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Old 01-09-2015, 06:19   #1
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iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

We have been using Garmin Blue Chart on our IPad for coastal travel. It works well. We are using our IPhone 4s as a hot spot as the IPad has no GPS. Garmin B C is not installed on the phone and we have noticed that our position becomes intermittent if we go out past 10 miles or so. I assume that this is a cellar issue even though the IPhone still works well for all other purposes including the installed Navionics on the phone, however I am not sure as the downloaded Garmin Charts still show without our location indicated on the IPad.

If we install the Garmin app on the IPhone also would this resolve the problem, maybe through Bluetooth or should we purchase a separate GPS receiver for the Ipad?

We are attempting to supplement our Chart Plotter with a backup plotter, in addition to our hand held units, paper charts etc. Not sure I am asking the proper question the right way, as we are somewhat computer challenged.
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Old 01-09-2015, 22:52   #2
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Although the 4s has a real GPS...the antenna is really weak and small compared to later models, so once you are out of cell range and do not have the help of A-GPS you are likely to get wider deviation in fixes.

The newer model phones have much more robust chips and antennas.

What exactly do you mean when you say "position becomes intermittent"?
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Old 02-09-2015, 05:23   #3
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
Although the 4s has a real GPS...the antenna is really weak and small compared to later models, so once you are out of cell range and do not have the help of A-GPS you are likely to get wider deviation in fixes.

The newer model phones have much more robust chips and antennas.

What exactly do you mean when you say "position becomes intermittent"?
Thank you Z. The IPad has been very consistant when near land, say within eight miles or so, working through the IPhone hotspot. We were recently on the Gulf Coast between Mississippi and the Florida panhandle. The IPad worked just fine there but quit giving our position when we were at Dauphin Island and out in the Gulf, say twelve miles or so. It still showed the Garmin Maps but without out location. As we returned toward the mainland we would appear again on the chart. We are now back in Slidell, LA and all is well at the moment with the IPad.

Did not realize it could be the phone as you suggest, because it seemed to retain all of its other abilities, including its Navionics functions at all of the above mentioned locations. The phone would be a simple fix as we are now eligible for an upgrade. Hope you are right. Will give it a try.
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Old 02-09-2015, 06:08   #4
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Does a personal hotspot feature on the iPhone share the GPS from the iPhone? I don't think so.
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Old 02-09-2015, 08:42   #5
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

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Originally Posted by LEOCAT66 View Post
Thank you Z. The IPad has been very consistant when near land, say within eight miles or so, working through the IPhone hotspot. We were recently on the Gulf Coast between Mississippi and the Florida panhandle. The IPad worked just fine there but quit giving our position when we were at Dauphin Island and out in the Gulf, say twelve miles or so. It still showed the Garmin Maps but without out location. As we returned toward the mainland we would appear again on the chart. We are now back in Slidell, LA and all is well at the moment with the IPad.

Did not realize it could be the phone as you suggest, because it seemed to retain all of its other abilities, including its Navionics functions at all of the above mentioned locations. The phone would be a simple fix as we are now eligible for an upgrade. Hope you are right. Will give it a try.
I think you are getting hotspot and bluetooth functionality mixed up. The hostpot allows your other devices to use your phone to talk to the internet. Bluetooth is the technology that needs to be enabled to allow your phone to send data between itself and the ipad.

On the iphone hotspot is done through wi-fi or by direct cable between the a computer and the phone.

So, turn OFF the hotspot and turn ON the bluetooth and "pair" the ipad and the iphone. Here is a video on how to do that:

https://youtu.be/2zWsV40dilw

This may solve your problems without needing a new phone.

- z
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Old 02-09-2015, 09:36   #6
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

My 4S works very well with the Garmin app, well outside of any cellular coverage.
For my Ipad I use a bluetooth GPS, be careful though as most do not support Apple products, only a few do.
Truth is I often use the Ipad with the Garmin app in close as it's charts seems to be better than what is on my plotter or Navionics
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Old 04-09-2015, 21:08   #7
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Thanks to all who have responded with suggestions and advise. Still trying to work through this issue but it will be several months before we are back out there some distance from land. Think that we will find a separate GPS unit for the iPad before we head out again.
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Old 04-09-2015, 21:28   #8
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Hi

Google Bad Elf GPS - these are GLONASS linked GPS units which are highly accurate and plug into iPhones/iPads etc using the 30 pin or lightning connector. I have one for my iPhone 5 and it works well with the iSailor App (transas). They are used both in marine and aviation so good reliability.

