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Old 24-03-2015, 11:09   #31
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

Quote:
Originally Posted by Island Time O25 View Post
If the goal is to do more distant sailing and to learn boat systems, etc than buying something in semi-decent shape and bringing her to life/shine makes better sense...
I would agree with that. I think the operative phrase, though, is "semi-decent shape." Something that is a complete piece of junk, is a different matter. I don't believe that the boat in question, in this particular thread, qualifies as "semi-decent shape."

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Originally Posted by Island Time O25 View Post
The only issue I see in taking the 2nd approach is that newbies often overpay for TLC boats.
Whether you call it over paying, or under estimating the amount of work that will be needed, I see a fair number of newbies on this forum who seem anxious to buy a boat that is best suited for nothing but salvage. They think that they're going to buy a boat for $5k-$6k, spend a couple of months and maybe another couple of thousand "fixing it up," and then it is going to be ready to sail around the world. In reality, these boats are often going to require so much money to get into shape that it would be far cheaper to buy one in good shape to begin with. And then the repairs will be bleeding them dry for years and years, while they wonder what happened to their dreams of sailing around the world.

Look at the ads in craigslist, or sailboatlistings.com and you can see the evidence. Lots of "project boats" out there that someone has spent 5 years working on, has had some life change, and now they just want to get rid of the damned thing and be done with it. And what they are hoping is that some starry-eyed dreamer (much like they were 5 years ago) will come along and take it off their hands.

I really am not trying to be a naysayer here. And there are a good number of people who buy project boats, fix them up, and then move on to the sailing life that they were dreaming of. But for every one of them, I would bet that there are at least 5-10 of the type that I have described (and possibly quite a few more than that).

If you are going to buy a project boat, you need to understand that--first and foremost--you are buying a PROJECT! Go into it with eyes wide open, understanding what is ahead of you, and you will probably be successful. Go into it with blinders on, only dreaming of exotic beaches and idyllic anchorages, and you are probably just going to end up very discouraged and quite a bit poorer.

Again, to the OP... Your money, your choice. And I really do wish you the best of luck. But if I were you (and, as I mentioned before, in a way I am), I would walk away from this one.
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Old 24-03-2015, 13:01   #32
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

We have decided to walk away from the boat. The guy refuses to answers any questions about the accident and why the floors and ceiling panels need to replaced. I really appreciate everyone's opinions and advice. We wouldn't mind a project boat but definitely want the honest truth about the boat. No lies or tricks. Thanks again.


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Old 26-03-2015, 10:02   #33
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

This thread really shows the value of this forum, smart decision.
"If it smells like a fish" well!!!
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Old 26-03-2015, 10:37   #34
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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Originally Posted by fishbait58 View Post
We have decided to walk away from the boat. The guy refuses to answers any questions about the accident and why the floors and ceiling panels need to replaced. I really appreciate everyone's opinions and advice. We wouldn't mind a project boat but definitely want the honest truth about the boat. No lies or tricks. Thanks again.
Refusal to answer questions is a GIANT red flag in any situation. In this case I would walk on that basis alone.

Good luck in the search. There's plenty more fish in the sea.
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Old 26-03-2015, 12:02   #35
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
I would agree with that. I think the operative phrase, though, is "semi-decent shape." Something that is a complete piece of junk, is a different matter. I don't believe that the boat in question, in this particular thread, qualifies as "semi-decent shape."

Whether you call it over paying, or under estimating the amount of work that will be needed, I see a fair number of newbies on this forum who seem anxious to buy a boat that is best suited for nothing but salvage. They think that they're going to buy a boat for $5k-$6k, spend a couple of months and maybe another couple of thousand "fixing it up," and then it is going to be ready to sail around the world. In reality, these boats are often going to require so much money to get into shape that it would be far cheaper to buy one in good shape to begin with. And then the repairs will be bleeding them dry for years and years, while they wonder what happened to their dreams of sailing around the world.

Look at the ads in craigslist, or sailboatlistings.com and you can see the evidence. Lots of "project boats" out there that someone has spent 5 years working on, has had some life change, and now they just want to get rid of the damned thing and be done with it. And what they are hoping is that some starry-eyed dreamer (much like they were 5 years ago) will come along and take it off their hands.

