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Old 03-11-2011, 18:26   #16
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
if in a hidey hole and threatened---or on the hard an threatened---or in a marina in a hidey hole and looking at a close one---
h1-2 stay with boat. hunker down
h3-4 out the door--
h5 we all gonna die.

friends in oriental, n.c. waited out irene in theirs on the hard sans rudder-- we agreed on this one.. we were waiting for hurrycames to hit here all summer but we lucked out well this year. is a scary thought having hurrycames coming at your area-- but preplanning is good. i followed the advice of native mexicans from mazatlan who are shrimpers and water men. watch weather like hawk.
The problem with this is that the weakest part of hurricane forecasting is what category it will be.

The smart thing to do is to assume it will be a major hurricane, because it can strengthen very rapidly. Hurricane Andrew went from Cat 1 to Cat 4 in 24 hours,
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Old 03-11-2011, 19:08   #17
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Re: How to ride out a storm

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--- And that's a good reason to stay on the boat in a storm. --- Unless one has set the boat out before and knows it's ability, one should not take it for granted that it'll be there after the storm. ------
If you stay on board you should not take it for granted that either you or the boat will be there after the storm.
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Old 03-11-2011, 19:15   #18
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

I think I would stay with the boat in any situation that I would think the boat would make it. But if I thought the boat would not, then I think one is wise to move ashore.

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Old 03-11-2011, 20:04   #19
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

current day predictions during storms are good at perdicting the strength in time to leave or stay. i saw that with my friends as they waited it out in oriental, and with the storms predicted to hit near or come at us. remember jova and irwin--were spozed to hit us dead on. yes i live in hurrycame area also. we got lucky this year-- we didnt get any,. but the potential is there, as is potential for and actuality of storms with up to 100 KT winds-- they call some of them chubascos here. a lil south of us are tehuantepeckers. high winds. the pacific northwest has cyclonics COLD winter storms. the windspeed in those happens to be close to or at tropical storm and cat1 hurrycame strength. btdt. we were on board thru those -- what is difference between warm cyclonic storm and a cold one--i cannot see any difference. escept the damnable coldness of the icy ones from pnw make life a lil miserable for a couple of days.
gulf coast is not special for having hurrycames. ditto for thun der storms. btdt in both gulf of mexico and mazatlan on the pacific, where seas are HUGE. nice, BIG, ROLLY huge. choppy near shore and in storms. we even have tides with range wider than 2 feet...more like 7-8 ft. storm surge with high tide is most destructive,we never haul boats out for storms....we remain in boats on water.
doesnt mean we will sail willingly thru them. have sailed one day after one in an el nino year--- seas were 30 ft. we were going down hill.
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Old 03-11-2011, 22:17   #20
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Re: How to ride out a storm

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If you stay on board you should not take it for granted that either you or the boat will be there after the storm.
It's called "Assumption of Risk".

One takes risks just to go out sailing. If one is not willing to take certain risks then one will lose more often then not, unless one is a pretty lucky person. Or they have more money then they need to worry about.

I suppose if one can afford it, they can just jump ship of it gets holed and go buy a new one later. Myself I've worked my whole life to get the things I have, and I'm willing to take a risk/effort to maintain them. Much like a farmer would fight flooding/fire to protect his farm and livestock, or a firefighter who would run into a burning building to save a dog.
I'm willing to fight the storm to protect my boat.

But my real response is, I would never leave my boat in an area known to be dangerous in the first place. I'd take it out of the Hurricane area before the season even started and ride out the storm on the TV.
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Old 03-11-2011, 23:06   #21
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

O.P., Seems that everyone agrees that you have to do what suits you.

Anyone want to talk about "Who makes the best anchor?"
Just kidding....
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Old 03-11-2011, 23:51   #22
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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O.P., Seems that everyone agrees that you have to do what suits you.

