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Old 02-02-2008, 09:17   #1
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Newbie Multihuller Seeks Advice

Hey all, great forum! I've read for hours/days now.

So, Im about to graduate dental school but I can't wait to purchase a multihull. I already got a job lined up with good $ comming in so I just need to find a the Cat the suits my needs.

1) I'm from California

2) Initially most of my sailing will be Coastal....to Catalina Islands.

3) Within 2-3 years I plan to do a California-Mexico-Panama-Cuba-Florida-Bahamas-Brazil-Argentina trip...no time limit to the trip....could take 2-3 years for all I care.

4) Not really planning to cross any big oceans.

5) Plan to do most of my sailing single handed


I'm researching 2 Cats that have caught my eye: The Gemini 105MC (able to fit in standard slips) and the Wildcat (yes, I've read about boomfozzle).

Would these cats be suitable for what I want them for? It just seems overkill going for a cat 40-50 feet when most of my cruising is going to be coastal (from port to port/anchorage to anchorage)...marina rates for these larger cats in california would be impossible $.

Thank you all for making this forum so helpful in all aspects
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Old 02-02-2008, 09:46   #2
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Welcome,

I have no experience with either of these boats. But, in Good Condition I think they should be suitable for coastal cruising. I would certainly expect the Wildcat to be a better off shore boat - most of them did a trans Atlantic delivery, and even Bumfuzzle sailed around the world - Geminis do not cross oceans.

The bad news is that California is not catamaran country. A Yachtworld search reveals 2 Geminis and 1 Wildcat for sale in California. So, you might have to shop for your boat elsewhere.
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Old 02-02-2008, 10:56   #3
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Southern California has light winds and steady northwesterlies. If you want to sail more and motor less then buy a cat that points VERY well and starts moving forward in winds around ~8 knots (a lite boat with good sail plan), otherwise plan on motoring a lot.

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Old 02-02-2008, 11:29   #4
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[quote=slomotion;131074]Welcome,
- Geminis do not cross oceans.

I guess it depends if you consider CA to Hawaii an ocean or the US to Europe....

The Gem doesn't come from the factory set up to cross oceans, but many outfit their boats properly and report high marks after they reach their destination....

If I were doing a circumnavigation, it would not be my first choice if I had unlimited dollars, but it can safely take you thousands of miles safely as seen below.

Brian


http://www.performancecruising.com/P...irst%20Leg.pdf
http://www.performancecruising.com/P...Second_Leg.pdf
Photos
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Old 02-02-2008, 13:05   #5
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[quote=FlyBri737;131092]
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Originally Posted by slomotion View Post
Welcome,
- Geminis do not cross oceans.

I guess it depends if you consider CA to Hawaii an ocean or the US to Europe....

The Gem doesn't come from the factory set up to cross oceans, but many outfit their boats properly and report high marks after they reach their destination....

If I were doing a circumnavigation, it would not be my first choice if I had unlimited dollars, but it can safely take you thousands of miles safely as seen below.

Brian


http://www.performancecruising.com/P...irst%20Leg.pdf
http://www.performancecruising.com/P...Second_Leg.pdf
Photos

I 've done quite some reading on the 105s. They seem like the genuine article when it comes to size, manuverability, pointing and cost.

I'm not myself much interested in speed. 145 miles in 24hr period sounds really good to me...thats 6 knots average...very decent. When I go to Catalina on my 27 foot 'leaner' I usually do 4-6 knots and I consider that really good sailing....hell, we could be moving at 2 knots and I would still be ok with that.

Isn't the Gemini good for performance in light winds?

I thought that it was one of the few cats that points well.

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Old 02-02-2008, 13:31   #6
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Hi elcubanito!

Don't know what your budget is / can be strechted to, but for your ideas you might like to look at the Ksenia33 cat at Erik Lerouge International - just round the corner in Europe but could be shipped in a 40'container and assembled where you want her.
New with nav. equipment for around €100,000, the demonstrator is also available fully equipped at €90,000.
Roger
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Old 02-02-2008, 13:39   #7
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Hi elcubanito!

Don't know what your budget is / can be strechted to, but for your ideas you might like to look at the Ksenia33 cat at Erik Lerouge International - just round the corner in Europe but could be shipped in a 40'container and assembled where you want her.
New with nav. equipment for around 100,000, the demonstrator is also available fully equipped at 90,000.
Roger
Don't really have a 'budget' but I don't want to blow 200,000 USD on a boat. I will be using it mostly over the weekends...for Catalina/Coastal sailing. Besides, I think that used boats are a better buy because of all the extra equipment/sails that come with it.

Another Question: Would a screacher be a good idea for So.Cal winds? Do most of the people in So.Cal do fine without them? Again, I'm not much for speed and don't mind gliding at 2 knots for hours on end.
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Old 02-02-2008, 13:49   #8
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Isn't the Gemini good for performance in light winds?

