Understanding Florida 180 day tax waiver

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

Exactly what are the Florida sales taxes? Here in NYC (and also in upstate Erie County) the taxes are just under 9% so it is often worth using another state to save a bunch of money. If the taxes in another state are close to those in Florida, is it worth moving the boat when the difference may only be a few hundred dollars?

OP has stated their concern is not tax related.

[a64pilot]

I know airport control towers log aircraft because their funding is tied to how many aircraft and how often the facilities are used, maybe bridges are similar in that respect, because they do ask your name.

[Cheechako]

One question that arises is: How will they know you weren't out of state?

In other words, moving to a different state, say Georgia, requires no paperwork like going to and from another country. You might have taken the boat to Georgia and had it dry docked out of the water for several months. No Georgia registration would have been required (I imagine) if the boat is not in the water.
Asking for a friend..... :>)

[skipgundlach]

Hm. Several things.

It's improved from when we bought our boat, after which we could have gotten a 90 day cruising permit. Apparently that has become 180 days, which is very generous.

Detail has been provided whereby vessels, RVs and airplanes can remain out of tax range almost indefinitely via being in a RRF, under their CCC (registered repair facility, care-custody-control); ours was nearly 3 years, and no question whatsoever.

Once you leave that CCC of the RRF, you have 20 days to PROVE to the tax folks that you have left. Fuel or dockage dated receipts with the boat name are acceptable proofs. I have not heard of any other, though, if you were working with the two folks we were, both now either dead or retired, a picture of our boat with the name on it, in front of some recognizable out-of-FL place probably would have sufficed. In our case, we sent the receipt for fuel, and it was over.

State registration or USCG documentation was not of interest to them - just the proof of our 'not using' (which, as I was doing work alongside a contractor, COULD have been construed as use, as were the sea trials we did - with only a couple of instances of contractors, let alone RRF personnel, aboard) our boat until we left for 'export' (removing the boat from FL.

If you are going to bring the boat back in in less than 6 months, you'd be subject to tax. If you do as we did and not return for well over 2 years, still not taxed in any entity, it becomes moot. You will, however, have to register your boat if you intend being in FL for more than 90 days consecutively - and they count from the last time you can document you were out of state, which may not be the day of your entry.

However, just as a commentary in general, I don't imagine that the FL revenue folks have changed their style much. They aren't 'out to get you' unless you flaut the law.

So, my recommendation would be to get on the horn and see who you should talk to as an advocate. My source was Jimmy Kalfas, who was the consumer rep, and don't-recall-first-name Martin had Jimmy's previous job, which was more on the enforcement side. Both were very helpful and accommodating. It helps to know someone inside...

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

One question that arises is: How will they know you weren't out of state?

In other words, moving to a different state, say Georgia, requires no paperwork like going to and from another country. You might have taken the boat to Georgia and had it dry docked out of the water for several months. No Georgia registration would have been required (I imagine) if the boat is not in the water.
Asking for a friend..... :>)

Georgia registration rules.

Exemptions to numbering.

https://advance.lexis.com/documentpa...f-b154eb0494f1


§ 52-7-6. Exemptions from numbering requirements
A vessel shall not be required to be numbered under Code Sections 52-7-4 and 52-7-5 if it is:
(1) Not motor propelled; provided, however, that sailboats 12 feet or more in length shall require registration;
(2) Covered by a certificate of number in full force and effect which has been issued to it pursuant to federal law or a federally approved numbering system of another state, provided that such vessel shall not be used on the waters of this state for a period in excess of 60 consecutive days;
(3) From a country other than the United States, provided that such vessel shall not be used on the waters of this state for a period in excess of 60 consecutive days;
(4) A vessel whose owner is the United States, a state, or a subdivision thereof, which vessel is used exclusively in the nonrecreation public service and which is clearly identifiable as such;
(5) A vessel's lifeboat if the boat is used solely for lifesaving purposes; this exemption does not include dinghies, tenders, speedboats, or other types of craft carried aboard vessels and used for other than lifesaving purposes;
(6) A vessel that is used exclusively for racing;
(7) A vessel belonging to a class of boats which has been exempted from numbering by the department after the department has found that:
(A) The numbering of vessels of such class will not materially aid in their identification;
(B) An agency of the federal government has a numbering system applicable to the class of vessel to which the vessel in question belongs; and
(C) The vessel would also be exempt from numbering if it were subject to the federal law;
(8) Operating temporarily by virtue of evidence that an application for a certificate of number has been submitted within the previous 60 days; or
(9) Used exclusively on privately owned ponds or lakes, except for those licensed by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission.

[rmlarson1098]

Originally Posted by Fiftybucks

We want to go to the bahamas, but a year from now after my wife retires. It’s Hurricane season and the boat isn’t moving until Almost November which eats into my 180 days. I know there is the 90 day and 180 day waiver as I have just paid for the 180 and a filled out the notarized form. None of this is what I asked. It is not whether to pay taxes. We want to move it to Virginia but I am a newbie and can’t see doing more than 50 miles a day and it’s 1500 miles from Tampa to Virginia. It is is the time and does the receipt buy me more time. Do you see why I am asking?
Why do people get a receipt to show the boat has been elsewhere. Is it a scam? Are they doing something to get by the regulations? They do this receipt thing to what end? To who do they show this receipt? They can’t go back to Florida says right on the form.

If being a newbie is what's holding you back, AND if you plan to take sailing courses at some point, you might do what we did and hire a delivery captain to deliver the yacht, (in your case to Virginia) with you on board as owner/crew. It was more expensive than ASA sailing classes, but not crushingly so, and we found it far more beneficial than the ASA 101, 102, and 104 we had taken decades before.
If earning 'Certificates' is important it won't happen with a delivery skipper. And not every delivery captain will deliver the yacht with the owner on board. But you MAY be able to specify (or at least suggest) the route; as in offshore or the ICW depending on the season and your skipper's sense of humor.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

One question that arises is: How will they know you weren't out of state?

