Cheers, and good luck,

Chuck