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Old 09-12-2017, 12:04   #1
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Big decision time

We have a lovely 2011 owners version Lagoon 380 S2 based in the Ionian and we have a fabulous time sailing her around the islands of Greece every summer.

But we are thinking about ordering a new Lagoon 42 and going over on the ARC to the Caribbean.

This would mean selling our boat next autumn and going over in 2019. It's a huge commitment but it would mean we could be away in the winter and at home in the summer rather than the other way round ... which is what we do now.

It's a lot of money to spend and a big change to our routine ... what do you think peeps !!
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Old 09-12-2017, 20:39   #2
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Re: Big decision time

Why not refurb and refit the 380 and take it over the pond?

What's the wait on the delivery of a L42?

Compared with buying, commissioning, understanding, fixing, upgrading and learning the intricacies of a new L42, your "old" L380 will most likely be more reliable, have less teething žssues, be faster, and with the money you'd save placed in the cruising kitty, more fun. Just a thought. ☺
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Old 10-12-2017, 12:21   #3
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Re: Big decision time

Well I suppose the answer to that is that we are very lucky in that the money is not an issue. It's a bit like changing a six year old car for a new bigger one.... well it would be just nice.

Then there is the ocean crossing... the 380 is low in the water and does not have good bridge clearance which make it uncomfortable driving into the waves.
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Old 10-12-2017, 12:32   #4
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Re: Big decision time

Iíve sailed most lagoons, and the older 380 is one of the ones I like, or the 440. Th new lagoons I find light and fragile, I havenít sailed the new 42but I have the 40and 45, Iíd Ďupgradeí to a 440 owners version, whatever you do make sure you get the taller mast option, many USA bound lagoons in the 440 model or others had a short mast option for bridge clearance, resulting in quit a bit less sail area
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Old 10-12-2017, 13:17   #5
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Re: Big decision time

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Originally Posted by kristjan View Post
Iíve sailed most lagoons, and the older 380 is one of the ones I like, or the 440. Th new lagoons I find light and fragile, I havenít sailed the new 42but I have the 40and 45, Iíd Ďupgradeí to a 440 owners version, whatever you do make sure you get the taller mast option, many USA bound lagoons in the 440 model or others had a short mast option for bridge clearance, resulting in quit a bit less sail area
Would you please elaborate on your 440 vs 450 experiences?
Quite interested on first hand comparations!
Thanks in advance
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Old 10-12-2017, 13:18   #6
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Re: Big decision time

If you just want to cross oceans and spend money(which you have) then I think your plan is fine, the Med is a very neat area.
In my opinion after cruising the Med for a couple of years and then crossing over to the Caribbean I would not do that again and I'll tell you why.
If your into sailing you really can't compare the two areas, winds in the Med are flucky or not there at all or blowing like hell from the wrong direction. The Caribbean has trade winds blowing and other than some changes now and then, are fairly predictable and the sailing is excellent, no comparison. The Caribbean allows you to spend some summer time at home and then when it starts to cool down head back. The Med has winter and during that time 98% of the cruising boats are in the marina or on the hard.
If your into diving or snorkeling and your going to the Med, leave your gear at home, other than the odd spot that place has been sterilized.
OK what's left...Food, culture,history...Now everything changes because the Caribbean is sterilized other than areas in the Western parts.
The Med is everything we ever dreamed of in so many ways, the food was out of this world. The culture was varied and so deep it has to be experienced. History..who can compete..some of the areas were really mind blowing especially visiting cities thousands of years old. I'll be honest with you, if the Med wasn't so far away and didn't have the same summer/winter cycle as home we wouldn't have left. We actually spent time in several areas looking for a home but its just too far away from family and family wants to visit in their winter not their summer and it's Caribbean winter they are interested in.
OK my final thought..We are going back to the Med but it won't be on our sailboat, what the Med has to offer is what's on the land that's what it's all about. We put the boat in a marina and rented a brand new apartment in Turkey for $350.00 per month including utilities in an area that was close to an airport and we travelled all over the place and that's what we do when we go back. Travel is cheap and I'd rather be sitting on an aircraft or an air conditioned bus looking forward to the most amazing experiences than flogging our way to windward, anchoring in an area but not wanting to leave the boat and do some serious inland travel. Of course we left the boat but when anchored just for day trips and tight timelines. The Caribbean is more about the water, great sailing with some land experiences thrown in..The Med is all about the land experiences with some sailing thrown in. Either way good luck..R
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Old 10-12-2017, 14:05   #7
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Re: Big decision time

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Originally Posted by Haywoods View Post
Well I suppose the answer to that is that we are very lucky in that the money is not an issue. It's a bit like changing a six year old car for a new bigger one.... well it would be just nice.