Taxing authorities put the burden of proof on you.

IOW the tax is due, they can lien or seize property to collect, until you have proved it is not owed.

[jmschmidt]

There are no boat taxes in Hawaii for any boats, documented, undocumented, state registered. I know its a long haul for you but what the heck, live a little.

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

Exactly what are the Florida sales taxes? Here in NYC (and also in upstate Erie County) the taxes are just under 9% so it is often worth using another state to save a bunch of money. If the taxes in another state are close to those in Florida, is it worth moving the boat when the difference may only be a few hundred dollars?

6% state but local jurisdictions can add some I think.

[winschwab]

You may know this, but here's some Virginia info:

The tax rate is 2% of the purchase price or of the current market value if purchased 6 months or more before it is required to be titled for use in Virginia. The maximum watercraft tax for any transaction is $2,000.

Since you will have purchased your boat more than two months before moving it to Virginia, it is my non-legal opinion y0ou would not be liable for the 2% sales tax. Also, your boat is documented which may or may not be covered by the above statement. A documented vessel is not required to be titled or registered in Virginia.

There are counties in Virginia (Lancaster county where I live is one of them) that do not charge annual "boat tax" (property tax).

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by winschwab

The tax rate is 2% of the purchase price or of the current market value if purchased 6 months or more before it is required to be titled for use in Virginia. The maximum watercraft tax for any transaction is $2,000.



Since you will have purchased your boat more than two months before moving it to Virginia, it is my non-legal opinion y0ou would not be liable for the 2% sales tax.

But if the boat will in future end up in Florida, you'd be better off paying it anyway.

Florida assesses its 6% use tax on a boat that **hasn't paid** it elsewhere, the fact that the previous jurisdiction doesn't assess such a tax is irrelevant.

Some places force you to pay their full rate, just deducting the amount you paid before in lower tax locations.

[Fiftybucks]

rmlarson --- i am a newbie at FLORIDA SAILBOAT PURCHASES. not new to sailing nor to boat ownership.. but not on the East Coast.. East Coast it is like a different planet. I am ASA certified, but need hours the actual onboard experience on something over 29 ft and submit the GPS trace.. which is what i have now. I have also acquired the CharterBoatCaptains License and have to do the 'Handling Demo' but have passed all sections of the International -ICC authorized license for Great Brit, and Greece etc.
i owned a 27 ft Catalina for many many years. I have other powerboats. so... yes i agree but I stll only plan to do 50 miles per day... I am 67.. and may have to do it alone. I can't take the shortcut as the mast is too high. has to be 47-11.
It has become a logistics problem. No I don't want to take the mast down or do the waterbag trick to heel over. So there it be. I'm going to Virginia. And I not because of lower taxes. I like the looks of it and the people I have talked to are so great! Already looking at marinas such as 'Salt Pond' just looks GREAT... we don't have stuff like that in Idaho, or Utah. and the winters here at my home at 7000' are brutal. snowed 4inches 2nd week of june.

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by skipgundlach

Detail has been provided whereby vessels, RVs and airplanes can remain out of tax range almost indefinitely via being in a RRF, under their CCC (registered repair facility, care-custody-control); ours was nearly 3 years, and no question whatsoever.

Once you leave that CCC of the RRF, you have 20 days to PROVE to the tax folks that you have left.

The link provided earlier shows that the boat has to have actual work done and storage doesn't count. When did you store yours? And what's an RRF. I looked it up and one answer was Romulan Republic Force.

[Fiftybucks]

Snead Island. Yes work is being done. Propeller service and balance. Check or replace cutlass bearing. Dripless shaft seal replace. Maybe bottom paint if the other items not too costly. So yes. Repairs. Now I do see a relationship of having those receipts.

[skipgundlach]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

The link provided earlier shows that the boat has to have actual work done and storage doesn't count. When did you store yours? And what's an RRF. I looked it up and one answer was Romulan Republic Force.

IMExperience, Registered Repair Facilities have a form to fill out, with the expected contractor, them or outside, listed.

However NOBODY touched our boat (including one employee who was constrained by management from going aboard to secure the dinghy flailing in a tropical storm) until I showed up 6 months later, despite my very detailed instructions to both mechanical and finish contractors.

It's (also) the Care, Custody and Control that the tax man is interested in, in that it's intended to allow the state to earn sales taxes and income taxes on the results of improvements/repairs/refit, while not burdening you with sales tax on the boat itself, in a period where you're not supposed to be able to use it (the RRF has CCC, not you). However, the reality in my case was that so long as I kept the tax man informed, it was very easy, and I could basically do anything I wanted, including storing it in the water during sea trials, some of which had no contractor person aboard, let alone a marina employee.

In any event, however, that privilege comes with an export requirement after whatever period there may be, such as the automatic (you have to ask) free 90 day cruising permit, or the (apparently - I'd not heard of it) charged 180 day cruising permit, both of which, before expiration, require you to remove the boat from the state or pay the sales tax. The RRF and CCC by same is not related to the cruising permits. When you leave the CCC of the RRF, your days before a tax obligation start counting. If you can prove that you left the state before 20 days, you're good.

Better, if some calamity were to occur, such as our wreck, they "toll" the days you are, again, in the CCC of (another, even, as was our case) a RRF. So, you get a pass in the middle of the 20 days limit. But, back to the question...

So, it CAN amount to storage, if you first set up contractors to list with the RRF; WHEN they start is not relevant to the CCC of the RRF