Advice for first time boat buyer

[Capt. Hack]

Ha Ha! They should read Mark Twain

[tomtriad]

While your intentions are laudable, I think you've set yourself a pretty tight schedule for your intended adventure. Do you have a sailing background - dinghies or small boats? It might be best to get yourself some more offshore experience by crewing on other peoples boats, first of all to see if it's agreeable,(don't get seasick, etc), secondly to get some more experience sailing, and thirdly to try out different boats and find out what you would like. Maybe a cruising catamaran, maybe a trimaran, maybe a monohull.

Assuming that you have got some experience and are sure it's for you, then buy a boat. Then fix it up. Then sail around onshore, shake down the boat, and get some experience handling it. Then make your voyaging plans.

To try and compress all of this into a 6 month timetable may prove to be very stressful, and you could very well wind up having rather more of an adventure than anticipated.

I met some cruisers in the Bahamas last winter, newbies who had no experience with sailing but decided it was time to make their dream come true. They had a timetable and a budget similar to yours, bought a boat in FL in January, fixed it up and outfitted it for several months (which cost a lot more than anticipated), then set sail for the Bahamas and the Western Caribbean in February. We met them in Nassau after their maiden voyage from the US. They had been aground 5 times already as the Bahamas are quite shallow and they were not experienced boaters. Overnight, the wind came up and they dragged anchor, winding up on the beach. I helped them kedge off and gave them a few pointers about anchoring, using the radio in emergencies, etc. The boat was hopelessly overloaded, and an indifferent sailer - they had to motor most places. They made it as far as the Turks and Caicos over the ensuing 2 months, then enroute to the Caribbean, 26 miles north of the Dominican Republic the boat started taking on water, capsized, and sank - they were lucky to survive. They knew that watertight bulkheads had been removed, and other covers not installed, but didn't know how important these things were due to lack of experience. You can read their posts in this Forum (http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ml#post2647980). I you search for posts from "gotyourbone" you will see other parts of their adventure.

I'm not trying to rain on your parade - just be aware of what's entailed in order to make safe passages and have an enjoyable cruise. First things first - do your homework, find a good boat, make sure its seaworthy, and get some practical hands on experience before you head offshore.

[jkishel]

Regarding your schedule, I would suggest allowing more time than a long weekend to find and buying a boat here in Florida. Even with a good broker (I recommend Travis Lambert, Horizon Marine Center in Fort Lauderdale), it can take considerable time to travel to and sort through the boats that interest you. Boats are at anchor, on moorings, in marinas, back yard docks, etc. all over both coasts and down the Keys and arranging access and getting out to a boat can take several days. If your experience is like mine, you will find that many, many of the $50k boats you see will be disasters (even though they look great on the internet). There are some storm damaged boats around, especially since Irma, but even more boats have been idle and unmaintained for extended periods, badly neglected and really aren't worth trying to refit in my opinion. So give yourself a couple of weeks at least to find something serviceable that meets your needs, you will if you keep at it.

The purchase transaction itself may likewise take a week or two because of the time needed to arrange and conduct a sea trial and survey (you'll need a survey for insurance purposes and you'll need insurance to stay at a marina or maybe even a boat yard).

Retrofit time obviously depends on what you need to do and who does it. If you need to haul for more than a survey, boat yards here are still backed up with Irma repairs though that may abate somewhat by your time frame.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by jkishel

Regarding your schedule, I would suggest allowing more time than a long weekend to find and buying a boat here in Florida. >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If your experience is like mine, you will find that many, many of the $50k boats you see will be disasters (even though they look great on the internet). There are some storm damaged boats around, especially since Irma, but even more boats have been idle and unmaintained for extended periods, badly neglected and really aren't worth trying to refit in my opinion. So give yourself a couple of weeks at least to find something serviceable that meets your needs, you will if you keep at it.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I have posted this recently on another "What boat to buy?" question:


And there are two ways to buy a boat:

1. I want a mid-30s for $X budget.
2. I want a [specific boat, C34] and I'll spend the time required to find one (I did).


We did #2, because we KNEW we wanted this particular boat. We spent an entire YEAR looking at ONLY Catalina 34s. We saw some horrible examples of neglect and some very, very strange equipment installations.


Your timetable is optimistic at best, constricting at worst. And schedules when it comes to anything boat related, as you may have gleaned from these helpful replies, should be considered a good planning tool subject to (immediate & multiple) revisions.


We bought our boat from a fastidious PO. The then-12 year old boat was in superb, I say, SUPERB condition. We still had to replace all the engine hoses and upgrade the electrical system to replace the 1986 battery charger which was killing, not charging the batteries! You really should start thinking ahead about the basic things you WILL have to do with whatever boat you finally purchase. Shakedown cruises of short duration are one thing, but one of your line items should be "change all engine hoses." This is probably something every used boat owner has had to face, 'cuz, face it, do you really think someone who is selling their boat is going to go to the expense of doing that for you? Not being snarky here, it's just a reality.



That said, I believe all of us wish you nothing but the best in your quest.

[Sailorbob8599]

Originally Posted by B Tegge

Hello , follow your dreams. Nobody can tell you what is coming around the next corner. Just my opinion , you have to judge your skills. Half the fun is working on upgrading or installing a new system then trying them out. I took an old 1973 Irwin 37 CC gutted it . Found all the builders faults and repaired them. Sailed it up and down the east coast , Chesapeake bay and down to Florida where she is now. Bin through three hurricanes the old girl still keeps going. check out youtube vidio Liveaboard Kid by Tim Reeves. Wife took ill so I have to sell her. Sorry for rambling on but my point is you can pay a lot for a boat and still end up with unforeseen problems . There will always be hurtels to jump and problems to solve.

