Sailing or Cheating/Motorsailing?

[S/V Blondie-Dog]

If it don't blow... I don't go. Ain't nothing worse than the loud, obtrusive sound of a motor.

[Cheechako]

If I cant do 3.5-4 knots I'm motorsailing. MS to weather gets you about 15 degree further up also. I LOVE the smell and sound of diesel burning!

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by S/V Blondie-Dog

If it don't blow... I don't go. Ain't nothing worse than the loud, obtrusive sound of a motor.

Nice, but it doesn't quite work like that unless you are sailing around the pond or small lake.

Sometimes you go in a blow and the blow slows to a stop then you are being knocked around by the waves that are left. Your choice if you have an engine. Sit there or motor ...............

Another is the wind dying and you just sit for a few hours as I have done more than once on 100 mile distance races on beach cats. Sometimes your fry during the day or freeze during the night after having sailed all day.......

waiting for the wind. Any wind............

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I am a major fan of Syn oil and run it in everything I've had for the last 40 yrs or so, I'm also the guy that keeps a vehicle until it falls apart, not the guy who buys new every couple of years.
But, I believe a strong argument could be made that it's not needed in a small boat Diesel and its a waste of money. Do not use it with the idea of extending oil change intervals, our oils don't really break down, they get full of soot and need to be changed to remove the soot.
I chose to waste the money, it's mine after all.

We've had this conversation before. I wouldn't use anything except synthetic in land engines which were designed for it. But sailboat engines are very different. There is some evidence that synthetic oil is not only a waste of money, but that it's positively harmful to sailboat diesels. See: https://coxengineering.sharepoint.co...htengines.aspx
by a professional petroleum engineer.

I would not, in any case, just dream up your own oil standard. Use what the manufacturer requires, not what YOU think is best - did you design the engine? Are you a petroleum engineer?

Yanmar specifically allow synthetic oil in high powered power boat engines. They say don't use it in their low powered sailboat engines. This is not an accident.

As A64pilot says above, the challenge for sailboat engine oil is not standing up to intense pressure and high internal heat. It's absorbing all the soot and carp which gets into the oil from standing unused for long periods of time and running at cool temps and low load. Change it often, is the best thing you can do with your oil.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

If I cant do 3.5-4 knots I'm motorsailing. MS to weather gets you about 15 degree further up also. I LOVE the smell and sound of diesel burning!

Me too!

I love to sail; I adore it.

But I also like diesel engines. I rather enjoy motoring slowly in a dead calm, or motorsailing downwind in very light wind.

Boats are different, though. Some have awful noisy, shaky installations. My main engine, in a sound-attenuating, sealed engine room, and a turbo engine, purrs like a cat. Nothing unpleasant about the sound at all.

[eyschulman]

If you have a motor you will regret not using it more often. Diesels like to be run. There is no automatic rule that a boat with a sail rig should always sail especially when conditions or time restraints are considered. If you are in a sail race different mind set and rules.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by eyschulman

If you have a motor you will regret not using it more often. Diesels like to be run. There is no automatic rule that a boat with a sail rig should always sail especially when conditions or time restraints are considered. If you are in a sail race different mind set and rules.

I agree completely, but I don't think not running the diesel enough is a problem on any normal cruising boat. A cruiser who sails a whole lot motors only half the time -- by my reckoning. Our boats are really more motorboats with auxiliary sail , than the other way around.

And that coming from the person who has just spent tens of thousands on new sails and rigging in order to be able to sail a few degrees closer to the wind, in order to sail rather than motor when trying to reach a windward destination.

Much bigger problem is the owners' not being on the boat AT ALL. That's the only time the diesels systematically don't get used, in my experience.

I used to cruise with my father in SW Florida, and on more than one occasion we didn't unfurl the sails even once over the course of a whole cruise. Not his fault -- just when there's a high pressure dome in those latitudes, there's no wind.

[bfloyd4445]

Originally Posted by thomm225

As an exbeach cat racing sailor, I have learned that the only time you will never motor is when you don't have an engine.