Then there is the ocean crossing... the 380 is low in the water and does not have good bridge clearance which make it uncomfortable driving into the waves.
I'm glad that money isn't a limiting factor ☺, however a new boat is much different to a new car😡. With most new cars its feasible to drive straight out of the showroom and across a continent, whereas new boats involve much delays, commissioning, add ons and fix ups. This fact has stymied many a cruising plan.

I haven't spent much time on a new L42 but hope that it is the improvement you desire.
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Old 10-12-2017, 20:44   #8
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Re: Big decision time

Coming to the Caribbean? If you plan on staying more than a couple of seasons get a fly-bridge Lagoon. Once across the Atlantic most inter-island trips are a day sail. Fly-bridges were made for the Caribbean, great for shallow water eyeball navigation, 4-6 people can sit up top for views, cocktails cooling breezes, listening to Bob Marley, huge cockpit area etc etc.
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Old 11-12-2017, 02:36   #9
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Re: Big decision time

Quote:
Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
If you just want to cross oceans and spend money(which you have) then I think your plan is fine, the Med is a very neat area.
In my opinion after cruising the Med for a couple of years and then crossing over to the Caribbean I would not do that again and I'll tell you why.
If your into sailing you really can't compare the two areas, winds in the Med are flucky or not there at all or blowing like hell from the wrong direction. The Caribbean has trade winds blowing and other than some changes now and then, are fairly predictable and the sailing is excellent, no comparison. The Caribbean allows you to spend some summer time at home and then when it starts to cool down head back. The Med has winter and during that time 98% of the cruising boats are in the marina or on the hard.
If your into diving or snorkeling and your going to the Med, leave your gear at home, other than the odd spot that place has been sterilized.
OK what's left...Food, culture,history...Now everything changes because the Caribbean is sterilized other than areas in the Western parts.
The Med is everything we ever dreamed of in so many ways, the food was out of this world. The culture was varied and so deep it has to be experienced. History..who can compete..some of the areas were really mind blowing especially visiting cities thousands of years old. I'll be honest with you, if the Med wasn't so far away and didn't have the same summer/winter cycle as home we wouldn't have left. We actually spent time in several areas looking for a home but its just too far away from family and family wants to visit in their winter not their summer and it's Caribbean winter they are interested in.
OK my final thought..We are going back to the Med but it won't be on our sailboat, what the Med has to offer is what's on the land that's what it's all about. We put the boat in a marina and rented a brand new apartment in Turkey for $350.00 per month including utilities in an area that was close to an airport and we travelled all over the place and that's what we do when we go back. Travel is cheap and I'd rather be sitting on an aircraft or an air conditioned bus looking forward to the most amazing experiences than flogging our way to windward, anchoring in an area but not wanting to leave the boat and do some serious inland travel. Of course we left the boat but when anchored just for day trips and tight timelines. The Caribbean is more about the water, great sailing with some land experiences thrown in..The Med is all about the land experiences with some sailing thrown in. Either way good luck..R
Hi Robert ... excellent reply.. thank you

As you have experience of both areas this is a real help to us. we live in the UK and so we have spent a lot of time travelling around Europe on land. OUr plan would allowus to sail the boat in the Caribbean in winter, but then spend time travelling around Europe in summer.

Winter in the UK is very grey, cold, rainy, windy etc and we really want to get away at this time of year.

We are flying out to St Lucia in January for 3 weeks so we can travel around, visit the marinas and beaches and generally get an idea if this is where we want to be with our boat.

Many thanks

Paul
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Old 11-12-2017, 02:40   #10
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Re: Big decision time

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bean Counter View Post
Coming to the Caribbean? If you plan on staying more than a couple of seasons get a fly-bridge Lagoon. Once across the Atlantic most inter-island trips are a day sail. Fly-bridges were made for the Caribbean, great for shallow water eyeball navigation, 4-6 people can sit up top for views, cocktails cooling breezes, listening to Bob Marley, huge cockpit area etc etc.
Hi there and thanks for your reply

We have looked at the 450 fly bridge, but it isn't the right boat for us - for one reason alone.

Most of the time there will only be the two of us on the boat and we felt that the person at the helm would be isolated form the other person most of the time.

For that reason we wanted a boat with a layout similar to our 380 which has the helm position at a half way point ... good visability but still able to interact with the others "downstairs".

