Avoiding knots on an outhaul car

[Swift Drift]

Any recommendations for attaching an outhaul line to the outhaul car without tying a knot?

A splice would be nice but disconnecting would not be possible (sail removal, etc)

A soft shackle crossed my mind but I think it would add too much bulk/length.

Am I stuck with the tried and true halyard hitch?

[Franziska]

Why do you want to get rid of the knot?

[Swift Drift]

1) the knot is very difficult to remove.

2) potential bump in elegance.

[Franziska]

Have look if these guys have something suitable:
https://pdf.nauticexpo.com/pdf/blue-...690-97833.html

Alternative source, check with one of the high tech rope manufacturers.

One of the problems may be the fitting size though...

Not sure though if someone makes a fitting which can be removed several times, especially on such a high loaded location.

You may end up with having to cut a few cm rope for each new installation...

[Dockhead]

My outhaul is double braid racing dyneema. I stripped the cover off the last couple of meters and spliced a loop in the end. Then cow hitched onto the outhaul car by passing the entire length of the outhaul through the loop. The dyneema core of the outhaul is compact and smooth and so this completely solves the problem you have, which I also suffered from, albeit at the cost of having to unreeve the outhaul every time you take it off, but on my boat this only takes a minute.

[Swift Drift]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

My outhaul is double braid racing dyneema. I stripped the cover off the last couple of meters and spliced a loop in the end. Then cow hitched onto the outhaul car by passing the entire length of the outhaul through the loop. The dyneema core of the outhaul is compact and smooth and so this completely solves the problem you have, which I also suffered from, albeit at the cost of having to unreeve the outhaul every time you take it off, but on my boat this only takes a minute.

Great idea! I’m sold. Unreeving is preferable and likely quicker than going to battle with a halyard hitch. Out of curiosity, did you strip the cover far enough back to allow only uncovered dyneema to be exposed atop the boom while the sail is furled? Or does the joint come into view?

[Franziska]

If you can pull the retainer bolt of the shackle easily, you can just pull the bolt, feed the spliced loop through the shackle and put the bolt back in.

On some cars that is done easily.

No need to take the outhaul line out than....

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Swift Drift

Great idea! I’m sold. Unreeving is preferable and likely quicker than going to battle with a halyard hitch. Out of curiosity, did you strip the cover far enough back to allow only uncovered dyneema to be exposed atop the boom while the sail is furled? Or does the joint come into view?

I'd photograph it for you, but I'm in Singapore 10 000 miles away from the boat.


I stripped off a couple of meters so that the core would running bare in the sheave at the clew when the sail is unreefed. That is because it runs better and smoother under the very high tensions on my clew. As you reef the sail (I have in-mast furling), more of the outhaul gets pulled out of the boom and you eventually see the joint. Whether that's unsightly or not is a matter of taste I guess -- I wasn't worried about that, myself. I have a carbon laminate mainsail which can require quite huge outhaul tension (because it can be trimmed very flat and used like that in very strong wind), and I needed this to work just right, whatever the cost.

[Swift Drift]

Thanks Dockhead. That makes sense. Funny you mention your carbon laminate in mast furling main. That’s exactly what I have. In fact, my recent decision to go with this sail was encouraged by what you’ve shared on the forum. I’m currently in the process of upgrading my control lines to double braid dyneema core for reasons you’ve mentioned. Reluctance to use a knot in the dyneema product prompted my original question.

[Swift Drift]

Originally Posted by Franziska

If you can pull the retainer bolt of the shackle easily, you can just pull the bolt, feed the spliced loop through the shackle and put the bolt back in.

On some cars that is done easily.

No need to take the outhaul line out than....

Also a good idea as the bolt is accessible and could be removed. I’m tending more towards the cow hitch since taking my outhaul line out isn’t too difficult. Additionally, I don’t like having small bits of hardware removed if I can avoid it, too much of a chance I’ll drop something.

[Boatguy30]

Generally, you'd need a splice and extra D shackle. Use a Spinnaker guy plastic donut over the line to keep the splice/shackle jamming in the clew block

[Suijin]

Personally I would use dyneema and a brummel splice. To remove the sail I would just tie a mouse line to the outhaul line so you can remove it. Easy.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by Swift Drift

Also a good idea as the bolt is accessible and could be removed. .... Additionally, I don’t like having small bits of hardware removed if I can avoid it, too much of a chance I’ll drop something.

DockHeads solution is a good one.

A direct splice (rather than cow hitched) to the shackle is probably very slightly technically preferred, for 2 reasons - the textile portion is slightly stronger than a cowhitch, and that shackle and bolt should really be inspected once a year or so in any case so withdrawing the bolt to remove the outhaul would give you that opportunity.

But that is dancing on the head of a pin, and either is perfectly fine. The cow hitch strength loss is probably irrelevant and I understand the reluctance to drop bits of hardware in the water . . . . but I would repeat that you really should occasionally inspect that shackle and bolt - it is a decently highly loaded part and they have been known to fail and with the inspection, you might well catch it before it did.

The splice technique would be another matter for discussion. A typically bury splice will have a pretty long fat bury section - you would have to decide whether that would run into the clew sheave well or not. Stripping the cover eases these issues but does raise UV replacement life questions because core is typically not UV coated at all. A tuck splice or an unburied (double or triple) Brummel, but they may work better with some sheaves arrangements. The tuck is full strength but requires just a touch more skill - the unburied Brummel is significantly weaker but easier and shorter still (not much longer than a halyard knot). I'd start with the simple bury and if it works well thru sheave you are all good.

There are additional possibilities (like with dogbones) but they all add some complication and the cow hitch or direct splice nice and simple.

[NahanniV]

I think this would work.

I used that for thousands of miles on my mainsail halyard.

The red ball was just a stopper knot in my case.

There is some chance of it coming undone if you really let the outhaul line get loose, but unlikley even then.

[Franziska]

That's a cool solution.

Originally Posted by NahanniV

I think this would work.

I used that for thousands of miles on my mainsail halyard.

The red ball was just a stopper knot in my case.

There is some chance of it coming undone if you really let the outhaul line get loose, but unlikley even then.