Power or Sail??

[ladycruiser]

I know I will catch a lot of flack for this question.... But here goes my first post after stalking for months and months

I know the cost considerations of fuel vs cost of rigging etc.... I wanna hear all the other positives and negatives

I have a $300k budget for the boat which I plan to purchase within the next year..... Planning to hit the seas within two weeks of my youngest graduating high school.... 6 more years but I wanna get the boat now to learn her and gain more experience.... and take shorter trips figuring out what more I need to outfit her with etc ect

I wouldn't say that I'm even close to an avid sailor.... My first time sailing was when I was 16yrs old.... Took sailing in college learning on small dinghy sails.... Gave it up for years after having kids.... 3 years ago I started sailing again and have been learning on a 36' hunter. I get out a few times a month and more when time allows.... I love sailing but my partner will have zero sailing experience and no way for me to teach him before we leave due to him being in another country.

My conservative budget will give me 6-8 years living the dream (poor) seeing the world with no time constraints.... And hopefully longer if I Can come up with a way to make money while traveling.... Currently the plan is an early retirement/ very long sabbatical.... Selling my shares in my company, selling off the house and all other assets.....

This is a life long dream and I wanna start the process now so I am completely prepared.... Now just need to decide on the right boat!!!


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[sailorboy1]

Holding off on getting the boat till you are ready will result in longer time cruising. No difference really between local sailing/boating and coastal hopping as far as gaining experience.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Howdy and Welcome Aboard the Forum as a Poster! (no flak from me)

Your intro was unclear to me where you are located and where or how far you wish to sail/motor. Do you intend to spend all of your time in the same area (e.g. Caribbean) or do you mean to do a circumnavigation or cruising the South Pacific etc? "Seeing the world" is pretty vague and I have heard people say that and they only meant to take a few trips to a couple of countries.

Why does this matter?

I can imagine many sailboats that fit the $300K budget (for the boat) on which I would happily cruise around the world. But, IF you decide to go with a power boat, I think that would/could pose a problem to get a seaworthy vessel that could go for years (e.g. around the world) and fit the budget and then what about the fuel costs for the long term cruising or long distances?

So, if you gave me the $300K budget and said: "Go find me a boat for a couple to cruise around the world in some comfort and safety and for living aboard for years" that would lead me to the sailboat option.

What boat (type) comes to mind, also considering your partner has no/little sailing skills now?

One suggestion: A used Lagoon 380 (owner's version) catamaran or similar that would be purchased for about $200K and then use the other $100K for any needed maintenance or gear you want to add (e.g. water maker) with as little spent as possible on those add-ons, so there would be a reserve fund for unexpected expenses or the operation and clearance fees etc.

Here is a video that shows that kind of boat as used by a young couple to travel from east coast USA to South Pacific. They made several videos showing their transit of the Panama Canal and visits to islands in Pacific. This one is a tour of their boat (which sold because of this video).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iEHYEo4SZQ

Good luck on your plans and may your dreams come true!

[Kenomac]

If we had to do it over again, and knowing what we now know.... We'd get a powerboat. Something like a 50ft trawler or powercat. For the distances we travel, the cost for fuel ends up being much less than the cost of sails and rigging.

Powerboats offer much more interior living space, and it's simply easier to turn the key and go with the twin screws than to screw around with sails. A trawler will get almost the same mileage at 8 knots as our boat, but even if there's a difference, it's only a gallon or two per hour more. Peanuts in the scheme of things.

Better yet, buy the boat in Europe with a strong dollar. You'll never want to come back since there's so much more to see and do over there.

Buy the boat now and enjoy yourselves.... You've earned it.

If you need to cross an ocean with a powerboat, just have it shipped. No need to get one with massive fuel tanks or impressive ocean crossing abilities.

[ladycruiser]

Sailorboy.... I don't won't to hold off on getting the boat... Then the next few years wouldn't yield anytime at sea whenever I want!!!


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[ladycruiser]

Steady hand.... I want to make make passages across the Atlantic and pacific.... I don't want to be tied down by a boats capabilities.... For now I'm located in SoCal.... Newport Beach


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[skipmac]

I have owned and enjoyed power and sail so think I can offer an unbiased opinion.

