FP Bahia vs Robertson Caine 46 (464 or 4600)

[xxuxx]

Originally Posted by DotDun

And where is the dedicated freezer on the Leopard? FP Bahia galley is fine!

Um.......errrrrrr......... like dude! What were you on a charter version? Actually you can have 2 dedicated freezers if desired. One in the galley and one to the port as one enters into the main salon if one does not want a second reefer. And you really like those puny round sinks?

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

Um.......errrrrrr......... like dude! What were you on a charter version? Actually you can have 2 dedicated freezers if desired. One in the galley and one to the port as one enters into the main salon if one does not want a second reefer. And you really like those puny round sinks?

So tell me, have you actually used those round sinks? I would guess not, we've never found anything that doesn't fit in them.

[Kiwikat]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

Um.......errrrrrr......... like dude! What were you on a charter version? Actually you can have 2 dedicated freezers if desired. One in the galley and one to the port as one enters into the main salon if one does not want a second reefer. And you really like those puny round sinks?

I don't find the sinks to be so puny and actually quite like the round.
Currently getting the refridgeration remodelled including the fridgetop to create more usable space. Dedicated freezer in the port hull.

Lisa

[xxuxx]

Originally Posted by DotDun

So tell me, have you actually used those round sinks? I would guess not, we've never found anything that doesn't fit in them.

LOL.....square baking pans do not fit well for cleaning in small diameter round sinks......sorry to inform you.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

LOL.....square baking pans do not fit well for cleaning in small diameter round sinks......sorry to inform you.

Obviously, your dishes are larger than ours. Again, it makes me wonder if you are citing actual experience.

[Jim Woodall]

Having sailed both boats I would go with the R&C. Better sailing, better layout and better built. The FP is dreary down below and the galley is not user-friendly for most sailors. The R&C boats sail much better and pounding now and again doesn't change that. When one compares the boats very closely the R&C emerges as a better boat; although, the FP is a good solid boat as well.

[Shrubb]

@ xxuxx thank you for your answer. Indeed good food is as important to me as good sails for a long cruise ! My wife favours Leopard for living space and comfort. I like it too, provided its behaviour in sailing is gratifying, in heavy wind and sea, and in light airs as well.
@ Jim Woodall (and others) what performances have you recorded ?

[arch]

We own a Bahia 46 (1997) for nine years. It has traveled over 13,000 miles. Have taken it down to Fort Pierce 4 times from Long island. We have been in 30 to 40 foot sea about 200 miles off of North Carolina surfing down waves at 20 plus knots. Very buoyant forward hulls.
Pro's:
Love the layout.
Good bridge-deck clearance. Important when those ocean waves are sliding through the hull.
Engines power it just fine.


Cons:
Have replaced one engine and probably the other engine is due.
Both sail-drives have been replaced and may need to be replace again.
50 percent of the standing rigging has been replace.
Definitely not overbuilt, especially the area around the escape hatches.
I could feel them buckle during ocean swells.
Wish the fit and finish were better like a Lagoon, but considering it's cost, amount of sea mileage and quirks, we still love the boat. We will continue to pour money into it's upkeep.
Frank

[Doe818]

