Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 27-05-2015, 17:18   #31
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by btrayfors View Post
Absolute bunk! I suppose now you're gonna tell me the compass is obsolete because we have GPS, or radar is obsolete because we have AIS.
Nonsense.

Yes, CW is for hobbyists or affectionados. However, just by chance a lot of those ARE ON BOATS. And, if they choose to use CW as their occasional mode of communication, good on 'em.

This is no reason to discourage someone who wants to learn CW, nor is it right to say that CW isn't useful on a boat, or that sextants are obsolete and no longer useful on a boat.

Bill
chill dude. chill

I have no intention of 'discouraging' him what so ever. If he wants to learn CW, then I encourage him to go for it. he doesn't need my blessing to do so

And NO I'm not going to claim a compass is obsolete or radar and the annology is pointless. both compass, GPS, radar and ais are all current and pretty much essential systems.

You concur that Morse is for 'affectionists and hobbyists'! that's all I was saying.
__________________

__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 17:28   #32
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozdigennaro View Post
Grouchy grouchy.

We can say that CW is specialized, limited in scope, old school -- but "obsolete" ? No.

It has the advantage of getting a message through with a lower signal-to-noise ratio. Could that be of use on a sailboat? Yes. But rarely.

Learn and use code for fun, for challenge, for bragging rights!

(I got my ham license two months AFTER the code requirement was lifted.)

Oz


Maybe I used the wrong word.

1.
no longer in general use; fallen into disuse:
an obsolete expression.

If I used the term extinct, then Id understand the reaction, but 'obsolete' seems to fit from a dictionary explanation. But hey, no problem. I ammend my comment to,

Morse is now 'no longer in general use', but by all means if you want to spend the time to learn it and get involved with some if the enthusiasts out there (sorry, hobbyists), then you go for it.

But on your boat, make sure you have a current radio system to call for assistance when needed. And an epirb.
__________________

__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 17:52   #33
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,019
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

If you can find video of this it's kind of humbling. Jay Leno used to run a contest between two fast finger smart phone kids and two hams to see who could send a text message the fastest. The CW ham guys won every time by a huge margin.
__________________
transmitterdan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 18:08   #34
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by transmitterdan View Post
If you can find video of this it's kind of humbling. Jay Leno used to run a contest between two fast finger smart phone kids and two hams to see who could send a text message the fastest. The CW ham guys won every time by a huge margin.



He is one done from 2009. Text was 25 seconds faster. Six years later and with the use of smart phones I doubt text messaging has got slower?
__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 18:33   #35
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,019
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

No it hasn't, but the hams Jay picked were proficient at more than 5-10WPM like the ham in that video. If you have 2 hams that can send and receive at 40WPM like Jay had the text guys can't begin to match it. And if you have machines talking to machines with CW they can reliably do it at 60WPM.
__________________
transmitterdan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 18:50   #36
Senior Cruiser
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 11,447
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Look... for routine comms, CW is slow and inefficient compared to voice. But when the conditions are bad, your batteries won't support more than a watt or two of transmit power,your EPIRB has fallen overboard, your mast is lying in the water and you are reduced to a bit of wire lying on the deck for an antenna... CW has a far greater chance of getting through to one of the many, many hams worldwide that enjoy using this archaic means of communications than any of the other options commonly available.

Some of the members of our daily maritime mobile net (the "Comedy Net") also enjoy a CW net which emphasizes QRP (very low power) contacts. They often start out at ONE watt, and then reduce from there. 100 MILLIWATTS is often enough for good copy at distances of several hundred miles. Try that on SSB!

So, it may not appeal to all cruisers, but CW still has a useful aspect in the modern communications world.

Cheers and 73,

Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II , lying Port Cygnet, Tasmania once again
Jim Cate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 20:02   #37
Registered User
 
unanchored's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 25
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Interesting digression on morse code!!
Moxie girl thanks for asking!👍👍👍
There is a CW emergency channel??



Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
unanchored is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 20:30   #38
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Boat: Valiant 40-169
Posts: 175
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by btrayfors View Post
Mixed bag.

Winmor is a digital technology which doesn't require a Pactor modem; it uses your computer's sound card. Currently, I believe, it's only useful on the ham bands, since there's no marine shore station using Winmor. At best, Winmor is about as fast as Pactor 2, i.e., nowhere near as fast as Pactor 3 or P4 nor as robust.

WinLink refers to a global messaging system for email over the ham bands, using a network of shore stations worldwide. It can use Pactor modems up to Pactor 3, but not Pactor 4 yet on the ham bands until the FCC rules change, hopefully very soon.

Pactor 4 modems can be used on the commercial marine bands (e.g., with SailMail shore stations so equipped), using software which is nearly identical to that often used in the WinLink system (AirMail). The new fashionable software for the WinLink system is RMS Express, and I understand the WinLink development team has been concentrating on developments and improvements to that system, rather than AirMail. However, I understand that at present RMS Express cannot be used on the marine bands.

Here's a comparison of some of the client software technologies involved:
http://www.winlink.org/ClientSoftware

The technology is constantly evolving, and I'm no expert so take the above with a grain of salt.