I really am not trying to be a naysayer here. And there are a good number of people who buy project boats, fix them up, and then move on to the sailing life that they were dreaming of. But for every one of them, I would bet that there are at least 5-10 of the type that I have described (and possibly quite a few more than that).

If you are going to buy a project boat, you need to understand that--first and foremost--you are buying a PROJECT! Go into it with eyes wide open, understanding what is ahead of you, and you will probably be successful. Go into it with blinders on, only dreaming of exotic beaches and idyllic anchorages, and you are probably just going to end up very discouraged and quite a bit poorer.

Again, to the OP... Your money, your choice. And I really do wish you the best of luck. But if I were you (and, as I mentioned before, in a way I am), I would walk away from this one.
Totally agree. As someone who took on such a boat back when I believe I can speak from experience if not from authority. In my case the seller last asking price was $400 (down from $1,100 advertised on c-list). My budget at the time was under $1,000 but being a newbie I did not realize how expensive a haul will be. So after calling a few places and getting an estimate for the haul in the vicinity of $800-900 I told the seller that this would have to come out of the price if he wanted the boat off of its lot (he was being pushed by the buyer of that house to hurry up). He said if he found me a hauler who would do the job cheaper will I still buy. As his hauler priced the haul at $450 I had myself a boat to fix. And still, 10 years later, use that hauler.

Now the fun part. I had a marine pro relative of a friend look at the boat in informal survey (I couldn't afford any other type) and gave an estimate of $2-2.5K to fix what needed to be fixed. Relying on that info I figured I'll have an otherwise decent 25 year old 27' first boat for $3K, not bad everything else considering.

Two weeks after the boat was moved I find out my friend's relative has to move on a short notice across the country and a boatyard wants at least $6K for same job and will probably bill even more as more problems will be discovered. My solution was to advertise on c-list to find someone who works with boats and can do it at direct rates bypassing the boatyards. I found a guy who ended up doing a decent enough job (not perfect but the boat was my training vessel to begin with and not supposed to stay with me beyond 2-3 seasons) for which he received in exchange my old car which was for sale on c-list (that's how we found each other). Meanwhile advertising for such a handyman on some boating forums I came a cross a guy looking for any work as he was immigrating to the States from Europe. He did not arrive until after my boat was fixed but we became good friends and he helped me out a lot in the years to come.

Had I gone ahead and bought a ready to sail boat for $5-10K I would've learned so much less about boats in general, about the real and inflated costs of parts and repairs, haven't met my friend and would have been much poorer knowledge wise. By this chain of events I'm often reminded of the old Joseph Campbell's mantra of following one's bliss and how it will lead you to all the right people, places and things.
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Old 26-03-2015, 14:45   #36
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

Finally heard back from the guy. Said his wife was sick the reason for the delayed response. We had already left the area before his response but we decided to walk away anyway. This is what his response: "The vessel had water approx 8" above the cabin floor for some time. I am not sure how long but maybe a few weeks. So the moisture level went thru the roof for a good 2-4weeks and the ceiling panels were not made out of the correct product so they slumped.

The engine never got wet as it sits about 18" above the cabin floor in the aft.

Basically the boat is sound and the wood veneer's around your feet need to be replaced as well as more up higher. There is nothing soft in the boat except for an area on the deck around the two deck fills (seem to be missing caulking so a possible source of moisture and leaking?)

The mast broke above the spreaders and never fell down. No damage to the boat whatsoever from the mast issue. It does seem to have new chain plates however. So maybe they were tweaked and replaced. Vessel had insurance and was being restored when we purchased her.

I think the boat hit the bridge about 4 years ago.

We have sails, old broken mast, new mast - (Approx 1/2" larger for/aft and 3/4" larger sideways dimensions than original mast.) i.e. Its beefier. Same length. Vessel is keel stepped.
Original boom, good rigging, winches etc." in case anyone else was curious about the boat. We are looking at another boat that needs lot less work. Thanks again everyone for the info advice.


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