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Old 12-12-2010, 16:42   #166
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After reading through this thread, is cruising on the decline?

I can only think that once I am ready to "DO IT" after spending a life savings getting the boat ready, planning and providing a cruising "Kitty" and provisioning...

I MUST consider the costs of entry, visa's, red tape, fees from yet another undisclosed law enacted by the time I make it to foreign soil...

Is the dream of "FREEDOM" really that?

It looks like there are fees and red tape everywhere... Not "FREEDOM"

Guess with a conclusion of this nature then yes, the cruising life will be on the decline... But then again thinking it through with a conspiracy theory thought, the governments of the world are doing it to keep us all in place as life support systems to the systems we live under...

Nobody is exempt! Just pay the fees and be quiet about it!

Yet, the dream of reaching foreign soil and enjoying the later years in life in a tropical or at least a friendly place is a dwindling reality. Truly sad.

I just hope I am able to release the lines and "DO IT" prior to regulations prohibiting the dream.
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Old 12-12-2010, 17:25   #167
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Don't let a minority of fault finders put you off. You will find like most things in life the reality is not as bad as the fear. Doomsday is a lot more interesting to some than others, where ever you go there will be plus and minus to consider.
For a good part of the last 40 years Australians have been travelling. When I was young the done thing was to pack your backpack and head for England and Europe. Work there for a few years until you decided which direction your life was to take and then return. For most of those years the Australian dollar was not worth much internationally so we had to do a lot of saving and live on the bone to make the dream trip happen we were still one of the most if not the most travelled Nationality.
So now that we are not the el cheapo major destination we once were and others have to pay like we have always had to we are not so nice, well bad luck, pay or don't come just the same choice we have always had to put up with travelling the world, buying boats etc.
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Old 12-12-2010, 18:09   #168
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. . . Is the dream of "FREEDOM" really that?
. . .
Yes, and it has always been that - a dream for all of the thousands of years humans can record as history. It is a good dream and inspires many to strive for a better existence for not only themselves but for others too.

- - Hollywood and fictional novels and TV has taken dream of Freedom and trashed it into something that has never existed and will never exist.

- - Being able to cruise the world is a dream come true for most everyone doing it. But finding Freedom away from the ordinary, necessary and sometimes illogical rules and regulations has never existed and will never exist.
- - What you will find out here cruising is a peace of mind and massive reduction in the BS of daily life in the over-governed 1st world societies. It is the comparison of that with the minimally governed 3rd world countries that gives the illusion of greater freedoms.
- - These little countries don't have the resources and time to create massive interlocking webs of complicated bureaucracy. Not that they aren't trying to do that - they just cannot afford it. And the locals have more pressing concerns about eating and survival and raising their children to get involved in setting up "potty police."
- - So cruising away from your 1st world home country appears/seems to be an escape back to "freedom." But not really, life is just more immediate and basic out here. And that simplicity is so refreshing and addictive that going back is really difficult.
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Old 12-12-2010, 19:36   #169
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You keep avoiding the exchange rate which for most travelers (back packers) is a major consideration. Now considering the fact that for a great deal of your Aus visits over the twenty years your US dollar would have bought a great deal more AUS $ the change to getting no bonus is making more of a difference to your future plans than you want to admit. As of this morning this is the exchange rate 1US$ = 1.33774 NZ$ and 1Aus$ = 1.31755NZ$. So if I was sailing around the Pacific and needed work carried out and knowing that both countries had the same standard of boat repairs/building etc which they do where do you think I might go.
Additionally many of the people (US) that I spoke to crossing in 2008 were also heading for NZ first so nothing new there.
Meyer, you are really hung up on this exchange rate thing. If you want to believe that this is the factor that has driven some boats to avoid cruising Australia this year, why, go right ahead. If you want to believe that it is what is driving my decisions about where to cruise, go ahead.

I'm certainly aware of the decline of the US dollar... how could I not be? Sadly for us, it is weak against nearly all other currencies, not just the AUD, so wherever we go, it's costing us more than it used to. I assume that this is true for all USD funded cruisers. Don't much like it, don't like the things that caused the USD decline, can't do squat about either so we live with it. I can say honestly that the exchange rate is not a big factor in our decision process, no matter what your "life experience" has taught you. I can not make that statement about other cruisers.

