Electric winch driver

[Pizzazz]

I have been looking at these electric winch drivers for a while and wanted to share some of my research and get opinions of the community. So, the basic premise is that we take a winch bit ($35) and use it on a high torque electric tool to raise the mainsail or genoa. Sometimes to raise a person to the top of the mast.

The general consensus is that the Milwaukee M28 drill is best suited for the task. It has 0-400 rpms range and max torque of 1080 lb-in. It is heavy and expensive though and it is unclear if it produces its max torque and lower rpms.

The professional tools are Winchrite ($750, 1,300 lb-in torque, 130 rpms max) and Ewincher ($1,750, 750 lb-in torque, 80 rpms max). So, we need as much torque as possible and lower rpms. Here is what I found on Amazon:

Durofix cordless ratchet wrench, 12V, $129, 600 lb-in torque, 0-195 rpm. Comes with a battery and charger the speed seems to be perfect. There are lots of other power wrenches, torque seems to vary from 350 to 600 lb-in and they look like a winch handle which would allow applying additional force when needed.

A modern drill, such as the Milwaukee 2804-20 M18 FUEL, 18V, $127+battery, claims 1,200 lb-in max torque, 0-550 rpm. The torque number is attractive and superior to the M28, it is lighter but the shape is nowhere as elegant as the ratchet wrench.

Any thoughts?

SV Pizzazz

[Ben51]

Where do you get the winch bit?

[Pizzazz]

Amazon

[michaeld]

My friend loaned me his configuration: a Harbor Freight right-angled drill with winch bit. It easily hauls me to the top of our 62 ft rig. We run the drill in reverse to use the low speed winch gears.

[Pizzazz]

Originally Posted by michaeld

My friend loaned me his configuration: a Harbor Freight right-angled drill with winch bit. It easily hauls me to the top of our 62 ft rig. We run the drill in reverse to use the low speed winch gears.

Assuming this is the 13 amp corded drill, here we are talking about more than one horse power motor, through an inverter, at 17 lb weight.
The low gear is 0-450 rpm. This is like having a medium sized horse pull you up the mast and is more powerful than most real electric winches. It is definitely a good solution but it may be risky to use AC power on the deck at sea. If anyone wants to go AC powered/corded, there are lighter two speed drills that can do the job as well. May be with the appropriate safety breaker it should not be a problem. But overall, you do not need AC power for the winch. We are torgue limited here, not power limited. Torque limited means appropriate gearing.

[Ben51]

Pizzazz
I assume you mean the Harken Powered furling drill adapter?
You would need to pair this to the Durofix 1/2" drive with a socket and ensure it could not slip out.
Am I following you correctly?

[Pizzazz]

Yep, that is the idea, use a socket and may be some glue to make sure the adapter does not slip. I will do some testing tomorrow and report.

[Afrakes]

I use the Milwaukee 28v right angle drill with winch bit to raise my 40ft. deck stepped mast every spring. I also run it in reverse for slow speed. I used to crank by hand but I'm getting too old for that.

[cabo_sailor]

My concern would be that a torque driver would shock load the winch leading to damage to winch gears. Full disclosure: I recently bought a Winchrite at a substantial discount at a boat show. I’ve not had a chance to try it since my boat has been on the hard for the last three months.

[Pizzazz]

The torque wrench is smooth motion, not an impact driver. The impact drivers would definitely not make sense on a winch. They have high peak torque but less average power and are just wrong for a winch.

[Jim Cate]

Durofix cordless ratchet wrench, 12V, $129, 600 lb-in torque, 0-195 rpm. Comes with a battery and charger the speed seems to be perfect. There are lots of other power wrenches, torque seems to vary from 350 to 600 lb-in and they look like a winch handle which would allow applying additional force when needed.

that's an attractive little tool, for sure. But I find it hard to believe that it's battery can have enough capacity for extended winching, like running me up the mast. The Milwaukee will do this two times with some left over, and our batteries are now 7 years of heavy usage old. They used to do the job three times...

It will be interesting to see if folks start using the 18 V Milwaukee, and how it fares. The 28 V models are not available in Oz and shipping from the states is pricey for heavy items like these. The peak torque values are attractive...

Also, our primary usage does not require max torque, but speed is very important. With our Solen rig, we need to furl the genoa for every tack or gybe, and the faster it winds it in the better the operation goes. Loads are not heavy, but our elder arms are not up to frequent and fast manual furling, so Millie is a favourite crew member on Insatiable!

Jim

[hpeer]

We just got the Milwaukee M28 set up. It does the trick but i find that for that last bit of tension on the main I still need the winch handle and some ass.

[Pizzazz]

So, the ratchet tool did not work. Although it is not an impact driver, it still oscillates quite a bit and while it has the torque, it does hammer the winch (thanks cabo_sailor for pointing it out). So, it is a no go. My next test would be with a mud mixer (these are slow rpm, high torque, could be either AC or battery powered, AC versions are very cheap) and if that one fails to produce satisfactory results, then I am going to the M18 or the M28 drills. I am also warming up to the AC powered versions. No batteries and unlimited power through the inverter.

I also realized what is the ultimate limit for the battery powered tools. Most of these are made of lithium cells, either 3 cells (10.8V, marketed as 12V) or 5 cells (marketed as 18-20V). The typical cell has a max current of 20A, peak current of 30A. Thus, the maximum power that one can get from a 12V tool is about 220W (not enough) and 360W from the 18V tools. May be somewhat higher with advanced cells. This is why the M28 is so good, assuming it uses 8 cells, it should deliver constant power around 575W which is substantial and close to what an electrical winch does. For reference, most of of the AC powered drills deliver between 700W and 1200W. Those are not power limited but need to be two speed to enable the slower speeds.

Regards,
SV Pizzazz

SV Pizzazz