Cheers

Paul
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Old 11-12-2017, 11:56   #11
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Re: Big decision time

The Lagoon 45 is a monster of a boat, more room than most apartments, I can see the attraction for buyers especially those that will be entertaining guests on a regular basis. I think it's a great boat for the Med or the Caribbean. That 3 story helm location would also be cool for both those areas but I can't think of a worse design for sailing offshore. We were being entertained on a L45 and I met a delivery skipper who had done ocean crossings on this design and he said if conditions are fairly benign then it's not bad but if the seas kick up he said it was a hell of a ride sitting at the helm and rigged up a net around the helm area. His claims, not mine.
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Old 11-12-2017, 12:17   #12
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Re: Big decision time

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Originally Posted by Haywoods View Post
Hi Robert ... excellent reply.. thank you

As you have experience of both areas this is a real help to us. we live in the UK and so we have spent a lot of time travelling around Europe on land. OUr plan would allowus to sail the boat in the Caribbean in winter, but then spend time travelling around Europe in summer.

Winter in the UK is very grey, cold, rainy, windy etc and we really want to get away at this time of year.

We are flying out to St Lucia in January for 3 weeks so we can travel around, visit the marinas and beaches and generally get an idea if this is where we want to be with our boat.

Many thanks

Paul
Hi Paul, your very welcome. We have one thing in common, I can take your description of where you live and it describes the same weather where I live, we are on similar latitudes..our home is in Vancouver, BC Canada.
You'll enjoy your trip to St Lucia and it will be a nice break from your local weather. St Lucia is the final stop for the ARC rally which I'm sure you know. The only thing St Lucia has in common with the rest of the island chain is the water and weather. Each of the islands is an extension of their history which for us doesn't go back that far. It wasn't that long ago that many of the islands were under different European rule and slavery and sugar cane were the cash crops. British islands are different than French islands which are different than Spanish islands. So you can't take your experience in St Lucia and set expectations for the rest of the Caribbean as in many cases it's dramatically different.
If your going to leave your boat there over the summer you'll probably feel better if it was in Grenada or Trinidad or the ABC's which are less friendly to hurricanes. Last year saw many boats destroyed in much of the Caribbean.
Enjoy your trip. R
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Old 11-12-2017, 12:29   #13
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Re: Big decision time

Quote:
Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
The only thing St Lucia has in common with the rest of the island chain is the water and weather. Each of the islands is an extension of their history which for us doesn't go back that far. It wasn't that long ago that many of the islands were under different European rule and slavery and sugar cane were the cash crops. British islands are different than French islands which are different than Spanish islands. So you can't take your experience in St Lucia and set expectations for the rest of the Caribbean as in many cases it's dramatically different.
If your going to leave your boat there over the summer you'll probably feel better if it was in Grenada or Trinidad or the ABC's which are less friendly to hurricanes. Last year saw many boats destroyed in much of the Caribbean.
Enjoy your trip. R
This is an excellent point. St. Lucia in particular is very "divided"...two larger towns in Gros Islet/Rodney Bay and Casteries and then the remainder of the island is dirt poor, sadly. There are some beautiful things to see like the pitons and Pigeon Island, to be sure, but were you to go westward into the Grenadines it's a whole different world.
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Old 12-12-2017, 08:13   #14
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Re: Big decision time

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valiente View Post
Would you please elaborate on your 440 vs 450 experiences?
Quite interested on first hand comparations!
Thanks in advance


Hello,
Iíve delivered several of each model from the factory in France to brokers on east coast or charter companies in BVI. Iíve worked as quality control manager (pseudo technician and in house surveys ) for a fleet of 50 boats of various types, including several lagoons.

Yes for sure the 450 is nice, but the 440 is more robust and has also plenty of inside room and storage and same views. The newer lagoons arenít all that revolutionary compared to the slightly older older ones. Just have more ikeaish interiors and cost twice as much in the market.
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Old 12-12-2017, 22:44   #15
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Re: Big decision time

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Originally Posted by kristjan View Post
Hello,
Iíve delivered several of each model from the factory in France to brokers on east coast or charter companies in BVI. Iíve worked as quality control manager (pseudo technician and in house surveys ) for a fleet of 50 boats of various types, including several lagoons.

Yes for sure the 450 is nice, but the 440 is more robust and has also plenty of inside room and storage and same views. The newer lagoons arenít all that revolutionary compared to the slightly older older ones. Just have more ikeaish interiors and cost twice as much in the market.
Hello Kristjan,
Thanks for the first-hand information!
What exactly did you find to be "more robust" on the 440?
Was it just the interiors or other things too?
How did you feel about night watches alone on the fly-bridge for either the 440 or 450?
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