European Bluewater Cruisers

[crankysailor]

No one has mentioned Dufour.. they do appear in the Mahina bluewater list .. so at least at some point someone thought them of worthy construction. I recently saw an interesting specimen at least on paper, from 2002 if I remember correctly. Anyone care to comment on what the “good Dufour years” are? (Like I keep hearing Jeanneaus had their good years in the 80s etc)..

[GTom]

I can't recall any encapsulated keel-design Dufour. Since the Rafiki case, bolted keel is definitely a no-go for blue/remote coastal cruising in my dictionary.

[double u]

just other probs with the encapsulated keels...

[GTom]

Originally Posted by double u

just other probs with the encapsulated keels...

Like? Haven't heard about any full-keel plastic classic sinking because of keel problems. Rusting might be an issue if the keel isn't lead but thats a wallet question not a life and death question.

[daletournier]

A mates boat was taking on water. The encapsulated iron had rusted to a point it split the hull, water started coming in under shower liner if memory serves me right, was a significant repair. I know of another that had similar issues, and another that developed serious blisters from the inside, cost him alot to get the keel rebuild.

Very few bolt on keels fall off, not even worth the remark, there's more monos with bolt on keels out there than any other sort.

[teddythetwig]

Hmm I've spent a bit more than a year going over my Contest 40 on the hard. At 40 years old, there are only a few issues that were easily fixed by a skilled tradesman. If you are looking for an overbuilt, long lasting boat, check them out.

[crankysailor]

Originally Posted by teddythetwig

Hmm I've spent a bit more than a year going over my Contest 40 on the hard. At 40 years old, there are only a few issues that were easily fixed by a skilled tradesman. If you are looking for an overbuilt, long lasting boat, check them out.

Thanks! Hmm..not the first time someone mentions Contests to me.. thanks for the tip!

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by GTom

I can't recall any encapsulated keel-design Dufour. Since the Rafiki case, bolted keel is definitely a no-go for blue/remote coastal cruising in my dictionary.

So that makes Oysters, Swans, Contests, Hallberg-Rassy -- non-blue water boats, in your opinion?

[double u]

...wouldn't actually start the lineup with Oysters...

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by crankysailor

No one has mentioned Dufour.. .

Perfectly good blue water cruising yachts, as are all the other Bavaria, Beneteau and Jeanneau yachts. No better or worse, if you find a nice one buy it and enjoy sailing a modern fin keeled yacht.


Pete

[boom23]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

So that makes Oysters, Swans, Contests, Hallberg-Rassy -- non-blue water boats, in your opinion?

Add Amel to the list...

[Peregrine1983]

I had a bolt on fin keel on my 1976 C&C30. I never had an issue, but it still worried me because it was an old boat. So, I asked a guy at a boat yard here who has wrecked tons of abandoned sailboats left in his yard how safe an old bolt on keel like mine was. His response was, "Do you have any idea how hard it is to break the keel off one of these?" I said, "No."

He proceeded to explain his process of repeatedly smashing the keel joint with a backhoe or a fork lift, and then using a big grinder to cut the bolts... followed by more smashing with the heavy equipment, followed by more grinding. It didn't sound easy.

I know bolt-on keels do sometimes fail, but that gave me a little piece of mind.

That said, I couldn't get over my (possibly irrational) fear of older bolt-ons, so when I bought another old boat, I made sure it had an encapsulated keel.

[Peregrine1983]

When I think of European blue water, I think aluminum. Garcia, Alubat, etc.

[crankysailor]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Perfectly good blue water cruising yachts, as are all the other Bavaria, Beneteau and Jeanneau yachts. No better or worse, if you find a nice one buy it and enjoy sailing a modern fin keeled yacht.


Pete

Thanks Pete... so you mean any of these modern designs with a fin keel and spade rudder will hove to without drama should the s hit the fan ?

I promised myself once I would never buy a yacht without emergency brakes :-) so that is important for me...

[GTom]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

So that makes Oysters, Swans, Contests, Hallberg-Rassy -- non-blue water boats, in your opinion?

Actually a smaller Hallberg-Rassy is on my shortlist but its a full-keel boat...