Bestevaer 49ST

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Yes, we all work differently. I thought some people may be horrified by not having an actual table at the main nav location (pilothouse in our case). We had a huge nav table on our previous boat with everything all laid out together. For the entire decade we were on board we did not use the table itself at all for passage planning. Not once that I can recall. Nor did we ever sit and work at it. Its main purpose was additional bench space for the galley.

I think I will have adequate galley benches this time around , so a nav table has been eliminated.

SWL

Originally Posted by a64pilot

RE, chart table.
I have never used mine for its intended purpose, first it's always too cluttered, secondly within a meter of it, there is this large drop down table that is much bigger and you can walk around it if you desire. The dinner table is better for charts than my chart table
In truth I have gone away from paper charts, mostly because they are so difficult to find.

My background is not Marine, but to do low level night flying, it always started out laying out charts, taping them together, drawing a course line, then lines 5 km wide on either side of course and studying and making cheat sheets of hazards and landmarks.
We stored maps in old used rocket tubes, and usually had around 100 maps that we took to the field with us.
So my background is paper, and I naturally gravitate back towards it, but they are expensive and becoming unobtainable.

Later of course it became possible to "fly" the mission on a computer and paper maps slowly became obsolete

We never use our chart table for it's intended purpose eitther. Most of the time, our dive compressor resides under it and the table collects clutter. We look at large paper charts on the saloon table.

[olaf hart]

When refitted our boat I took out the chart table and put in a dinette.

The hull side has a vertical panel with the switch and fuse panel, instruments and radios.

There is a chart drawer under the table.

The idea is for double use, mostly a dinette, sometimes a chartless nav station, sometimes charts as well.

We haven't had any problems so far, and as our Nav options become more and more electronic, I suspect we won't have any in the future.

[DeepFrz]

What brand of running rigging are you using?

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

What brand of running rigging are you using?

Liros, a German company.
A combination of polyester (Herkules) and dyneema.

We did not specify this, it was simply KM's recommendation.

SWL

[Pelagic]

Noelex 77 very well designed and reasoned explanation on your fuel system and the choice of metal bowl.
I originally had the clear duplex bowls which developed leaks and brittle crazing over time.

On the ER refit I installed fuel polishing lines into the 3 tanks with supply from the original drain taps at the bottom and now all new Racor filters will be with metal bowls.

[noelex 77]

Battery Monitor: Simarine Pico.

If you are an electronics geek (like me) you are going to love this device.

The battery monitor functions in an unusual way, but there will be more about that in another post. First I wanted to outline its capabilities. It will do things no other battery monitor will do. Here is a brief list (bear in mind some of these options require additional shunts etc):

Monitor 6 battery banks
Display current information (such as solar panel input, fridge output etc etc) from 24 different shunts.
Display temperature information from 10 different locations
Display information from 6 tank level sensors
Display atmospheric pressure (including a nice graph)

These inputs can all be individually named and are displayed in digital format, as well as an analogue bar graph that can be tailored for the individual input. So the analogue display will show full deflection at the maximum expected value. There is also adjustable minimum and maximum alarms that can set for most parameters as well as data logging and calibration for many inputs. The data can also be sent via wifi and displayed on a tablet or smartphone.

I cannot imagine anyone will be using all these options, but my planned installation might give some impression of how this might work practice, although initially not all the capabilities listed below will be installed.

The main home page will display:
House battery voltage
House battery SOC
Net current into or out of the house battery
Solar panel input for each of the three solar panels
Fridge current output

Further pages will display:
Start battery voltage
12v system voltage
Barograph (in graph form)
Temperature:
It would be easy to go overboard here but I can see the following as potentially useful:
Air
Water
Battery
Fridge
Engine
Engine exhaust
Engine alternator
Some of the above would befit from alarms, which are easy to set.

Other options include monitoring the alternator output although this will require the purchase of an additional shunt.

So how does it perform?
I have only set it up on test bench so far so a detailed performance review will have to wait, but the initial impression is very favourable. The display, while small, is gorgeous and the software is excellent, enabling extensive customisation while keeping things relatively simple.

The battery voltage is shown to 2 decimal places (much better than one) and the reading is spot on. Many battery monitors get even this simple but important measurement wrong. Errors of around 0.1v or more are not uncommon.

Shunts of 500A (and more) are available which can be important for larger boats.

Drawbacks:
It is expensive. There are also so many capabilities that it is tempting to make the installation complex. There needs to be some thought whether the information will be useful rather than just cool to have.

The main question is how it performs as battery monitor. I talked to the developer at the Dusseldorf boat show several months ago and he is a very smart guy who understands battery technology and what is needed to design a good battery monitor. The monitor is sophisticated and works in a slightly different way to most other battery monitors (more about this in a future post). It will be interesting to see how this translates in practice.