Regards
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Old 04-09-2015, 23:05   #9
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

I'm shocked it works as well as it does, because the iPad does not have a GPS. Sharing the iPhone's hotspot does not share it's GPS data.

The position information your iPad is getting is from a service called WPS WPS, which is merely a database maintained by Apple and other cell phone companies of all of the WiFi hotspots in the country and their geolocation. Your iPad's WiFi chip gets the electronic ID of any WiFi hotspots in the area (they don't need to make a connection) and looks up that hotspot via the Internet in the constantly maintained WLS database to figure out where it is.

If you want to use any navigation apps offshore on an iPad, you must have the iPads with the cellular radio, because the GPS is on the cellular chip.

The iPad does not get location data from your iPhone--Only the internet packets are routed through it.

Here's an article explaining WLS. You'll just need to trade your iPad in for a cellular model if you want GPS. You don't have to activate cellular service for the GPS to work.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wi-Fi_positioning_system
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Old 04-09-2015, 23:11   #10
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
Although the 4s has a real GPS...the antenna is really weak and small compared to later models, so once you are out of cell range and do not have the help of A-GPS you are likely to get wider deviation in fixes.

The newer model phones have much more robust chips and antennas.

What exactly do you mean when you say "position becomes intermittent"?
A-GPS is only used to assist the GPS in getting the location for the first fix. Once you have a fix from enough satellites then A-GPS has no value in terms of getting an accurate location.
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Old 05-09-2015, 00:06   #11
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Hi LEOCAT66

Sorry forgot to mention that the Bad Elf GPS units run independent of whether or not your apple device has a GPS (no need for hot spotting). The receiver is contained within the plug in device.

Bad Elf GPS for 30-pin Dock Connector (30 pin plug)

Bad Elf GPS for Lightning Connector (lightning plug)
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Old 05-09-2015, 15:14   #12
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwi64 View Post
Hi

Google Bad Elf GPS - these are GLONASS linked GPS units which are highly accurate and plug into iPhones/iPads etc using the 30 pin or lightning connector. I have one for my iPhone 5 and it works well with the iSailor App (transas). They are used both in marine and aviation so good reliability.

Regards
Have been researching the BAD ELF since your post. Seems like the perfect solution to this particular issue. Will be ordering one soon. Thank you KIWI
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Old 07-09-2015, 16:09   #13
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
I think you are getting hotspot and bluetooth functionality mixed up. The hostpot allows your other devices to use your phone to talk to the internet. Bluetooth is the technology that needs to be enabled to allow your phone to send data between itself and the ipad.

On the iphone hotspot is done through wi-fi or by direct cable between the a computer and the phone.

So, turn OFF the hotspot and turn ON the bluetooth and "pair" the ipad and the iphone. Here is a video on how to do that:

https://youtu.be/2zWsV40dilw

This may solve your problems without needing a new phone.

- z

I don't know if it was overlooked but this is the correct answer. This is the method I have used with my wifi-only iPad hundreds of miles offshore. The iPad can share the signal from pretty much any GPS enabled bluetooth device.
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Old 10-09-2015, 04:58   #14
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Re: iPad/IPhone/Garmin Blue Chart

Thank you COFC, I will certainly try your method first as it is the easiest and least expensive solution. To be honest that was what I originally thought about the GPS signal but became doubtful after I lost it while out a way, thinking I was wrong about the phones ability to share the GPS signal through Bluetooth. I just did not understand why it would not work with one GPS signal but would work with another. I may have had the settings wrong on the phone at that time which caused my doubt.

It is comforting to know that you have had positive results that far out with your setup, which is apparently the same as mine.
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