I trust you really meant "the boat" ??? . . .

[joecat22]

Kayaker;

I would respectfully disagree with a number of the responses you received, specifically those stating you can't find a decent 35' boat in Florida for that price range. It sounds like some folks have had some less that good experiences with brokers. If you find a boat that you like on YachtWorld and contact the broker yourself you will be dealing with the seller's broker. If try to buy a boat for sale by owner, there are numerous pitfalls that a newbie is ill prepared to deal with. The best way to do this would be to make arrangements with a broker to serve as your buy's broker. This will cost you no more than dealing with the selling broker as the overall commission is the same. I hope this helps. PM me if you would like to discuss further.

[jkishel]

Originally Posted by joecat22

Kayaker;

I would respectfully disagree with a number of the responses you received, specifically those stating you can't find a decent 35' boat in Florida for that price range. It sounds like some folks have had some less that good experiences with brokers. If you find a boat that you like on YachtWorld and contact the broker yourself you will be dealing with the seller's broker. If try to buy a boat for sale by owner, there are numerous pitfalls that a newbie is ill prepared to deal with. The best way to do this would be to make arrangements with a broker to serve as your buy's broker. This will cost you no more than dealing with the selling broker as the overall commission is the same. I hope this helps. PM me if you would like to discuss further.

I must have missed it, I didn’t see any posts suggesting that the OP’s price expectations were unrealistic, only that his schedule might be optimistic. There are lots of $50k boats in FL that may meet his needs. It will likely take more than a long weekend to find and a few months to refit.

[Welschrisby]

Dear First time buyer, I have a 42 ft Cooper Pilot House sailboat which I would love to sell to you and save you a load of work. I have just finished a major refit but am moving to Europe and can't take advantage of all my hard work and expense. She has new standing and running rigging, new mainsail and Genoa. recently re built Perkins 50 HP diesel. New GPS sonar and wind. Radar Autopilot, dinghy on davits plus inflatable and Kayak. New refrigeration with solar panels and controller. She is currently in dry storage in San Carlos Mexico. I have put about 70k into her but will sell her to you for $55K because I am in a hurry. She is fabulously spacious with 2 cabins, a spacious salon indoor and outdoor wheel steering, a large heads with a bath tub and shower. She is sea worthy and sails really well for a cruiser. She can take you any where you want to go and you don't need to do any work except re-locate. I even have a Mexican slipper who has really good rates and is a very nice guy to boot! San Carlos is an easy drive from Tucson. What do you think?

[JPA Cate]

Advice for buying first boat:

Buy the smallest, simplest boat that you think you might be able to tolerate. The first boat I crossed an ocean in was a 30 ft. Yankee. I'd suggest looking in the 26-29 ft. range, mainly because your dog is so large.

I think you are best to take the time to go look at boats yourself, not hiring a service. I don't think you can get adequate input from the internet to figure out what to instruct the service to look for because one's prejudices are personal. For example, someone might think the Herreshoff 28 (which is a little ketch) would be a good boat for you, and another might think you want a little cutter..... Only you can tell what would be cozy vs. claustrophobic.

Forget the "buyers broker" concept. Brokers basically want to sell a boat and receive the commission. If you are not dead certain exactly what you want, they'll try to sell you what they happen to have. Our experience with brokers has been that it is almost vanishingly rare to encounter one who listens carefully to what you want, and then tries to show it to you. You take responsibility for finding it. If possible, go see the boats on a day when it is raining--you get to discover leaks in advance.

Imho, it depends on your own skills what deficits you choose to take on in a new to you boat -- and there WILL be surprises!-- and, when there are, it can take bloody forever for others to fix *it* for you, whereas, you can choose to work 16 hr. days on the boat.
I would want a surveyor to point out all the flaws, but particularly those in my areas of weakness.

Sails can be purchased 2nd hand, and still be serviceable.

Old is okay. Not working depends on replacement costs. Keep a Defender catalog handy, to get an idea of costs.

Most boats in your price range will need either a new rig, new engine, or new sails. Unless you choose to rig it yourself, with swages you can do (using appropriate fittings, and there are threads about it, search on Sta-Lok, to enter that world), rig replacement usually means a lot of work, whoever does it. We have done ours, but you do need to learn about rig tuning, then.

Fix only what needs fixing to make the boat sailable. All the rest is optional. Use the boat as much as possible for a year. Then move to one which will better suit your long term needs, if you're still interested. [Cruising isn't for everyone; and your dog may get motion-sick.]

There's a sailing instructor here on CF, calling himself "Trente Pieds", he has a lot to say about how to buy a decent boat frugally. You can search (use the CF Custom Google Search under the Search menu) on Posts by Trente Pieds, to find some of what he has written.

I think your timeline is too tight, too. It is based on everything going right, and life just isn't like that. You need some "slop" in it for unexpected events.

Good luck with it, Kayaker.

Ann

[joecat22]

Originally Posted by jkishel

I must have missed it, I didn’t see any posts suggesting that the OP’s price expectations were unrealistic, only that his schedule might be optimistic. There are lots of $50k boats in FL that may meet his needs. It will likely take more than a long weekend to find and a few months to refit.

I believe post numbers 18, 19 and 28 suggests that a $50k boat will need extensive additional investment. Just wanted to assure the guy that he could find a decent serviceable boat in that price range and that not all boats in Florida are storm damaged or neglected. For example, I know of a nice Tartan 37 in Punta Gorda listed at $54k. The boat has been kept on a lift for the last 7 years and has received a number of recent equipment upgrades. He should be able to find that on Yachtworld by searching for Tartans in Florida.