Bill
WA6CCA
I have been using RMS Express and a Tigertronics Signalink USB external modem for about two years now and I am quite happy with my ability to send/receive emails, download grib files, text weather reports and weather faxes. In particular I used it extensively last fall and over the winter as I sailed from Vancouver, BC, to San Diego and then on the Mexico. Perhaps a Pactor 3 or 4 works better however for 1/10th the cost I think the Signalink works fine. The "client program", RMS Express, seems to be under continual improvement as I am often notified that a newer version is available whenever I open up the program. There is a Winmor group on Yahoo that you can subscribe to if you have a ham license and get all the info on this you need. Also check out www.Winlink.org Note that this is for ham bands so only licensed hams can use the program. My success has led two other boats to install the same system and they are quite happy with the results as well.
cheers,
Gordon
VA7GEW
__________________
gordwedman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-05-2015, 21:00   #39
Certifiable Refitter/Senior Wannbe
 
Wotname's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: Van DeStat Super Dogger 31'
Posts: 7,331
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
……….
But when the conditions are bad, your batteries won't support more than a watt or two of transmit power,your EPIRB has fallen overboard, your mast is lying in the water and you are reduced to a bit of wire lying on the deck for an antenna... CW has a far greater chance of getting through to one of the many, many hams worldwide that enjoy using this archaic means of communications than any of the other options commonly available…………
And if Ya don't know ya Morse, Ya can kiss ya A@#$ goodbye

__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
Wotname is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 02:07   #40
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Probably in an anchorage or a boatyard..
Boat: Ebbtide 33' steel cutter
Posts: 3,537
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

- .... . / -- --- .-. ... . / .-. . --.- ..- .. .-. . -- . -. - / .... .- -.. / -... . . -. / -.. .-. --- .--. .--. . -.. / .-- .... . -. / .. / -.. .. -.. / -- -.-- / .- -.. ...- .- -. -.-. . -.. / .... .- -- / .-.. .. -.-. . -. ... . --..-- / -... ..- - / .. - / -.. --- . ... / ... . . -- / ...- . .-. -.-- / .- -.-. - .. ...- . --..-- / --- -. . / -.. .- -.-- / .. / -- .. --. .... - / .-.. . .- .-. -. .-.-.-


__________________
conachair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 02:24   #41
Registered User
 
El Pinguino's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Punta Arenas ahorra
Boat: 39' Westerly Sealord
Posts: 3,948
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

-. --- - / . ...- . -. / .-. . -- --- - .-.. -.-- / -.. . .- -..

Just listen to the bottom end of 20 or 40 metres when there is a contest in progress..... or pretty much any other time when the band is open

...- -.- ...-- .--- ..-. ....
...- .--. ---.. -.. -. --
El Pinguino is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 02:35   #42
Registered User
 
El Pinguino's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Punta Arenas ahorra
Boat: 39' Westerly Sealord
Posts: 3,948
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post


He is one done from 2009. Text was 25 seconds faster. Six years later and with the use of smart phones I doubt text messaging has got slower?
Some years ago they did that with morse via lamp along the north Wales coast...it involved relay stations.... the lamp won

Lamp is slower than CW ... try texting at 25 wpm or higher
El Pinguino is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 03:20   #43
Registered User
 
Rustic Charm's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Boat: Bieroc 36 foot Ketch
Posts: 4,898
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Pinguino View Post
Some years ago they did that with morse via lamp along the north Wales coast...it involved relay stations.... the lamp won

Lamp is slower than CW ... try texting at 25 wpm or higher
'Flags' were quick too apparently. In the early 1900's there were signal stations the fifty miles from our heads up the River to let the city folk know what ships were coming up. It was apparently exceptionally quick and only slowed by the reaction time of the signallers paying attention and responding.

The last text to Morse comp I can find was in 2009. With the advent of smart phones and auto text, I wouldn't mind betting that six years later a proficient texter would be quicker.

But, regardless, it takes time and practice to become proficient in morse. Whilst some don't like to call it 'obsolete', it's still a technology that has had its hey day and I simply can't see, and have never seen it on a modern boat. Any boat for that matter.
__________________
Rustic Charm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 03:36   #44
Registered User
 
El Pinguino's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Punta Arenas ahorra
Boat: 39' Westerly Sealord
Posts: 3,948
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
........
But, regardless, it takes time and practice to become proficient in morse. Whilst some don't like to call it 'obsolete', it's still a technology that has had its hey day and I simply can't see, and have never seen it on a modern boat. Any boat for that matter.
Ever tried to send a CQ by text? Nope... won't work.... nor will your phone 1000 miles offshore.

Yes it does take time to become proficient... like most things worth doing.... and yes it maybe has had its heyday as its no longer used on big ships...

Anyway... now you have seen one that's on a boat..... its an 'industrial grade' Norwegian key that fell orf the back of a ship some years ago.

Meanwhile ... have you received an SMS lately? ... -- ... ? No I haven't either... but some may have..
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC_2115.jpg
Views:	43
Size:	11.6 KB
ID:	102810  
El Pinguino is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 28-05-2015, 03:47   #45
Certifiable Refitter/Senior Wannbe
 
Wotname's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South of 43 S, Australia
Boat: Van DeStat Super Dogger 31'
Posts: 7,331
Re: An HF transreceiver on board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Pinguino View Post
……...

Anyway... now you have seen one that's on a boat..... its an 'industrial grade' Norwegian key that fell orf the back of a ship some years ago.

Meanwhile ... have you received an SMS lately? ... -- ... ? No I haven't either... but some may have..
And now has fallen off CF too…
__________________

__________________
All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangereous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence
Wotname is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fender board fender for a 2X6 board wadanoli Anchoring & Mooring 8 25-10-2015 11:14
Compressor on Board Gisle Fishing, Recreation & Fun 31 13-12-2010 10:15
in board / out board ksmith Monohull Sailboats 25 19-08-2007 23:20
newbie to the board Shipajoy Meets & Greets 7 31-03-2003 10:48
Why another discussion board? Gisle Forum News & Announcements 5 24-02-2003 07:55



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 17:39.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.