‘We feel truly alive’ - Observer article about the newest crop of liveaboards.

[Mariefred]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

I was wondering if this whole living on a fiver thing is more like a feeling than reality

I'll bet there's a lot of truth to that. Selective perception. I'm guilty of it. I feel like I'm living a super-frugal lifestyle, but I often forget about the days I did a £200+ food and booze run, or the days I pay the monthly bills at the end of the month. Like child birth, the painful days tend to get forgotten about when looking at the overall.

I'm endlessly surprised at just how little money I have in the account.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Luxury depends. My wife and I were just talking about how we think our life is one of luxury, yet we have no washing machine, no built in air cond or other things people think of as luxurious.

Instead we live in an old race boat with no headliner and exposed pipes and wires. But we have comfy settees, and intimate lighting and a great galley where we prepare fantastic meals and serve really good wine. We shop where we want to and buy the foods we love. We have a very nice (but old) luxury car. We go to the gym three times a week and work out. We sail a lot and we work at it. Not roller furling, electric winches, bow thrusters or fat rear ends from sitting. We are active. But we think that our life is one of luxury and yet we think we are frugal.

Did we change our lifestyle when we moved aboard? Well we lived in a small studio apartment in downtown, not much different from our boat. So I guess not.

We see people walking down the dock from their really nice boats, perfect clothes, poodle on a leash, and they've just sent some guys to their boat to do the work that they prefer not to do anymore. I can't imagine them going to the foredeck to pull down the spinnaker or throwing in three tacks just to stay out of the tide.

We feel alive, they are thinking about the next Nordstrom sale.

I think you, I, and our two spouses, would find a lot to agree on about this lifestyle.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I think you, I, and our two spouses, would find a lot to agree on about this lifestyle.

Yes, I think so.

[MicHughV]

Before I started sailing, I wanted to see Europe. Back in the day, there was a book "see Europe on $5 a day....this was in the early to mid 70's. This presumed you'd be living in Youth Hostels, with a "eurorail pass", etc.....this amounted to around $150/month. I made it for almost three years, with a little work here and there.

Fast forward to early 1980, I set off on my homebuilt boat to see the world with a budget of $400/month. I didn't have much, no electronics, no fancy gadgets, etc, but I did have "youth". Nothing was too hard, too difficult, too harsh for me.
Life was simply an adventure. IF I had $10 in mah pocket, I considered myself " rich".

These days, boats don't leave the dock unless festooned with electronics, a/c, gensets, and all the whizz-bang of modern day technology, but even though some might leave the dock, they don't go anywhere.

I think the most important ingredient for any trip is a " zest for living"..sadly, this is a rare commodity these days.

[Simi 60]

I never considered a house with large refrigeration, a comfortable walk around bed, TV, a washing machine, running water and electricity to be luxury, most any house in a first , 2nd and even many in 3rd world country's would have that.

I don't see why a boat that has that should be considered luxury.
Especially now with cheap battery, solar and tech.

What is a luxury on boats is space and ability to carry the above standard household items
But even that need not be overly expensive

[GILow]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

?..Others (of us) are the more beans and rice crowd. ...

Hang on… you can afford BEANS!? The decadence.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by MicHughV

...did have "youth". Nothing was too hard, too difficult, too harsh for me.
Life was simply an adventure. IF I had $10 in mah pocket, I considered myself " rich"...
I think the most important ingredient for any trip is a " zest for living"..sadly, this is a rare commodity these days.

MicHughV, There are still a lot of young folks with that same attitude. I see them every year. They arrive here with cheap as **** boats with nothing but some raggedy sails and a motor that barely runs and not enough money to buy a night's berthing in the marina. They do have a zest for living and everything is an adventure. They have no idea where the next $500 is going to come from but they are not afraid.

They have fun and they find others like themselves and they think of me the same as their parents.

But gradually they change into, sadly, serious adults. They tire of no money for a meal and a boat that doesn't work. When they have also tired of trying to make it doing odd jobs in the third world they drift back to the US and go back to real jobs and they might spend the rest of their lives remembering how good it was when they were young and lived free.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

I never considered a house with large refrigeration, a comfortable walk around bed, TV, a washing machine, running water and electricity to be luxury, most any house in a first , 2nd and even many in 3rd world country's would have that.

I don't see why a boat that has that should be considered luxury.
Especially now with cheap battery, solar and tech.

What is a luxury on boats is space and ability to carry the above standard household items
But even that need not be overly expensive

Simi60, you have a point there. I don't know how to characterize what amounts to "luxury" on a boat to these folks. Their condo back home is space and light and a view and marble counter tops and a bathroom with every bedroom of which there are at least three and a cleaning lady. But if the boat doesn't have that "feel" then it isn't luxury. I am sure your power boat is pretty nice and has tons of room for those standard appliances, but honestly, if it isn't new and really perfect, it doesn't cut it with the folks used to "luxury". And I can't believe that they would be happy with my level of living. And by the way, I wouldn't be happy with yours either, because I couldn't sail it.