As far as the costs for refitting, we've no personal, recent experience with NZ prices or labour costs. We have talked with folks who have such experience, and they say that NZ and Oz are pretty similar in costs. Neither country manufactures much of the hardware sold locally so it is imported from elsewhere. Despite the strong AUD, prices at Whitworths, etc, don't seem to have dropped. Fancy that! But I digress... Costs in SE Asia tend to be quite a lot lower than either Oz or NZ, so if refitting costs were the big driving factor, I'd expect folks to be bypassing both places and heading directly for Thailand (actually have spoken to a couple of boats that were doing just that, but don't think it is common).

Meyer, if you look back through this thread, you will note that a number of respondents have expressed concerns about the burgeoning bureaucracies in Oz and their attendant costs. These were both Australians and non-Aussies, and they were worried not only about the current situation, but where it might be leading. For us, the recently invoked termite rules are a distinct worry... and ya know what? Right here in the anchorage are two Australian yachts who are considering cancelling their plans to cruise offshore this season due to the risk of having to fumigate their yachts upon returning after a 4 to 6 month period away.

I'm kinda tired of debating this subject. The empty anchorages, as reported by myself and others, are real. The causes of the emptiness are debatable for sure, but getting back to the OP's question, it seems that there are indeed fewer folks cruising in this region than there were a few years back.

Jim
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Old 12-12-2010, 21:47   #170
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When I imported my boat in 2008 it had to be either fumigated or sniffedby the dog which cost me nearly $1000 dollars. The entemoligist who was present explained what the problem was and what they were trying to avoid. No I cannot remember as all I wanted was the clean bill of health that I received. The only reason the boat was deemed to require the check was the amount of wood (lots) the age and where it had been.
As for our "burgeoning bureaucracies in Oz" it obviously is not to efficient as somehow you have managed live here for a great deal of the last 20 years something many others have a great deal of difficulty achieving but that's another subject. Whether you like it or not exchange rates are a big factor that effects tourism which ever way its done.
It is also having a positive effect by increasing the interest in Australians going to the states etc and buying boats to sail home.
Your probably right about it being time to move on as we need to make room for the rest of New Zealand as they move over here. To the bad bad country with the burgeoning bureaucracies Oz and all those terrible rules designed to keep the country and its native wildlife free from imported diseases, even though you and others think they should not have to contribute to keep it that way.
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Old 12-12-2010, 22:29   #171
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Can't say I have any ambition to sail to Australia, $300 charge or not - spent a few months there years back, nice enough but nothing special or not available elsewhere. Maybe because for me not foreign enough?

Having said that, if I was sailing in that part of the world I probably would visit - but mainly because it's there. and so was I already. The odd chippy colonial would not put me off.

But that would be a few years hence, and by then the economic wheels will have likely fallen off there wagon - given that the Australian economic model (Borrow & Bubble) is not fundamentaly different from elsewhere in the west my take is that only a matter of time. Unless economic gravity goes anti-clockwise down under Sometimes important to understand the difference between smart and dumb luck...........

Couldn't be more wrong.

eg There are 17 banks in the world ranked AAA. Australia has 4 large banks. All four are in the 17.

No Australian banks went bust over the last two years. 149 and rising in US just this year.

The Australian Federal Reserve just raised interest rates for the fourth time rthis year in order to slow the economy.

Real estate prices have only fallen around 3-5% over the last two years.

There's more, but that'll do.




It might be best to stay at home. They're getting along just fine down there without you. Even Oprah says cruising on Sydney Harbour isn't on the decline and so does Russell. She says the beer is better too.


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Old 13-12-2010, 06:51   #172
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The best part of cruising to me has always been : arriving at a new place...... not knowing what to really expect.... what are the folks like......what is thier favourate kind of food etc etc...
NOT...gees, what is it going to cost me to stop here for a while? will my boat be safe if I leave it an go ashore...
How things have changed.... sigh
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Old 13-12-2010, 14:25   #173
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Well, let me welcome you to visit Canada then... no visa requirements from Australia, and you know what, we won't charge you anything to land here.

If you choose to come by boat, we still won't charge you.

We speak English (and some French), have an arguably nicer and more diversified scenery then the U.S. (hey, we can be parochial here), and if you come in the summer time, there are many places which are as warm as Australia.

Come in the winter time, and you can see the Northern Lights like no place else.

We know how to treat our tourists right, and thankfully our government does not deplete any funds they may have available which now can be spent employing all our wonderful people who understand how to cater to tourists.

