Mexican Navy vaccinated us

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by smj

And hopefully the decisions one makes in their lives doesn’t affect others, if so those were selfish decisions.

We are sailors SMJ.. every decision to cast off the lines or raise the hook affects someone's life to varying degrees..
In some cases those decisions may even put others lives at risks.. so sell your boat you selfish sod..

[smj]

Originally Posted by boatman61

We are sailors SMJ.. every decision to cast off the lines or raise the hook affects someone's life to varying degrees..

In some cases those decisions may even put others lives at risks.. so sell your boat you selfish sod..

Can’t say my sailing is killing others through my actions.

[jeanathon]

Originally Posted by smj

And hopefully the decisions one makes in their lives doesn’t affect others, if so those were selfish decisions.

Do you mean like yelling at someone that you know what is best for them, and they should get a vaccine that they do not want but you selfishly decided they must?

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by smj

Can’t say my sailing is killing others through my actions.

So many skippers have said that before an W-E Atlantic crossing that went bad.. some survived while crew or family died or, in the case of some boats from 30ft to 70ft were never seen or heard off again..
Your obviously still passing floors singing "So far So good"... just like me...

[smj]

Originally Posted by jeanathon

Do you mean like yelling at someone that you know what is best for them, and they should get a vaccine that they do not want but you selfishly decided they must?

And you took that as yelling? [emoji23]

[smj]

Originally Posted by boatman61

So many skippers have said that before an W-E Atlantic crossing that went bad.. some survived while crew or family died or, in the case of some boats from 30ft to 70ft were never seen or heard off again..
Your obviously still passing floors singing "So far So good"... just like me...

In that case I would say all that made the crossing and died knew the risk they were taking and not passing that risk onto an unknowing innocent person.
There is the occasional case of an innocent getting killed because of a sailing tragedy, but few and far between.
I don’t think we can compare the risks of sailing vs the risks of Covid.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by smj

In that case I would say all that made the crossing and died knew the risk they were taking and not passing that risk onto an unknowing innocent person.
There is the occasional case of an innocent getting killed because of a sailing tragedy, but few and far between.
I don’t think we can compare the risks of sailing vs the risks of Covid.

There have been many crew who've posted on here about nightmare trips with self professed capable skippers.. they were pretty innocent and unknowing of the truth about the skipper.. just took it on trust to gain experience.. like the 5 novice crew who disappeared along with the skipper on the 70ftr a few years back..
Big boat, 'experienced' skipper, best time of year.. what could go wrong.???
I look on every ocean voyage as a 50/50 chance of success..
Kinda like faith in the vaccine.. or one's immune system..

[smj]

I’ve got no problem with one going unvaccinated, but if one does please steer clear of society and please don’t waste a hospital bed if you get sick. [emoji23]

[RigBig]

Looks like Darwin's theory maybe coming into play now. I see two camps here, one is "intelligent" and they chose to get vaccinated, wear masks and social distance and the other camp is "stupid" who for various reasons decided not to wear masks, social distance and get vaccinated. Looks like the "stupid gene pool" in diminishing and that maybe good.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by boatman61

There have been many crew who've posted on here about nightmare trips with self professed capable skippers.. they were pretty innocent and unknowing of the truth about the skipper.. just took it on trust to gain experience.. like the 5 novice crew who disappeared along with the skipper on the 70ftr a few years back..
Big boat, 'experienced' skipper, best time of year.. what could go wrong.???
I look on every ocean voyage as a 50/50 chance of success..
Kinda like faith in the vaccine.. or one's immune system..

So you'd expect every second passage to be a failure. That's what 50/50 odds gets you. Pretty poor odds for any skipper.
Of course no one here disagrees with your life has risks philosophy. It's just using that as an excuse to excuse any rationalization that gets called out.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Paul L

So you'd expect every second passage to be a failure. That's what 50/50 odds gets you. Pretty poor odds for any skipper.
Of course no one here disagrees with your life has risks philosophy. It's just using that as an excuse to excuse any rationalization that gets called out.

That's a very 'kids abacus' way of looking at stats.. every voyage is a fresh 50/50.. not an automatic you've had the good 50 now cop for the bad..
I deliver other peoples boats so take a calculated risk on every trip that they have either prepared the boat well enough or, I have the ability to overcome their shortfalls.. so far that has worked but I do not kid myself that I am infallible.. one reason I detest owners schedules.. needless stress on the boat.
To my mind its no different to getting on a m'bike and riding through the city.. to many variables and unknowns to take one past the theoretical 50/50 of making it home safely.
My ego aint that big... Yet..
But its a risk I have to accept or... give up things I enjoy..

[Greg K]

Originally Posted by smj

And hopefully the decisions one makes in their lives doesn’t affect others, if so those were selfish decisions.

Since this area for the discussion of all things Covid has been opened, there have been some pretty ugly accusations against the unvaccinated.... "socially irresponsible, selfish freeloaders... etc" and much angry support has been voiced here in restricting the freedoms of the unvaccinated and even mandating vaccination by force.

Much of that perspective has been based on principally 3 disputed points which are:

1. vaccine offers much superior protection than natural immunity acquired thru infection. And also that the vaccine offers superior protection against new variants.