[Bowdrie]

Quite an entertaining thread.
I once spent a day on a 130' motor yacht that was built in the 1930s.
It had real staterooms and bathrooms, Twas to be expected.
But I was in heaven in the engineering spaces.
Forward of the engines, (original Atlas Imperials, direct reversing/direct drive, with all the valve gear exposed,) there was a shop with a drill press, a lathe, grinders and welding equipment, and a bench with a large vise.
Traveling chain falls on tracks graced the overhead, along with the banks of compressed air tanks, (for starting the main engines).
One deck above, and overlooking the engine room was the engineer's station, complete with a desk, speaking tube to the bridge, and engine order telegraphs.
In the corner was a crown jewel, a real Sperry Gyrocompass.
I was totally smitten, a real ship, and yes there was a teak grating for the helmsman to stand on, (if the Sperry pilot wasn't steering).
That was luxury.
Edit; I almost forgot, aft on the boat deck was a "smoking room" where the men could gather and have brandy and cigars and play cards.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

Quite an entertaining thread.
I once spent a day on a 130' motor yacht that was built in the 1930s.
It had real staterooms and bathrooms, Twas to be expected.
But I was in heaven in the engineering spaces.
Forward of the engines, (original Atlas Imperials, direct reversing/direct drive, with all the valve gear exposed,) there was a shop with a drill press, a lathe, grinders and welding equipment, and a bench with a large vise.
Traveling chain falls on tracks graced the overhead, along with the banks of compressed air tanks, (for starting the main engines).
One deck above, and overlooking the engine room was the engineer's station, complete with a desk, speaking tube to the bridge, and engine order telegraphs.
In the corner was a crown jewel, a real Sperry Gyrocompass.
I was totally smitten, a real ship, and yes there was a teak grating for the helmsman to stand on, (if the Sperry pilot wasn't steering).
That was luxury.

I spent a day on a boat like that once, Hagenes, somewhat smaller and a bit more of a work boat, but oh, how I loved the luxury of it.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Simi60, you have a point there. I don't know how to characterize what amounts to "luxury" on a boat to these folks. Their condo back home is space and light and a view and marble counter tops and a bathroom with every bedroom of which there are at least three and a cleaning lady. But if the boat doesn't have that "feel" then it isn't luxury. I am sure your power boat is pretty nice and has tons of room for those standard appliances, but honestly, if it isn't new and really perfect, it doesn't cut it with the folks used to "luxury". And I can't believe that they would be happy with my level of living. And by the way, I wouldn't be happy with yours either, because I couldn't sail it.

True, she's not perfect but she still provides the same function.

Let's just say a non pretentious poor sighted person would likely think it was luxurious as it provides similar amenities.

Same way as I look the older , more spacious classic Mercedes Benz.
To me they will always be a luxury car.

[Anders]

Originally Posted by MicHughV

Fast forward to early 1980, I set off on my homebuilt boat to see the world with a budget of $400/month. I didn't have much, no electronics, no fancy gadgets, etc, but I did have "youth". Nothing was too hard, too difficult, too harsh for me.
Life was simply an adventure. IF I had $10 in mah pocket, I considered myself " rich".

$400 in 1980 is now over $1400 due to inflation. That would IMHO be enough today for long term cruising assuming you are very frugal. Also helps if you don't go very far. Not much breaks in an anchorage.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Anders

$400 in 1980 is now over $1400 due to inflation. That would IMHO be enough today for long term cruising assuming you are very frugal. Also helps if you don't go very far. Not much breaks in an anchorage.

Seems about right from my experience. This is a but below what my spouse and I spend each month.

As to the continued lexicon debates, I think the point is that people will go to sea with the same approach they are used to on land. If you’re used to the big house, with all the labour-saving tools, then most likely you’ll expect the same on the water. And the opposite scenario is also true.

[MicHughV]

But gradually they change into, sadly, serious adults. They tire of no money for a meal and a boat that doesn't work. When they have also tired of trying to make it doing odd jobs in the third world they drift back to the US and go back to real jobs and they might spend the rest of their lives remembering how good it was when they were young and lived free.

Yes, all too true. Back in the day, I had no money, no health insurance, not much of anything. I walked pretty much everywhere or used a beat up rusty bicycle. I never questioned my mode of transport. If I had $10 in my pocket I felt rich.
But, I never once worried about these things. I was young and going to live forever. I did a lot of diving for my own dinner and was fit as a fiddle.

Fast forward to now.....sigh....where did all these extra pounds come from and...gulp...this grey hair...and I seem to spend some time at the Dr office these days, but I keep at it regardless....a little slower to be sure

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by MicHughV

Before I started sailing, I wanted to see Europe. Back in the day, there was a book "see Europe on $5 a day....this was in the early to mid 70's. This presumed you'd be living in Youth Hostels, with a "eurorail pass", etc.....this amounted to around $150/month. I made it for almost three years, with a little work here and there.

Fast forward to early 1980, I set off on my homebuilt boat to see the world with a budget of $400/month. I didn't have much, no electronics, no fancy gadgets, etc, but I did have "youth". Nothing was too hard, too difficult, too harsh for me.
Life was simply an adventure. IF I had $10 in mah pocket, I considered myself " rich".

These days, boats don't leave the dock unless festooned with electronics, a/c, gensets, and all the whizz-bang of modern day technology, but even though some might leave the dock, they don't go anywhere.

I think the most important ingredient for any trip is a " zest for living"..sadly, this is a rare commodity these days.

Funnily some long distance sailors On my pontoon have covered long distances all over Europe and the med. the boats all have the latest mod cons.

Plenty of zest for living but comfortably it seems. Good on them I say