If you have one, you will most certainly use it from time to time.

If God intended us not to motor he would have never taught us how to build a motor. Geezz....
God first taught man how to make a wheel so that woman could haul more beer....
Why are human females the only mammalian species to have enlarged breasts when not lactating?

Cause God felt sorry for Adam using a rock for a pillow so put breasts on woman.
Is this all beginning to make sense now?
I've learned lots by working with bees.

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by S/V Blondie-Dog

If it don't blow... I don't go. Ain't nothing worse than the loud, obtrusive sound of a motor.

I feel exactly the same way when I'm at the lake considering going out for a sail on my Sunfish, but if I followed that approach last week sailing my cruising sailboat from Gloucester to Maine, I'd have sat there becalmed until rainy/stormy weather arrived late in the week, then would have had to sail in cold rain. When the wind died entirely I loved the sweet sound of the motor.

Aux engines are wonderful things and used judiciously, can be a great aid to take us to where/when the really great sailing conditions can be experienced. Or, if real life intrudes and you just have to be somewhere at a particular time, and mother nature doesn't seem to be inclined to cooperate, the aux engine makes it possible. Without it, unless you're retired with no commitments whatsoever, very few of us would ever be able to go out for a nice sail because we'd be too worried about getting stuck at sea and unable to make it back on time.

[charliehows]

Yeah, I'm pretty much in the motor sailing camp, I love my stinky little diesel. My only reservation is the loss of skill in relying on the engine. The bloody things only break down when you're in difficult circumstances – although if you think about it, you're probably in those difficult circumstances because you didnt plan for the engine to break down. My recollection of one very long trip with a dead engine from the start was that by the end of a couple of days I was very comfortable wafting along using little more than tidal flow, where I would have probably been in a panic if the engine had just dropped out. Having an occasional breakdown keeps the plan B generator sharpened.

[kerrydeare]

Originally Posted by thelifenomadik

"Motorsailig is the norm today, I read someplace, because of the wind, the current, and lots of other reasons " ...
How many of you out there, sailors, actually sail? ...

Somehow I am getting the impression that sailing is somehow a "back to nature" undertaking only for the pure at heart. This despite the dacron or kevlar sails, aluminum spars, synthetic cordage, stainless hardware, a minimum of 50 integrated circuits behind LCD screens, perhaps a mile or so of Anchor braided wiring, and of course the mp3 collection.

My little boat has a nice 18 HP diesel in good condition. I use it when it seems like a good idea to use it. The same comments apply to the life raft, the head, the emergency dental kit, the plastic buckets, the bottles of cheap scotch, and so on.

[Paul J. Nolan]

The harbors are full of boats but a sailor is rare indeed.

Originally Posted by Cheechako

anywhere below 3.5 knots and I'm motorsailing.

The prevailing viewpoint.

Paul

[bfloyd4445]

Originally Posted by kerrydeare

Somehow I am getting the impression that sailing is somehow a "back to nature" undertaking only for the pure at heart. This despite the dacron or kevlar sails, aluminum spars, synthetic cordage, stainless hardware, a minimum of 50 integrated circuits behind LCD screens, perhaps a mile or so of Anchor braided wiring, and of course the mp3 collection.

My little boat has a nice 18 HP diesel in good condition. I use it when it seems like a good idea to use it. The same comments apply to the life raft, the head, the emergency dental kit, the plastic buckets, the bottles of cheap scotch, and so on.

Cheap scotch???....no real sailor would have cheap scotch unless that was his only option. Try upgrading your scotch and maybe you will meet more real sailors

[garrobito]

...I use my sails after use all my diesel..

[roverhi]

We motor sailed going to weather in light wind and chop with our modestly powered Westsail. Could point way up and make 5k with the engine loafing 500rpm above idle. Most other times and other points of sail we sailed if we could make headway. I'm not a coastal cruiser so don't often have 'get to port-itus that affects the harbor hoppers.