[noelex 77]

A bit of background on battery monitors may help put the Pico into perspective.

There are two quite different approaches to producing a battery monitor.

The first monitors battery voltage and importantly the current going into (or out of the battery). In the simplest form this type of monitor counts the amp hours going into and out of the battery and uses this to display the net amp hours that have been drawn from the battery. If you enter the battery size it can also estimate the net state of charge in percentage terms. The better models are more sophisticated and take into account Peukert's law which simply means the battery capacity diminishes more rapidly than might be expected when there is a high current draw relative to the battery size. They also take into account battery efficiency (not all of the current entering the battery is converted into capacity. Unfortunately, this changes with voltage). A small number of the better models also use battery temperature as this effects battery capacity. As even a sophisticated counter will gradually drift out of synchronisation over many cycles, there also needs to some means of automatically zeroing the meter, usually when the monitor recognises that the battery is fully charged. How this is done varies.

The above brief explanation shows this type of meter is complex, and not all models are equally good. In my view, the better models are accurate, but they need to be set up well both physically with the correct wiring, and you need to enter battery details such as the nominal capacity and the particular Peukert's exponent of your battery type. Unfortunately, it is rare to see one set up correctly.

The second type of battery monitor works in a very different way. It does not measure current or temperature only voltage. Wiring is simple and there is no need to enter many details about the battery. Exactly how these monitors can convert simple voltage information into a meaningful display of the state of charge is never fully explained by the manufacturers, for obvious reasons. There are several possible mechanisms that could be used, and it is important to realise that these are not simple voltage displays, but devices using complex algorithms to determine the state of charge. The main advantage is that they are very simple to install and use. They take some time to "learn" any particular battery installation, but the manufacturers point out this only means the accuracy of the reading is constantly improving. The biggest drawback is there is no current display, which is unfortunate as this is very useful information in its own right. The most popular model that works in this manner is the SmartGauge.

Both these very different types monitors have very adamant supporters.

The obvious question is why not combine these different approaches in a single monitor? This has the potential of producing the most accurate battery monitor and overcoming some of the limitations of both approaches.

Surprisingly no one, to my knowledge, has previously combined these two methodologies. A couple of companies have hinted their products incorporate some "special" technology, which makes them different from conventional amp hour counting monitors, but I suspect most of this is advertising blurb.

The Pico is a little different. It has what appears to be a very sophisticated conventional amp hour counting technology, but will also work as a battery monitor with no shunt attached at all. You would be silly not to use a shunt. Simarine point out if the monitor is used in this way the results will be less accurate, but the fact that it works at all indicates it is also capable of monitoring the battery state of charge using the second methodology. Simarine also indicate their monitor works better as it "learns" the battery system, once again indicating the monitor is using elements of the second approach. Intriguing.

A battery monitor that uses both methodologies, the best of both worlds?

Perhaps this is the answer to settling those forum threads on battery monitors that can sometimes become a little too passionate?

Anyway, at this stage I have been very impressed with the monitor, but a propper evaluation will take some time. As I use the equipment more it might also be clearer exactly how the battery algorithms function so take the above comments as provisional rather than definitive.

Also keep in mind you can still monitor batteries with a simple dumb voltmeter. This method has some limitations, but is by far the cheapest option. If you have a simple electrical system it is an option worth considering.

[Kenomac]

Please let us know how it works out. I'm very interested.

[DeepFrz]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

Liros, a German company.
A combination of polyester (Herkules) and dyneema.

We did not specify this, it was simply KM's recommendation.

SWL

Thanks. I'm really looking forward to the launch and very impressed with your little ship.

[noelex 77]

The bellcranks for the autopilot drives are in the process of being fitted.

The lazarette is very large. We have found there is a need for lots of storage that is out of the main cabin area. In here you can store things like diving gear, fenders etc. This is gear that needs some protection on a cruising boat, but you don't necessarily want to store this type of equipment in the main living areas.

The finish has been left bare aluminium with an aluminium tread plate floor.

[Pelagic]

How do you access the Lazarette?

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

How do you access the Lazarette?

It sometimes requires contracting leprosy! But seriously, all that room around the steering gear is really nice. One of the things I like best about this new boat is the thought that has gone into the maintenance of all those things so often shoved into inaccessible spots. Well done, guys!

Jim

[Pelagic]

Lost me on that one Jim[emoji102]

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Lost me on that one Jim[emoji102]

Lazarette definition, a hospital for those affected with contagious diseases, especially leprosy.

Maybe a bit too obscure to be funny ... I have a weakness for such things!

Jim

[Caieta]

AFAIK a lazaret was just a synonym for hospital, which in the 19th century became the specific name for military hospitals. But happy to be corrected!