Sailing or Cheating/Motorsailing?

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by rognvald

It has been my experience that the majority of "sailors" motor more than sail. Many do so because they are sailing on a time restriction, many because they have a specific destination and wind is irrelevant, many because they bought a sailboat they thought was beautiful but never really learned to sail, many because they bought a boat that is too large and heavy for a small crew to handle and many, although they know the basics of sailing, are insecure when the wind is anything more than light to moderate. This group is largely composed of practical people who have an agenda, a goal and a time frame. Then, there are those who do use their motor in practical, short term situations (anchoring, docking, transiting a river against the current, etc.) but always sail to their destinations and plan their passages not by time, but by the wind. They usually buy boats that sail well as their primary consideration and rig them for maximum ease and efficiency when under sail. These sailors generally do not look at their boats in a practical manner, although they are certainly so, but rather as an escape to a creative endeavor, a return to a time past of a simpler mode of transport or a necessary respite from the banality, convention and unimaginative people and life that surrounds them. You usually won't find them in the smart marinas, drinking cocktails in camp seaside bars, or nestled in crowded anchorages among the bellowing herd. You might even travel a lifetime on the water and never really meet one or if you do, you might never know. But sail they do on their own terms and their own time and for the love of sail. In the words of Webb Chiles: "A sailor is an artist whose medium is the wind." Good luck and good sailing.

I thought this was a pretty good post meself. It's an observation(s), a personal one, nothing pedantic about it.

I was a decent sailor as a young guy, now I motor a lot. Who cares?

[Shellbuyer]

I owned powerboats for years and agree some are operated by people who should not be operating a wheelbarrow! However it is hard to criticize one group of people enjoying the water..... Since I have switched to sailboats, I can honestly tell you the comradeship I have seen between sailers is something a notch above powerboaters, I have no idea about jet skis because truthfully I dislike them, but my opinion.... I think operators of powerboats especially,
should have to pass a test to get a license, just like a drivers license which should include docking in wind. Just my opinion.... Thanks


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[markpierce]

Originally Posted by Shellbuyer

... Since I have switched to sailboats, I can honestly tell you the comradeship I have seen between sailers is something a notch above powerboaters, ... .... I think operators of powerboats especially,
should have to pass a test to get a license, just like a drivers license which should include docking in wind.

Sailboats operating their engines are considered motorboats, subject to the same navigation rules as power boats. Why not require auxiliary-powered boaters to pass a test if it is necessary for powerboaters and learn when to fly a motoring cone? And except for dinghies, sailboaters almost always use their engines to dock, wind or no wind. Maybe sailboaters should pass a test to dock under sail only.

[Flanza4]

I don't see how you cannot use the motor, otherwise your fuel goes bad.


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[zeehag]

bad fuel is polishable, as it really never goes bad..lol.. i have used 5 yr old diesel fuel with zero negative impact on my engine.. rodlmffao. gasoline goes bad, yes. diesel--only a dock queen can say fuel deteriorates.... use stabil and or bio bor. good stuff. keeps your fuel usable. and polish it as you need. polishing is merely filtering and pumping....

[w1651]

Originally Posted by markpierce

Sailboats operating their engines are considered motorboats, subject to the same navigation rules as power boats. Why not require auxiliary-powered boaters to pass a test if it is necessary for powerboaters and learn when to fly a motoring cone? And except for dinghies, sailboaters almost always use their engines to dock, wind or no wind. Maybe sailboaters should pass a test to dock under sail only.

I docked my sailboat under sail where I am now. I heard about it from the stink pot owners to the dock master and back around the marina again. So can you use a engine to dock your boat? Of course you can. Can you sail into a marina past stink pots worth millions safely and dock in your slip? Absolutely! Will you hear about it from a bunch of little girls overcompensating because they are lacking in other areas of their lives. You betcha! Did I care how much they wined and complained about it? Nope it was priceless!