Anyone want to talk about "Who makes the best anchor?"
Just kidding....
It used to be ROCNA I think
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Old 04-11-2011, 08:37   #23
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

Oh Joy was one of three boats of sixty three to survive Ivan in a marina in Puerto Rico. She wasn't unscathed. Get off the damned boat if stronger than Cat2. Better yet, sail for somewhere else if ya can during the season. It's your home so take it somewhere new for a while.
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Old 04-11-2011, 08:52   #24
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I think I would stay with the boat in any situation that I would think the boat would make it. But if I thought the boat would not, then I think one is wise to move ashore.

b.

The thing is, how can you evaluate all those factors? How do you know that a storm surge won't carry a lot of debris from broken boats that will his your boat and do serious damage, for instance? How do you know the storm won't suddenly strengthen as Andrew did? The problem with your attitude is that you can't evaluate all the risks until the debris is piling on your bow and weighing it down.
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Old 04-11-2011, 08:55   #25
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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O.P., Seems that everyone agrees that you have to do what suits you.

Anyone want to talk about "Who makes the best anchor?"
Just kidding....

Don't count on a mooring unless you have dived and inspected it, and the chain, and any line. I know someone who uses five 200 lb. pieces of cement, one centered and the four fanned out from the corners, all chained and swiveled together. He made it himself. It hasn't had to survive any hurricanes but it's survived some mighty blows.
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Old 04-11-2011, 10:04   #26
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

To leave a boat at a dock in a hurricane, one might just as well throw their money into the wind. It's all preparation just like out sailing. Why even buy a boat if your not going to care for it.

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Old 04-11-2011, 10:17   #27
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

watch stormpulse ---is a good site for tracking and intensity of hurrycames-- they have been fairly accurate as to the intensities- although they predicted irene as stronger than actually was at time of hit. their intensity prediction is a couple of days in advance of the hit, and there is good warning. listening to weather on radio or watching on tv is not adequate, i also go to storm 2k to see what they are saying about any given named storm. the rest i can figure for myself by watching the satellite pix from nws and stormpulse--also passage weather for tehuantepec winds, which will affect my trip to panama from mazatlan this spring.
during the wait for jova, we were all arranging alternative residence locations for the just in case factor-- but we did the 1-2 stay on board, 3-4 out the door, and cat 5 we all gonna die rule we initiated.
when flak comes from other boats or in the wind, as tiles from condo roofs and metal from sheds and such -- there is no protection. make sure your boat is not in a main current or wind area. mine was protected to a degree by the round island in marina mazatlan--not much relief there---but is not in the basin into which allthe other boats will merge and come to rest in a bunch.
as the surge exits, you will be abl to expect the debris to hit you, yes.is part of the boating roulette in a harbor of any kind--look at chessy after and during irene. waters rise, stuff comes back out with the exiting waters. happens even on hard with hauled boats--ask mjwarner. she remained in her boat on hard in oriental in irene. took videos. interesting stuff and is posted on her blog.

btw--doesnt have to be a named storm to produce floating junk--any storm with runoff will do that.
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Old 04-11-2011, 11:19   #28
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
watch stormpulse ---is a good site for tracking and intensity of hurrycames-- they have been fairly accurate as to the intensities- although they predicted irene as stronger than actually was at time of hit. their intensity prediction is a couple of days in advance of the hit, and there is good warning. listening to weather on radio or watching on tv is not adequate, i also go to storm 2k to see what they are saying about any given named storm. the rest i can figure for myself by watching the satellite pix from nws and stormpulse--also passage weather for tehuantepec winds, which will affect my trip to panama from mazatlan this spring.
during the wait for jova, we were all arranging alternative residence locations for the just in case factor-- but we did the 1-2 stay on board, 3-4 out the door, and cat 5 we all gonna die rule we initiated.
when flak comes from other boats or in the wind, as tiles from condo roofs and metal from sheds and such -- there is no protection. make sure your boat is not in a main current or wind area. mine was protected to a degree by the round island in marina mazatlan--not much relief there---but is not in the basin into which allthe other boats will merge and come to rest in a bunch.
as the surge exits, you will be abl to expect the debris to hit you, yes.is part of the boating roulette in a harbor of any kind--look at chessy after and during irene. waters rise, stuff comes back out with the exiting waters. happens even on hard with hauled boats--ask mjwarner. she remained in her boat on hard in oriental in irene. took videos. interesting stuff and is posted on her blog.

btw--doesnt have to be a named storm to produce floating junk--any storm with runoff will do that.

