3 Strand to 8 Plait Splice

[janley]

Is it possible to splice 3 stand rope to 8 plait line? Currently, my anchor rode is made up of 50 feet of chain, 150 feet of rope and 300 feet of 8 plait. The 2 ropes are joined by spliced thimbles. The thimbles can be difficult to get through the hawse pipe. The 3 strand works much better on my windlass. If I didn't need the 3 strand, I would probably only use the plaited line since it stows better in the locker. So what about splicing 3 strand to plaited line?

[colemj]

Do you really need 500' of anchor rode? Are you anchoring in depths over 100'? Maybe just take out the 150' of 3-strand?

Other than that, I am not aware of a way to splice those two. If the thimbles are a problem, you might try to use a Carrick Bend or Fisherman knot to join them.

Mark

[estarzinger]

Two splice solutions:

Easy: Two eye splices without the thimbles.

Harder: put a piece of tape around each line say 18" from the end, completely unravel each to the tape, separate the unraveled 8 strand into 3 bundles and the unraveled 3 strand into four bundles, use the 3 bundles to splice in the normal way to the three strand line (beyond the tape) and use the 4 bundles to splice in the normal way to the 8 strand line, make sure as you go that all fibers are as equally tensioned as you can make them.

[ryon]

Originally Posted by colemj

Do you really need 500' of anchor rode? Are you anchoring in depths over 100'? Maybe just take out the 150' of 3-strand?

Other than that, I am not aware of a way to splice those two. If the thimbles are a problem, you might try to use a Carrick Bend or Fisherman knot to join them.

Mark

I think I'd try the Fisherman's knot, or better yet the Double Fisherman's. Lindsey Philpott recommends leaving the ends at least 12 diameters long, so you might want to whip and seize the ends. The dissimilar rope could possibly be an issue, but maybe that's over thinking things.

[Stumble]

Originally Posted by estarzinger

Two splice solutions:

Easy: Two eye splices without the thimbles.

Harder: put a piece of tape around each line say 18" from the end, completely unravel each to the tape, separate the unraveled 8 strand into 3 bundles and the unraveled 3 strand into four bundles, use the 3 bundles to splice in the normal way to the three strand line (beyond the tape) and use the 4 bundles to splice in the normal way to the 8 strand line, make sure as you go that all fibers are as equally tensioned as you can make them.

This was my first thought but I can't think of any way to ensure the loads are being picked up evenly. Absent testing I would assume the strength would be the lesser of the bundles strength. Which (just guessing) would be the two strand bundle from the eight plait.

The only way to know would be to do some destruction testing on a good number of samples. And frankly this is such an unusual setup I can't see the point.

[UNCIVILIZED]

EDIT: This topic to some degree begs the question, how is your chain attached to the rope portion of your rode? And if it's by shackle & thimble, is this connection all that much easier to deal with than the one where the two rope rodes are shackled together?
Odds are that it is, but, I'm curious to hear the OP's thoughts?

Also, is connecting the two rope rodes together via thimbles & splices only, an option?
Meaning, pry open one thimble until you can interlink the two together. Then squeeze it back shut. Followed by splicing the respective lines onto the thimbles.
I'd think that such a setup would likely slide through a deck pipe a good bit more easily than one with a shackle. And other than the time spent splicing, it can't hurt to check.

The catch being that with 3-strand being involved in this setup, if/when the boat begins to swivel around the anchor; splice, thimbles only, or thimbles & shackle, the 3-strand stands a good bit higher chance of hockling. Followed more than likely by failure.

Originally Posted by Stumble

This was my first thought but I can't think of any way to ensure the loads are being picked up evenly. Absent testing I would assume the strength would be the lesser of the bundles strength. Which (just guessing) would be the two strand bundle from the eight plait.

The only way to know would be to do some destruction testing on a good number of samples. And frankly this is such an unusual setup I can't see the point.

Both, or rather all, very good thoughts. Ingenious one Evan. And I'm with Stumble on this in terms of efficacy testing of new splices. While in theory it sounds great, I can think of a rigger or two I'd call about it. And or a rope manufacturer or two, if I thought that I could get a straight answer out of them.
I can't imagine that it'd hurt to try the latter. Just try & get a directory of departments for the company first.

To add a/another KISS option, why not just swap the sequence of the rope rodes around? I'm kind of doubting that the 3-strand would be coming out of the locker too often, with so much other rode in front of it.

[janley]

Thanks everyone,

First, I regularly anchor in 10 to 15 fathoms.

Second, the 3 strand is used because it is the only line that my windlass's groove can pick up. That is why I need it after the chain. If the windlass could pick up the plait, then I would use all plait after the chain and not bother with the 3 strand.

Third, I have done as Uncivilized described and interlinked the two thimbles. Both are spliced eyes and served. The chain to 3 strand uses a thimble and shackle. This is also a prob with the hawse pipe. I could solve this by using one of the two or three rope to chain slices but they do seem to invite chafe.

Or I could just get a larger hawse pipe. My searches so far have not found any.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Might you use one of the more slender, double ended swivels to connect you chain to your 3-strand? To both lessen the odds of hockles, as well as aiding in your rode feeding? Also, what size hawse are you using, as in my travels I've seen some fairly large non-custom ones. Like 4" diameter.

And as much as you'd be remiss to give it up, might you part with your multiplait & go all 3-strand. That or go with a longer length of chain.
I know that I've come across sources of chain online where it's price literally is about on par with multiplait, assuming one buys it in bulk.

PS: Out of curiosity, where do you anchor that depths are routinely so great? The PNW, or? And what's the bottom type?

[roland stockham]

Splicing is significantly stronger then either knots or thimbles because it puts less bend in the rope. Strength of a knot or thimble is dependent on the tightest radius crated. Cant see any reason why the 8 plait to 3 strand splice would not work fine. To splice to the chain I would splice in a 'spare' line of the same diameter and type as the other 3 bundles then splice into the chain using a standard 4/8 plait splice.
Alternatively is it possible to add a rope drum to the windlass?

[Stumble]

Roland,

Find me a published example of plait to three strand splice and I would agree with you that it would be the better option, but I don't know of such a splice that has been tested.


Janlee,

What about just getting either 1) a longer leingth of three strand, or replacing the capstan and using a single piece of plait?