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ughmo2000 · 21-02-2012, 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by bvimatelot

OK then, UGMHO - How much do you pay your crew?

I think the waters of this thread have been muddied somewhat. What is it to others how the OP gets his crew? He's been pretty up-front about the conditions and so its "take it or leave it". What's the point of this "Holier than thou attitude"?

And then we get into possible litigation....oh dear, oh dear.... Tony

I ask my crew's airfare and expenses to and from the boat, provisions, and $100-125 per day. I also spring for a celabratory meal upon arrival. I have a number of people that can verify these amounts if doubted.

I've been very lucky in that I've never paid anything to crew another's boat and shortly gained enough experience that I did start to get paid.

I really don't mind how someone gets their crew but this just seems unethical for someone to get paid big bucks then asks for experienced crew to help for free. Why not throw your crew, who worked just as hard as you, or possibly harder, a bone? Is the owner so broke after buying this half million dollar yacht that he can't afford a couple grand for crew that get's his boat to it's destination in one piece and looking good? Sounds like a guy lining his pocket and screw the help. I bet a case of beer the owner doesn't know.

I'm not holier than anybody but I do believe right is right and this certainly doesn't sound right.

Just my opinion. And I've been wrong a million times.

bvimatelot · 21-02-2012, 20:17

My dear chap - I don't doubt you at all! But reading your last where you say you shortly gained enough experience to start getting paid, pre-supposes that you did at least one trip as an unpaid hand?

Just because this boat is a Hylas 54 doesn't necessarily "big bucks". I quote normally per voyage and usually smaller boats are a bit more expensive since they take longer and are often much more uncomfortable.

I don't think the original request was out of line: You may recall a recent thread about an "unscrupulous" and rather large Brit Delivery Company? Their deal is the skipper gets paid peanuts and has to fund everything (food, fuel, spare parts, delays-in-transit, etc) and his crew. Normally the Mate gets about $500 and sometimes but not always, his flights. The 3rd hand pays his way but gets fed onboard. And don't talk to me about the South African companies!! I can call a number in SA and they'll crawl down the phone lines to give me a SA-USA delivery - provided I fly myself and crew to the boat and pay all its expenses (mind you - diesel is cheap there!). One of the reasons they can and do get away with this is that there are so many new skippers coming through the training mills who need miles that they can afford to pay them very little. This is not to say that South African skippers are of lower calibre: indeed I know many SA skippers and most of them have considerably more miles and experience under their belt than I have - and the waters down there are Big!

All deliveries, as far as I know, are reported to the Insurance Company (like you - I would never consider an uninsured boat) which does its own due diligence on the competence and experience of the skipper. One particular company required me to carry $5mill liability insurance: I still pay the premiums as I feel its an additional "comfort zone" for my owners. Having said that, and being slightly cynical, I think its just so the insurance company can delay payment in the event of an accident as they try to extract shekels from my Liability carrier for alleged unprofessional behaviour!?!

Hey ho.

ughmo2000 · 22-02-2012, 07:48

Again, I've never paid to crew a boat. Not my travel, provisions, fuel, marina, immigration, fees, or return travel. Yes, I have worked as an "unpaid" hand. But it certaninly didn't cost me money other than my own shoreside expenses. Apparently I've been super lucky.

I know of the British companies your referring to. They have very similar names, one having left the first to start his own management company. Your absolutely correct how they operate. I also know of the S.A. folks and how they operate.

Just because they, and others do it, does it make it right?

jim0123r · 06-03-2012, 17:45

Thank you to the 30 sailors who responded - I have selected my three very qualified crew.

I will not be checking this post again.

All the best -
Jim

cruzan1 · 07-03-2012, 12:19

My second post,

I've been sailing for over twenty five years yet due to business obligations I got stuck on land for a solid three years. Finally got to a point in my life where I could afford to pursue my passion of sailing. So, needing some extra sea time to fulfill the five year requirement
I did some deliveries as an unpaid crew member (for a SA delivery team).

No transportation costs or per diem, just food while at sea. Racked my masters license w sail endorsement and those logged delivery days got me over the hump. I learned a lot during those trips but most everything that I learned was gained via careful observation, nothing was taught during those trips. I think that is a big misconception among greenhorn crew. The 4hrs on/off is a nightmare for the sleep cycle and none of these Captains want to sit around discussing celestrial navigation when they could be in the bunk sleeping.

Still, it was well worth the experince. Met some great guys (and some bad ones) along the way and have memories that will never be erased. To me it was worth the expense of paying my own way.

I just did my first delivery (as a Captain) in December. A friend of a friends boat, a 38ft Athena from VA Beach to the Abacos. Guy volunteered to pay airfare/expenses for me an 2 crew so I did it for fun. Great trip and I felt 100% confident thanks to the previous delivery trips.