Like everything both have their advantages and disadvantages, some of which have already been mentioned but I'll try to list all I can think of. Please note that a lot of these are generally true but like any generality there are exceptions.

Power
- More room for the same length
- 99% of the time will get you there faster than sail
- Easy. crank and go.
- If you want to cross oceans there are not so many power boats that are suitable and are generally pretty expensive.
- As Ken points out, you can ship the boat across and fly to meet it. That is not cheap but neither is fuel, wear and tear on the boat.

Sail
- Global range
- More comfortable in rough seas
- More likely to handle stormy weather safely.
- At sea with just wind and waves, no engine noise to intrude is magical.
- Managing the sails and rigging is more work that just cranking the engine but I find it rewarding.

[markpierce]

Cost shouldn't be the deciding factor. One needs to compare your physical capacity, boating goals/waters, personal preference, and so on. Many sailboaters "graduate" to motored/non-sail vessels as they get older. Most sail and motor boats aren't designed for trans-oceanic cruises.

[hoppy]

Originally Posted by markpierce

Cost shouldn't be the deciding factor. One needs to compare your physical capacity, boating goals/waters, personal preference, and so on.

I agree. I personally couldn't imagine how terrible it would be to have to sit and listen to the engine droning on and on whilst being totally bored with nothing to do. I love the sound of the wind and the waves and enjoy trimming the sails and happily make the effort to fly the gennaker when I can.

You need to decide on what feels right to you...

Originally Posted by markpierce

Most sail and motor boats aren't designed for trans-oceanic cruises.

Perhaps they are not designed for it, but most sailboats can be prepared for and can do trans-oceanic cruises. On the other hand I'm not sure that so many motor can be prepared to be taken out of their comfort zone..



One thing on the motor $$$ v sail $$$ discussions here, I get the feeling that they have been very US centric. Once you cross the pond and it becomes € and£ then fuel costs rise dramatically whilst sailing equipment pricing can rise very little. So financially the advantage swings to sail and this is very much reflected in the numbers of cruising sail v motor boats you see in anchorages over here.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by ladycruiser

Sailorboy.... I don't won't to hold off on getting the boat... Then the next few years wouldn't yield anytime at sea whenever I want!!!


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That's the thing isn't it, it's the "want" part. Marinas and mooring fields are full of little used boats people got to provide seatime, but got over it and are just sucking money out of their accounts. But the dream lives.

I got a boat early to learn on and we spend every weekend plus on it. But if I had waited I could have left already on the money spent to maintain and use the boat while getting "seatime". If you want to sail now get a boat. if you want to cruise in a few years don't get a boat until you are close to ready to leave.

Hope it works out for you. But CF gets lots of these first timer threads "I don't know what boat I need to get but want to sail across the ocean etc"

[Kenomac]

For some on CF the "cruising dream" seems to be an all or nothing life choice, and because of that.... they never actually get out and away from their computer screens and do it. They waste years meticulously planning out the entire process down to the smallest detail... looking for reasons not to go. "Is it safe?" "Do I have enough money?" "How much money do I need?" Do I have enough anchor chain?" "Do I have too much anchor chain?" Do I have the right anchor?" "Healthcare coverage?" "Is this much money enough?" "How much money do I need?" "Is this boat too big?" "Is this boat too small?" "What if I get sick?" On and on and on, blah, blah, blah....

For others like us and most of the folks we know who are actually out cruising.... it's a lifestyle that can be done part-time. Powerboat or sailboat... it doesn't matter.

Just think of all the memories on the water you wouldn't or won't have if you choose to wait.

Buy now, and enjoy. Keep your boat in Long Beach, CA Shoreline Village. it's a wonderful place with lots of restaurants and it's right on the beach. Get you name on the list, which usually takes 6 months to a year for your name to get to the top for a slip.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

For some on CF the "cruising dream" seems to be an all or nothing life choice, and because of that.... they never actually get out and away from their computer screens and do it. T

For others like us and most of the folks we know who are actually out cruising.... it's a lifestyle that can be done part-time. Powerboat or sailboat... it doesn't matter.

Must be nice to be able to just come and go from work.