2. The unvaccinated infect others while the vaccinated do not.

3. The development of variants is caused by the unvaccinated.

Number 1 claims seem to have been recently discredited by a preprint study recently released out of Israel which suggests that, to put it simply, natural immunity is far superior to immunity from vaccination in both infection rate and durability particularly as concerns the Delta variant. See here: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1...415v1.full.pdf

The number two claim has also been recently discredited, in that research has found that when infected with the Delta variant, the vaccinated tend to have as great a viral load as the unvaccinated and, therefore, are as infectious. Look here: https://www.ndm.ox.ac.uk/files/coron...ve20210816.pdf

On the third point, re the nature of how variants are developed within the human population I, personally, have not seen any studies to support the claim that the unvaccinated are to blame for the spread of variants. The logic of these claims, namely, that the more opportunity the virus has to infect the more potential it has to mutate is unconvincing at best. It certainly does not follow the pattern of mutations we have seen in bacteria which has developed resistance to antibiotics. Such antibiotic resistant bacteria usually appear in hospital settings and are known to be the result of improper use of antibiotics... ie, incomplete treatments or over use, for example. A number of scientists had warned about the danger of rolling out a world wide vaccine campaign during an pandemic for the very real reason that breakthrough infections in the partially vaccinated would most likely lead to more virulent/infectious strains. These scientists were ignored, and now seem to have been correct. I am hopeful that some research on this will appear to prove them correct as, intuitively from what we know from bacterial mutations , the mechanism should work the same way with viruses.

I am also hopeful that as more research is conducted the vocal haters of the unvaccinated here and elsewhere will come to their senses and admit that the basis for their discriminatory attitudes towards the unvaccinated is not valid and that the restrictive policies they so rabidly supported should not be implemented.

[Nicholson58]

Back to the OP. Thanks

Glad to hear cruisers have options without needing to ‘go home’

Near the end of the season last year Antigua did the same. The health minister Made it available free to anyone on the island. I suspect many islands are the same.

We chose to get ours at a Cincinnati Walgreens as walk-ins. It’s available now by appointment or walk in at almost any pharmacy and many big grocery stores.

We expect to get the booster before the season begins in November.

By brother is in primary care at Marquette hospital. He is front line well connected and several of his children are also in medicine. He has escaped so far but three of his adult children have had it, one severely. Also several of their family members, all before the vaccines. My brother is a big proponent of vitamin C, D, Zinc and ivermectin. They note reduced morbidity in patients and many docs are taking prophylacticly. Perhaps helped him avoid infection. He and the other health professionals are tired of daily 18 hours in haz-mat suits and treating the steady stream of unvaccinated patients. Nearly all severely ill are unvaccinated, upper 90%. In my mind the numbers are very clear. Ignore the politics and do the math. Sick in a third world country in a crappy hospital with no ventilators is a very bad plan.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

Back to the OP. Thanks

Glad to hear cruisers have options without needing to ‘go home’

Near the end of the season last year Antigua did the same. The health minister Made it available free to anyone on the island. I suspect many islands are the same.

We chose to get ours at a Cincinnati Walgreens as walk-ins. It’s available now by appointment or walk in at almost any pharmacy and many big grocery stores.

We expect to get the booster before the season begins in November.

By brother is in primary care at Marquette hospital. He is front line well connected and several of his children are also in medicine. He has escaped so far but three of his adult children have had it, one severely. Also several of their family members, all before the vaccines. My brother is a big proponent of vitamin C, D, Zinc and ivermectin. They note reduced morbidity in patients and many docs are taking prophylacticly. Perhaps helped him avoid infection. He and the other health professionals are tired of daily 18 hours in haz-mat suits and treating the steady stream of unvaccinated patients. Nearly all severely ill are unvaccinated, upper 90%. In my mind the numbers are very clear. Ignore the politics and do the math. Sick in a third world country in a crappy hospital with no ventilators is a very bad plan.

Hear Hear.. Kudo's to Mexico and other nations offering vaccines to non citizens in their country..
As to the rest...
Being vaccinated does not mean you cannot die from Covid

Although there is overwhelming evidence that the vaccines are dramatically effective in preventing severe disease and death, they are not perfect.

Of the 1,189 deaths confirmed as Delta cases between 1 February and 15 August, about 57% had received their second jab at least two weeks previously, according to Public Health England.

As most of the adult population is now fully vaccinated, those who die are more likely to be vaccinated, explained Dr Kit Yates, a senior lecturer in mathematical biology at the University of Bath.

Even if everyone were fully vaccinated, some people would still die – that doesn’t mean vaccines aren’t effective at reducing death.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...tatistics-show

[ixnax]

Originally Posted by mjgill1

Look, I can do it too! Except, I would never pass judgement saying someone got what they deserve or serves them right. That's just plain wrong. If you believe that, you should repent. Seriously.
https://winepressnews.com/2021/08/26...eneca-vaccine/

It was sarcasm. Others have argued that being fit in the prime of life will save them from Covid death. It was one example to show it's not guaranteed. In the meantime, I'll bite, why not get vaccinated.