As some others have stated, some clarification is needed, ie are you talking about the leopard 46 or 47? If you can get an L46 for bahia money then do it y/day purely from a $$ perspective as you could resell it strait away at a profit!! If you're talking L47 then a different ball game. I've sailed both (around 4000 miles on L47 and about 15000 miles on Bahia) and they are both decent ladies. The Bahia though is a far better sailboat and there are very few (even modern) mainstream 'production' cats that will outperform her if sailed well (including L46 which we've raced on several occasions and won easily). With a little extra investment you can take a Bahia's already good performance and make it seriously good (I installed a 5 foot bowsprit and code zero + cockpit reefing + a 3 person helmseat, now 200 mile days are a regular thing in complete comfort and gone are the days when the helmsman worked in no mans land). I find the Bahia to also be a very good 'feedback' cat, in that it is lovely to handsteer where its cable steering returns a lot of info. One thing that is often overlooked...the bahia has extremely roomy and practical enginerooms (seperated) which can be accessed in any wx...this becomes important over time. The lack of a hard bimini is not a major issue to me but thats a personal thing of course, I had some sides made that mean the cockpit can be completely enclosed at anchor which has been nice. Solar can be fitted to the bimini (I have) as well as the davits and they work way better on the davits anyway. Speaking of davits, the bahia has solid davits that are easily reinforced for even greater load. I now carry an excellent 13 foot rib with a 25hp on it which has changed my life! If you are able to get a bahia maestro (owners version), all the better as it has a HUGE owners hull that is a joy to live in. Another worthwhile mod is to cut down the saloon table as its way too big. I took about 3 inches off it all round and makes a massive diff as one can easily get to the other side now and its still plenty big enough. Bahia's have large water capacity (around 850l or so) and the temptation is to use it all, but performance drops a lot with almost a ton of water on board and the trick is keep it light. FP is still making miles to a large extent off the name the bahia made them, the replacement (salina) is not nearly as good a sailboat, but it is far more luxurious. The orana I won't talk about because I'm not a fan and again think the boat it replaced, the belize, was a far better sailboat. At the end of the day its those darn trade offs again and you simply need to get a craft which fits your plans and not the other way round...

[Doe818]

Just as an aside...we did galapagos to Marquesas in 16.5 days in the bahia this year...

[xxuxx]

Originally Posted by Doe818

As some others have stated, some clarification is needed, ie are you talking about the leopard 46 or 47? If you can get an L46 for bahia money then do it y/day purely from a $$ perspective as you could resell it strait away at a profit!! If you're talking L47 then a different ball game.

Obviously this man is skirting the issue. Like the title line says, we are NOT comparing the Bahia to a Leopard 47 but rather to the Morelli and Melvin designed Leopard 46!!!!!!! Just because you have Leopard 47 experience, it is not germaine to this discussion! Please try and keep this discussion on point.

[Tropical Home]

I own a 2009 Leopard 46 and can say it's a great boat. Sails well we always do 9 + knots average 170 nm a day without pushing anything and fully loaded. Handles bad weather very well and has very good bridge deck clearance. My boat has more on it than my house. Easy to have 6 people on board for a week or more with out being in each others hair. The hulls fly through the water and the way the boat is laid out you have endless places to hang out.

It isn't a race boat but it can hold its weight.

Okinawa Japan sailing - YouTube

[xxuxx]

That, Ladies and Gentlemen is what I am talking about! If you don't want to listen to me, listen to him.......the Leopard 46 is the way to got.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by xxuxx

That, Ladies and Gentlemen is what I am talking about! If you don't want to listen to me, listen to him.......the Leopard 46 is the way to got.

Your passion and fervor for your chosen boat is admirable, but at this point you are doing a disservice to the OP and CF by continually bashing what you believe to be competition with what appears to be nothing more than unfounded blather. If you have actual cruising experience with either boat, simply cite your experiences/likes/dislikes for each and let the OP make up their own mind. This thread doesn't warrant a cheerleader or moderator to ridicule posters that have a differing opinion from yours.

Are you is a position to gain from the OP's decision???

[xxuxx]

Originally Posted by DotDun

Your passion and fervor for your chosen boat is admirable, but at this point you are doing a disservice to the OP and CF by continually bashing what you believe to be competition with what appears to be nothing more than unfounded blather. If you have actual cruising experience with either boat, simply cite your experiences/likes/dislikes for each and let the OP make up their own mind. This thread doesn't warrant a cheerleader or moderator to ridicule posters that have a differing opinion from yours.

Are you is a position to gain from the OP's decision???

Well...........it seems like there is always someone here wanting to chastise another ie someone like yourself. Sorry you feel its "blather" however, Morelli and Melvin really are the state of the art design team these days. I have sailed both thousands of miles and actually there is no comparison but people these days still buy fiats. Are you one of those?