[Cheechako]

What does "hitting the high seas" mean? That's a key question. If you plan on world cruising then sail is the only way to go. If planning coastal cruising, jumping to the Bahamas etc, then a trawler is head and shoulders better accommodation. Open , airy, light and not cave-ish. or a Catamaran has much of both.


I agree with Kenomac... doesn't have to be all or nothing. Buy a boat, spend vacations on it. Find out how much you like it.

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by ladycruiser

I know I will catch a lot of flack for this question.... But here goes my first post after stalking for months and months

I know the cost considerations of fuel vs cost of rigging etc.... I wanna hear all the other positives and negatives

I have a $300k budget for the boat which I plan to purchase within the next year..... Planning to hit the seas within two weeks of my youngest graduating high school.... 6 more years but I wanna get the boat now to learn her and gain more experience.... and take shorter trips figuring out what more I need to outfit her with etc ect

I wouldn't say that I'm even close to an avid sailor.... My first time sailing was when I was 16yrs old.... Took sailing in college learning on small dinghy sails.... Gave it up for years after having kids.... 3 years ago I started sailing again and have been learning on a 36' hunter. I get out a few times a month and more when time allows.... I love sailing but my partner will have zero sailing experience and no way for me to teach him before we leave due to him being in another country.

My conservative budget will give me 6-8 years living the dream (poor) seeing the world with no time constraints.... And hopefully longer if I Can come up with a way to make money while traveling.... Currently the plan is an early retirement/ very long sabbatical.... Selling my shares in my company, selling off the house and all other assets.....

This is a life long dream and I wanna start the process now so I am completely prepared.... Now just need to decide on the right boat!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

A few things:
1) Don't let strangers on the Internet tell you what kind of boat to buy. You're asking on a forum dominated by sailors but there are some power boaters here. Post the same question on a trawler forum and you'll get different answers. Before you invest your life savings in any boat you should get out there and try them out. What works for some folks doesn't work for others. You can see by my avatar that I have a small trawler. Not something for ocean crossings but perfect for the cruising we do on the US east coast.

2) Remember, that $300K boat is going to need maintenance and repairs. Don't spend every cent you have on the purchase price.

3) And probably most important, your though of selling everything you have and sailing off into the sunset only works if you die at sea. Most folks live longer than their ability to boat (particularly their ability to "sail" a boat). At some point, most likely you or your partner will have to return to land to live out your days. You will need a place to live and funds for food and medical care. Be sure that is part of your plans.

Do some research and planning on your own. Don't blindly follow the advice of strangers on the Internet.

[sailpower]

She says that she wants to cross oceans. On the power side there isn't much out there for 300k that will do that safely.

However, a properly prepared Hatteras 58 LRC for example would be a choice but they are old (1975-1981). They can be bought in her price range but will require more $ to prepare/upgrade.

Hatteras Long Range Cruisers

A heavily built yacht designed for the rigors of extended passages,
the Hatteras 58 LRC (Long Range Cruiser) is a true go any where
cruising yacht of the first rank. She was the first of four
subsequent Hatteras trawler-style yachts—the 42, 48, and 65 LRCs
followed—built from the mid-1970s through the early 1980s.

Still highly regarded on today’s secondary market (a total of 55 were
built), the 58 LRC was built on a full-displacement hull weighing a
dock-crunching 90,000 pounds. Her three-stateroom teak interior
is arranged with a huge engine room separating the staterooms on
the lower level. The pilothouse—with direct flybridge access—is
fully enclosed and private, and a breakfast bar separates the galley
from the expansive salon. A stairway aft in the salon leads to the
master stateroom and engine room.

The covered aft deck of the 58 LRC is large enough for comfortable entertaining (note that the aft deck on many 58s was fully enclosed), and a small cockpit makes boarding and exiting the boat very convenient. A true open-water yacht with transatlantic range, the Hatteras 58 LRC burns only 6 gph at 8 knots and 8–9 gph at her 9.5-knot hull speed with standard GM 4-71 diesels. Larger GM 6-71Ns were optional.

Length Overall..................... 58'2"
Length WL.......................... 52'0"
Beam................................. 17'11"
Draft.................................... 5'10"
Weight........................... 90,000#
Clearance............................ 18'9"
Fuel............................2,390 gals.
Water............................440 gals.
Waste............................200 gals.
Hull Type................ Displacement