Spectra rigging? What do you think

[charliehows]

I've seen a few of these threads. I'm going to introduce what I call the “neglect factor”. That is – the extent to which a rigging material can be neglected before it becomes truly dangerous. With galvanised steel wire – I've seen totally rusty gal wire, 50 years old, cut to reveal a solid, clean core of still effective wire. Stainless steel wire rigging has the attractive characteristic of looking pristine up to the unpredictable moment it completely fails due to cavitation corrosion. These new plastic ropes are as yet a mystery to me but having seen ordinary poly ropes turned to powder by UV radiation, I wont be buying into them anytime soon. I'd say use them if you will, but observe the use-by-date until we know what the margins really are.

[Cherp]

Dyneema Dux (and other man-made fibres) are the way of the future. Wire (stainless or galvanised) is a man-made steel-based fibre. With rigging, wire is going the way of stone when we moved from the stone age. We didn't run out of stone, just found a better way to do the job.That's how it is with Dyneema and others yet to be invented. None of the VOR yachts have steel. Either does our yacht now...we've made the move.

[Pete7]

So how does it compare with S/S for cost?

Pete

[Cherp]

Much the same. The dyneema due is a little dearer per metre but then you don't have all the stainless fittings, so it tends to even out I think. The dyneema used for shrouds is set up for that task. It is heat treated or some such and pre-loaded (stretched). You need to talk to a rigger about that. We had a pro rigger do ours in Australia. Peter Greig. Brilliant job.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by Cherp

Dyneema Dux (and other man-made fibres) are the way of the future. Wire (stainless or galvanised) is a man-made steel-based fibre. With rigging, wire is going the way of stone when we moved from the stone age. We didn't run out of stone, just found a better way to do the job.That's how it is with Dyneema and others yet to be invented. None of the VOR yachts have steel. Either does our yacht now...we've made the move.

Hi Cherp

Did you DIY or did you have it done for you? If you DIY where did you get your material and advise?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Cherp

Much the same. The dyneema due is a little dearer per metre but then you don't have all the stainless fittings, so it tends to even out I think. The dyneema used for shrouds is set up for that task. It is heat treated or some such and pre-loaded (stretched). You need to talk to a rigger about that. We had a pro rigger do ours in Australia. Peter Greig. Brilliant job.

Was the dyneema Peter used heated and prepared stretched?

[Cherp]

It was factory prepared dyneema Dux for shrouds. Not sure about the exact treatment.

[Pauls]

Galvanized wire main advantage over stainless is long term reliability. Stainless must be exposed to the air to maintain its protective oxide layer. It does corrode and you cannot protect it from corrosion without risking major failure.

Galvanized wire can be (and should be) protected from corrosion without any downside. The ideal way to protect galv wire is to paint it with a couple coats of coal tar epoxy, wrap it with thin layer of a light cloth (think strips of the kind of fabric you use for sheets), paint that with more coal tar, and then slip a thin wall UV resistant plastic tube on to protect the epoxy from UV. I think you'll find that this is a lifetime rig.

Galv is also much cheaper than stainless, but I consider long term reliability to be its major asset.

[charliehows]

estimated life of dynex dux in full UV exposure - 5-8 years ( I'd like to know what the insurance companies are applying to this ) , vs ss - 10 years in general required replacement for insurance, longer if that is not a consideration, vs gal - 1/2 the price of both and up to 20 years fairly easily...

[Snowpetrel]

Originally Posted by charliehows

estimated life of dynex dux in full UV exposure - 5-8 years ( I'd like to know what the insurance companies are applying to this ) , vs ss - 10 years in general required replacement for insurance, longer if that is not a consideration, vs gal - 1/2 the price of both and up to 20 years fairly easily...

I am surprised they are not making plastic tube covers for dynex. I plan on using black poly tube over mine, but its 13mm so will be a bit loose and I'll want to cover it with white or aluminum tape to keep it cool. A bit of white electrical tape over the exposed ends and it should suffer no UV or chafe damage.

[Dave_S]

Found StrongRope - https://www.strongrope.com/ and spoke to Mike Strong who is happy to point me in the right direction to DIY.

There were also reports of longevity of the synthetic and it sounds a lot better than some reports.

This is a Q&A with Peter Greig who Cherp used above (thanks Cherp for his name) https://www.wichard.com.au/dyneema-r...a-peter-greig/

[roverhi]

Don't know where I saw it so can't refer you to the post but someone destruction tested 10 year old Dyneema. They stated that the aged line exceeded the strength requirement after all that time in the sun. Don't know the details of the riggings location and use and what the strength was it exceeded. Anyone else seen this report and can give some details. Has anyone done a real life destruction test of aged synthetic rigging?? There has been enough of it out there that there should be someone whose done the testing.

I talked with Colligo a few years back and they were quoting a 6 year life span but it was very obvious that that was a CYA life span that had a lawyer behind it.

There is an older than 10 years catamaran down the dock from me with synthetic cap shrouds. They still look good and that's with all its life in the tropics. Not definitive as someone would have to destruction test the line see what its real strength is but if appearance is an indication.

[fxykty]

It all sounds great but I’m worried, perhaps needlessly, about chafe. Our main is fully battened with a big roach and when it’s eased to and past the end of the traveller the upper battens lie against our cap shroud and you can see its imprint in the sail. While reefing if not close hauled the same happens, but now with a more actively moving sail as it gently flogs.

We have one 14mm SS shroud per side (plus a bunch of diamonds on the mast) and the shrouds are covered by a hard plastic pipe-like cover. There’s no apparent chafe in the sail (which is 8 years old and has come from France to NZ) so there doesn’t seem to be much friction.

The Dyneema stay to replace should be 16mm and with a textile or hard cover should be fully protected from chafe and UV, so no worse off than SS wire, right?

The initial cost that includes changing the fittings is slightly more than rerigging in SS, but the payoff should be emergency and future replacements.

So, is chafe a non issue, as long as the Dyneema is properly covered?

Still not sure about putting it under our solent furler though.

[Dave_S]

I saw that one as well but can't find it either. If it's the same one they replaced it because of age only to find out they didn't need to.

I'm convinced, something that saves weight, I can do myself better, or at least as well as, someone I pay for, I can easily maintain or replace at sea, is stronger, costs less, and lasts at least as long.

For me, additional windage seems to be the only draw back at an increase of 0.25^2m overall for my boat. I'm not sure what the drag comparison between the two materials/surfaces would be, I suspect the synthetic will have slightly more drag for a given area. Guessing at 10% ? ........ anyone ?

[Training Wheels]

Chafe concerns me too. Met a couple who had dyneema rigging and their capshrouds and aft lowers were all wrapped with tape because the main would chafe them. Plus, always worry about some pissed off guy with a machete!