Yes.. Compared to my old 38' mono especially.. I try and keep from carrying excess weight which helps.. (50 books.. outdated charts etc)

I thought that it was one of the few cats that points well.

Pointing was one of the things that sold me on the boat. When we did our first test sail I was very impressed how it pointed compared to the other monos we were "racing" that day.. We have been very pleased with her performance since brining her home last year. We have found ourselves sailing instead of motoring to our destination much more.

[/quote]
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Old 02-02-2008, 14:11   #9
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Isn't the Gemini good for performance in light winds?

Yes.. Compared to my old 38' mono especially.. I try and keep from carrying excess weight which helps.. (50 books.. outdated charts etc)

I thought that it was one of the few cats that points well.

Pointing was one of the things that sold me on the boat. When we did our first test sail I was very impressed how it pointed compared to the other monos we were "racing" that day.. We have been very pleased with her performance since brining her home last year. We have found ourselves sailing instead of motoring to our destination much more.

[/quote]

Somewhere, can't remember, I've read that performance is close to 1/2 upwind and 2/3 downwind speed....for the Gemini. Cali usually has 5-15 winds. What would be the preformance like under these winds...just wondering.

Also, do you favor using a screacher...would it be advantageous?
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Old 02-02-2008, 14:23   #10
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A screecher is a terrific light air sail for catamaran. Mind you, even symmetrical chutes are terrific for cruising on a cat - you won't need a pole and jibing is a breeze if you leave sheets and guys attached to both ends at the foot of the sail. The Gemini might be a little narrower than ideal for use of a large symmetrical spinnaker without a pole, but you can still set the sail from about 7 feet to windward of the mast.

Geminis point reasonably well, but in a three boat test in Cruising World Magazine several years ago, the PDQ 32 (despite having keels instead of the Gemini's boards) actually sailed better to windward, according to the 'Rallyists'. The Gemini would be a decent choice for your current needs; of course, so would the PDQ 32 (albeit a bit beamier). There are also numerous Prouts on the market which, while slower, are also relatively narrow in beam and have the advantage of a terrific record offshore.

And at least with the Gemini or PDQ, I am confident that you will find the overall performance to be better than a comparably sized monohull, even in light air.

Brad
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Old 02-02-2008, 15:58   #11
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A screecher is a terrific light air sail for catamaran. Mind you, even symmetrical chutes are terrific for cruising on a cat - you won't need a pole and jibing is a breeze if you leave sheets and guys attached to both ends at the foot of the sail. The Gemini might be a little narrower than ideal for use of a large symmetrical spinnaker without a pole, but you can still set the sail from about 7 feet to windward of the mast.

Geminis point reasonably well, but in a three boat test in Cruising World Magazine several years ago, the PDQ 32 (despite having keels instead of the Gemini's boards) actually sailed better to windward, according to the 'Rallyists'. The Gemini would be a decent choice for your current needs; of course, so would the PDQ 32 (albeit a bit beamier). There are also numerous Prouts on the market which, while slower, are also relatively narrow in beam and have the advantage of a terrific record offshore.

And at least with the Gemini or PDQ, I am confident that you will find the overall performance to be better than a comparably sized monohull, even in light air.

Brad
Hey Brad, thanks for the honest response.

I just checked the PDQ 32, I love the looks but I it looks kinda cramped. Not a big fan of the aft cabins...I love the big queen sized main cabin of the Gemini. I'm a single guy, so my guests will be sleeping with me on the main cabin. I have a couple of lady friends that like to come with me to Catalina on a regular basis but space is a big issue.

As promised, I'm looking into a bigger 'play' area. jeje.
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Old 02-02-2008, 16:34   #12
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elcubanito - welcome to the dark side.

Quote:
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As promised, I'm looking into a bigger 'play' area. jeje.
I believe Gemini offers an option for a main cabin ceiling mirror. It's etched with "Objects in mirror are larger than they appear." You might want to check on this..........

Dave
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Old 02-02-2008, 19:09   #13
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elcubanito - welcome to the dark side.



I believe Gemini offers an option for a main cabin ceiling mirror. It's etched with "Objects in mirror are larger than they appear." You might want to check on this..........

Dave
Sounds like my kind of boat!!!!
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Old 04-02-2008, 11:44   #14
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Whatever you do stay away from a wildcat , that cat has got all the problems of most cats but combined in to one , sloppy work , elamination, keels coming of not by hitting something but spontaniusly etc etc, I have had my share before I started building my own boats.
Go for quality , it might one day save your life
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Old 04-02-2008, 13:02   #15
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love my PDQ32

I have a PDQ32 and I am very happy with it. If you don't load it too heavily it is a terrific sailing boat. The layout is exceptional for a small cat and if you spend any time in hot weather you will appreciate the ability to sail without a windshield and with the wide cabin hatch open.
The aft cabins are not large but they are very comfortable. You can sleep in without having the sun baking you thru overhead windows and the multiple hatches provide good ventilation. If you want more space you also have the option of dropping the salon table which turns the whole area into a large bed.
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