You will even have some money left over to tip those catering to you
Couldnt agree more - wonderful place Canada, wonderful people great scenery just all around good fun. (gets a bit cold in Ottawa in winter for me though!)
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Old 13-12-2010, 15:01   #174
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Canada,
How do you plug in the heater to stop the engine oil freezing over when at a mooring
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Old 13-12-2010, 15:11   #175
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Canada,
How do you plug in the heater to stop the engine oil freezing over when at a mooring
We all have block heaters and long extension cords and if that doesn't work you just get the dog team to curl up in the engine hold.
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Old 13-12-2010, 16:37   #176
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In BC the beaches are piled high with far more firewood than you could burn in a lifetime . It takes me 15 minutes to gather a weeks supply. Never had a heating bill.
I have cruised most of the South Pacific, and wouldn't dream of paying any con artists $300 for the priviledge. Don't go there, don't encourage them, or you will encourage others to do the same.
New Zealand learned how important cruisers are to the economy when they shot themselves in the foot with the safety regulations of many years ago. They learned the lesson Australia has yet to learn.
BC is still very cost effective, as it only takes a months labourers wages to cruise here for year.
Yes ,goudging and bureaucracy are major deterrents to cruising. Thank god I live in a paradise. .
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Old 13-12-2010, 16:40   #177
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You keep avoiding the exchange rate which for most travelers (back packers) is a major consideration.
Meyer, you're a bit hung up on this rate of exchange thing. On my trips back to OZ I often chat up foreign backpackers just for the fun of it. The backpackers that want to work their way around OZ could care less. They make it there and they spend it there. They don't care about it until they head for a country where they can't work, then they make sure they have enough. (message here somewhere) Rates of exchange are a fact of life. You deal with it. Times are tough, everyone is trying to make a buck. e.g. some airlines here are charging to carry your bags. A young kid I have known for years told me of a story the other day where his mate booked them some really cheap tickets Italy to Malta. His name is Robert. his mate used Bobby. Did not match his passport. Cost him more than what the ticket was worth to change it.
There is a reason why people are putting cruising on hold.
Life's an education
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Old 13-12-2010, 16:58   #178
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So the fact that your dollar is worth a third more in one country than another does is only a minor factor - Your dreaming
Oprah is here at the moment taping some shows and one of the major tourist authority people was interviewed this very morning on TV. His comment was while her huge following around the world will give us big $ marketing our high dollar exchange rate is making it tough and to attract overseas tourists. Maybe some of you should apply for his job as you seem to know more than them.
The figures don't lie but I did not say it was the only reason.
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Old 13-12-2010, 17:19   #179
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In BC the beaches are piled high with far more firewood than you could burn in a lifetime . It takes me 15 minutes to gather a weeks supply. Never had a heating bill.
I have cruised most of the South Pacific, and wouldn't dream of paying any con artists $300 for the priviledge. Don't go there, don't encourage them, or you will encourage others to do the same.
New Zealand learned how important cruisers are to the economy when they shot themselves in the foot with the safety regulations of many years ago. They learned the lesson Australia has yet to learn.
BC is still very cost effective, as it only takes a months labourers wages to cruise here for year.
Yes ,goudging and bureaucracy are major deterrents to cruising. Thank god I live in a paradise. .
The fact that Canada is cheap to cruise has no relevance to other countries. I have never known Canada to be a cruising destination like the South Pacific. Canada's attractions are more suited to land travel from my perspective. Bad mouthing other countries does not go over well with the majority no matter which country. I can assure you that most Australians not a few cranky sailors are more concerned about keeping our natural habitat, wildlife etc free from imported pests and disease than a few extra cruising yachties. Some including Jim seem to think that the Australian economy is going to notice a few less cruise yachts in fact if none came I am pretty sure it would not be noticed. This is not the Caribean or some small South Pacific island having a small economy based on tourism.
Our economy is based on exporting minerals, wool, wheat etc not on tourism.
Common line by New Zealanders based on the large numbers who migrate over the ditch to Australia is "wiil the last one to leave turn off the lights"
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Old 13-12-2010, 17:31   #180
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Here's some citzens of OZ performing a ritual to get rid of ALL imported pests....
They reckon they've been arriving by boat for hundreds of years.....
The second dance is called the Welcome Dance... they welcome the day it happens
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