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by w1651

I docked my sailboat under sail where I am now. I heard about it from the stink pot owners to the dock master and back around the marina again. So can you use a engine to dock your boat? Of course you can. Can you sail into a marina past stink pots worth millions safely and dock in your slip? Absolutely! Will you hear about it from a bunch of little girls overcompensating because they are lacking in other areas of their lives. You betcha! Did I care how much they wined and complained about it? Nope it was priceless!

Cap,

The above post reads like you invented the notion of docking under sail.

A couple of years ago you did not know what kind of line was used for halyards. (I can back that up.)

I believe you are trying to lay some boogie woogie on the kings and queens of rock and roll.

Dennis Connor sails his boat into a slip, no one says a word. W1651 heads into the fairway, perhaps some are concerned.

[Flanza4]

I use both bio bor and stabil but I never knew you could go that long on diesel ? Wow


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[w1651]

Originally Posted by Blue Crab

Cap,

The above post reads like you invented the notion of docking under sail.

A couple of years ago you did not know what kind of line was used for halyards. (I can back that up.)

Your right it's funny what happens when you crew on weekends and race on thursday nights. And it can happen very quickly.

[zeehag]

when we managed a perfect landing under sail in san diego at a shelter island work dock due to engine fail, we were severely chastised and advised that folks do NOT do that, it is frowned upon, etc.. i had to laugh so loud,, didnt hear the rest of the words. didnt think em appropriate...

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by Flanza4

I don't see how you cannot use the motor, otherwise your fuel goes bad.


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But that gives the purists an excuse to claim that sails are much more reliable when they relate how thier 10yr old diesel clogged the filter and killed the engine.

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by w1651

Your right it's funny what happens when you crew on weekends and race on thursday nights. And it can happen very quickly.

Good on ya Cap. That's how sailors are made.

On this old diesel fuel thingy, I've heard a lot of talk about it but I find it inconceivable that diesel loses none of its oomph (technical term) over the long term. Indeed, leave it alone and it supports growth of real living things.

A buddy of mine was given a 55 gal drum of "old" diesel ( I think it was just a couple of years old but the implement owner didn't want to trust it in his high dollar equipment). So my buddy, a savvy guy, pumped it into his oil heating tank. I was there. The stuff looked wonderful. It was clear, red in that stylish off-road way, and essentially appeared to be a free $1500.

oh boy was that a mistake. And many filters later, my savvy buddy drained most of it back out after a winter of major discontent. I can barely spell chemistry but dem are the facts as I know them.

A guy here at my current dock has some 6 or 9 year old stuff he brags about still being good. I'd say that's more a testament to his Ford Lehman diesel's dining habits than anything else.

I feed my 18 horses fresh stuff. Keep 'em sprayed down, and they drink fresh water as the gods intended. I love my little diesel so much I sleep right next to it, much as I did as a 10 year old with that first .22 rifle.

That was a fine day, almost matched by the look on my son's face when I gave him my much-loved, scoped Winchester semi auto .22. Truth be told, he wanted my stainless Mini-14 more but that wasn't an option.

Heh. GUN THREAD!

[Exile]

I keep my two diesel tanks topped off, but if I haven't been on the boat for awhile I always drain/pump a bit off the tank bottom into a plastic bottle and let it sit. If there's water, you'll clearly see it on the bottom of the bottle, sometimes along with the bugs at the water/diesel line. No water = no bugs = no problem. Not sure about the fuel losing its btu's or other issues, but periodically adding both stabilizer & Biobor (in the specified amounts) doesn't hurt. The water probably gets in via the vent hose via condensation, so the bigger the temp swings the more potential for water getting in. Also need to replace those deck fill o-rings at reasonable intervals, and have lots of spare fuel filters onboard!

[MBWhite]

Not a sailing story, but I have a bulldozer here that I have seized the injection pump on by running it on fuel that was no more than 18 months old, and probably closer to 12.

Prior to my little episode I pretty much have never had a problem with any diesel running on old fuel, now I am afraid I'm going to be a bit chicken forevermore in regards to old diesel fuel.

[MBWhite]

And getting back on topic, do whatever you like as long as it is legally allowed and screw what anyone else says or thinks.