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Old 08-06-2011, 04:14   #496
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Originally Posted by Doodles
To use the car analogy (which I don't think really applies but ...) a Hummer is probably safer than your Mercedes but you don't "need" a Hummer do you?
It's not. Sure you will come off better if you crash into a car, but because of poor handling, braking etc, you are more likely to crash and if you hit something bigger and heavier you will find yourself coming off worse. Drivers of suv type vehicles also drive with the safety misconception making them a danger to all other road users.

So perhaps this is accurate for sailing as well. Sailors on benjeanvaria's will understand the weaknesses of their vessels and plan passages accordingly, whilst on bwc .....
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Old 08-06-2011, 06:26   #497
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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No.
John Vigor wrote a book on this topic. A delivery skipper friend of mine has a detailed checklist of what is needed before he will take a boat offshore. This is not rocket science.

You want comfortable motion in a seaway (I dislike pounding, but maybe that's just me), a quality build, chainplates that won't pull out, rigging that won't break, hull throughs (and accompanying hoses) that won't leak, a sturdy rudder that won't break (plus an emergency rudder) and a keel that won't fall off. You want a reliable engine, at least two bilge pumps (one manual) decent tankage, good handholds on deck and in the cabin, and sturdy attachment points fore and aft for a sea anchor or drogue. You want a boat that will come back up after a knockdown, or decent escape hatches in the case of a catamaran. You want radar, reliable navigation equipment, a life raft and an EPIRB. A satphone is nice if you can afford it.

There a plenty of modern boats that are great passage makers. We all know what those boats are, vs which boats were designed primarily for the charter trade or the marina.
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Old 08-06-2011, 07:12   #498
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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Originally Posted by hoppy View Post
It's not. Sure you will come off better if you crash into a car, but because of poor handling, braking etc, you are more likely to crash and if you hit something bigger and heavier you will find yourself coming off worse. Drivers of suv type vehicles also drive with the safety misconception making them a danger to all other road users.
Hmm, sounds like one of those suv-haters?

I'm not sure we should stereotype all suv drives as having safety misconceptions that make them a danger to all other drivers. That's a bit dramatic for me.

And why are you worse off if you hit something bigger than you if you are driving a suv? Doesn't make sense to me.

Just in case you are wondering I don't have one. Subaru Outback and Honda Jazz.
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Old 08-06-2011, 08:21   #499
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
John Vigor wrote a book on this topic. A delivery skipper friend of mine has a detailed checklist of what is needed before he will take a boat offshore. This is not rocket science.

You want comfortable motion in a seaway (I dislike pounding, but maybe that's just me), a quality build, chainplates that won't pull out, rigging that won't break, hull throughs (and accompanying hoses) that won't leak, a sturdy rudder that won't break (plus an emergency rudder) and a keel that won't fall off. You want a reliable engine, at least two bilge pumps (one manual) decent tankage, good handholds on deck and in the cabin, and sturdy attachment points fore and aft for a sea anchor or drogue. You want a boat that will come back up after a knockdown, or decent escape hatches in the case of a catamaran. You want radar, reliable navigation equipment, a life raft and an EPIRB. A satphone is nice if you can afford it.

There a plenty of modern boats that are great passage makers. We all know what those boats are, vs which boats were designed primarily for the charter trade or the marina.
Maybe we all don't know which boats meet your requirements.

Except for some equipment, my boat has all those things! And it came that way stock!

You just keep making the agruement at ALL models of a given manufacturer doesn't. It's like saying because Toyota makes a small inexpensive model that it must mean that their Lexus models are the same.
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Old 08-06-2011, 08:29   #500
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

Well, you can start with John Neal's list of boats that one very experienced cruiser considers suitable for going offshore. I'm sure that list has been posted here a million times.
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Old 08-06-2011, 09:08   #501
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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Well, you can start with John Neal's list of boats that one very experienced cruiser considers suitable for going offshore. I'm sure that list has been posted here a million times.
thats the answer............
MARK,
your experance for your trip around this big blue marble in you Beneteau dosent mean a hoot, until you write a book about it..
better get your pencil out..
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Old 08-06-2011, 09:19   #502
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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Well, you can start with John Neal's list of boats that one very experienced cruiser considers suitable for going offshore. I'm sure that list has been posted here a million times.
I don't see "Sam Devlin Custom 28.5" on the list...
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Old 08-06-2011, 12:53   #503
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

LOL, if every good custom cruising boat were on the list, it would be a very long list. BTW I've just sold Means of Grace and I'm shopping for a new boat. It won't be a Jenneau, Bavaria, Hunter, Beneteau or Catalina, that's for sure.
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Old 08-06-2011, 13:17   #504
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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LOL, if every good custom cruising boat were on the list, it would be a very long list. BTW I've just sold Means of Grace and I'm shopping for a new boat. It won't be a Jenneau, Bavaria, Hunter, Beneteau or Catalina, that's for sure.
So - out of general interest - what are you looking to buy?
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Old 08-06-2011, 13:27   #505
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

I'm looking to buy a good used cruising boat in the 35-40 ft. range. I've seen quite a few boats already, including several catamarans.
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Old 08-06-2011, 13:33   #506
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Originally Posted by Doodles

Hmm, sounds like one of those suv-haters?

I'm not sure we should stereotype all suv drives as having safety misconceptions that make them a danger to all other drivers. That's a bit dramatic for me.

And why are you worse off if you hit something bigger than you if you are driving a suv? Doesn't make sense to me.

Just in case you are wondering I don't have one. Subaru Outback and Honda Jazz.
Nope not a suv hater. Did think about an X5, Ranger Rover and Discovery when looking for a winter car.

Suv's dont tend to need to meet the same crash testing level of safety that is expected of normal passenger cars, well at least that is how it is in Australia. They don't tend to have the same crumple zones and survival cells that modern cars have. Hitting something thet not going to be pushed out of its way will test the suv own safety design.

I'd rather have an suv than an old bwb, although a modern halberg rassy or similar would be another matter
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Old 08-06-2011, 13:38   #507
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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Originally Posted by Randyonr3 View Post
thats the answer............
MARK,
your experance for your trip around this big blue marble in you Beneteau dosent mean a hoot, until you write a book about it..
better get your pencil out..
I have to grow the beard first. (Then paint it grey!)

Oh, for the Author photo can I borrow a Sou-Wester from someone, please? Yellow is good so they can see my bobbing body after my keel falls off, my rudder pops out and the fordeck bounces to mast to the moon.

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Old 08-06-2011, 14:03   #508
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

Of course not, any sailor knows the only boats that can safely cross an ocean is a Hunter or a Catalina!!!
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Old 08-06-2011, 14:40   #509
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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You want comfortable motion in a seaway (I dislike pounding, but maybe that's just me), a quality build, chainplates that won't pull out, rigging that won't break, hull throughs (and accompanying hoses) that won't leak, a sturdy rudder that won't break (plus an emergency rudder) and a keel that won't fall off. You want a reliable engine, at least two bilge pumps (one manual) decent tankage, good handholds on deck and in the cabin, and sturdy attachment points fore and aft for a sea anchor or drogue. You want a boat that will come back up after a knockdown, or decent escape hatches in the case of a catamaran. You want radar, reliable navigation equipment, a life raft and an EPIRB. A satphone is nice if you can afford it.
That includes most production boats so.

Dave
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Old 08-06-2011, 17:19   #510
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Re: Can Jeanneau , Bavaria or Beneteau Be Good as Ocean Crossing Boats ?

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That includes most production boats so.

Dave
Some production boats, but certainly not most, unless certain models have been substantially upgraded since my last boat show.
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