No matter how good that site is, the weakest link in hurricane prediction is how strong the storm will be -- no matter who is doing it. That's just how it is.

Do not make a decision on the safety of your boat based on a prediction that the storm will be a cat 1 or 2 and not something stronger. For that matter, tropical storms sometimes strengthen markedly, from TS to Cat 2 or higher, within 24 hours, and the forecasters don't always predict it accurately.

For some of us it is either not practical or undesirable to sail to another country for the entire hurricane season. We need practical, effective solutions.

I was plenty nervous with this last storm because right now I have no rudder. it would have been hard to move it away from the dock and dinto a hurricane hole.

Things happen. Always have a Plan B -- and C, and don't bank your favorite toy on the weather forecasters getting the strength of the storm right.

In addition, pay attention to that entire cone of concern. Tampa Bay was right in the center of Hurricane Charley's track. Everyone in the Tampa Bay area prepared, but the storm turned sharply to the right and then south, and came in at Punta Gorda -- which had been right on the edge of the cone of concern.

Punta Gorda had a lot of trailer communities that were just completely destroyed. While Charley was a small storm, it was also a Cat 4 when it hit land. Do not ignore the cone of concern.
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Old 04-11-2011, 11:52   #29
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

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Zee is right about the storm surges, here Al and I are enjoying a respite from the winds and rain during the eye of Irene.
We are on land, in the boatyard. The boats you see behind us are blocked, even though they don't look like it, The white one in the center did float off it's stands less then 15 minutes after this photo was taken.
Friends who rode it out on their boats, in creeks nearby, had one wild ride. They and their boats fared well, laying to two anchors against prevailing wind directions, but it was physically exhausting for all of them, and this was a low cat.1.
Because of what I KNOW, from this storm and a lifetime in Fla., I will always haul and block if available, tie stands together and anchor into the ground from at least four points.
That's just me.
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Old 04-11-2011, 11:59   #30
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Re: How to Ride Out a Storm

people who reside on boats and actively cruise them will react in a different manner than folks without that experiene. ditto with folks who have already lived thru 100+ kt winds onboard their boats under differing circumstances. each of us learns in a different manner.
heavy weather is heavy weather and deserves concern. paying attention to appropriate weather sites and communications between weather geeks is one way to keep your skills up.
meteorology and geology and earth science are excellent bases for interpreting the info as given by nws and nhs and stormpulse and passage weather and such informative sites designed to keep sailors informed-- the satellite fotos are also a large assist.
being able to read sea and sky happens to be only a part of safety at sea--digesting and using info given by weather sites is a major part of survival at sea and continuation of remaining alive and afloat
raku--you are still new and learning is why i am splaining these bits that are necessary parts of learning-- experience helps to alive and out of the news media.
common sense also helps to digest the info received.
using only one site for info is a problem, as no one can predict intensity from only one source. i choose to view as many sources as is possible before i make a determination--i have found the stormpulse site as accurate as is possible for the intensity predictions. they missed --to the more intense side, in 2 of the many named storms predicted this year--that isnt a weak prediction capability. is excellent record --for this year. past storms are not included, as prior to our current knowledge,, storm intensity was not predicted nor predictable.
andrew, as well as carla, donna, hugo, et alii, were a long time ago. our lifestyles have changed as have our abilities to react to incoming storm activities, as well as the prediction thereto.
let's keep our knowledge current and appropriate. we can compare apples and oranges but all we get is fruit salad.
yes i have resided in hurrycame locales. yes i remember old time 'canes--prediction of intensity happened when they hit. life is different with new abilities to determine closer to reality the formation and intensity--yes, intensity- of the coming and forming storm.

there will always be losses in trailer communities--those things fly !!! and many are not tied to ground. but we can help ourselves by paying attention to momma nature and securing our lives well.
listening to weather forecasters is death. so is listening to and believing noaa on vhf-- they use one source only . must use more than one. that was reinforced to me by my near year of sailing in gulf of mexico off florida.
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