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Old 28-09-2009, 01:04   #46
DtM
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Oh I can so relate to SkiprJohn and the dead man's key.

Now why won't this damn motor start ....... My Admiral had such a laugh !!!!
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Old 04-10-2009, 12:54   #47
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outboard fun....

Glad you found the problem! In the olden days I used a Seagull outboard that in seperate instances: ran just fine with the sparkplug cap waving in the breeze (arced across the stator plate), flailed me unmercifully with the starter cord (I made the mistake of replacing the stock rubber end piece with one made of wood...ouch!) and ran out of fuel in the small fuel tank so often that it really was like a training device for this manuver, complete with real life consequences! Those were the days my friend.....

Bob
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Old 04-10-2009, 14:34   #48
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Hi Sara,

I imagine you probably have an American accent but when I read your accounts, in my mind I can hear you talking as if you'd been born and raised in Dublin
It's always nice to see that you've posted again, you have a lovely way with words.

Fair winds

Paige
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Old 04-10-2009, 20:29   #49
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Relee

Your story of the Seagull made me laugh,I had forgotten my adventures and misadventures with that little beast back more years ago than I like to admit!
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Old 04-10-2009, 21:13   #50
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So we had another abortive attempt yesterday. Between when we decided to go out, and when we stared backing out of the slip the wind came up. We were in for a big blow but didn't know it yet. We backed out fine but when I tried to bring her forward into the wind and to starboard our little motor just couldn't do the job.

ARRGH.

We wound up wrangling her back in to the slip and then sniping at each other in frustration and disapointment. I crawled under to the quarter-berth and cleaned until I felt better and Himself was over his snit. This slip is giving me fits...

By evening, about when we would have been coming back in it was blowing gales and we were both glad to not be making our way back up our narrow channel in it. Himself was wondering what we would have done had we been out and I said "toss out an anchor and come in in the morning when it died down." Really I have no idea how we could have maneuvered her in 30 knot winds.

A neighbor made the friendly comment that "not going out was a good decision" and we agreed with him... but it's no fun to choke like that. We should have been able to get out. I was taken by surprise at how impossible it was to bring the bow around with the wind coming down at us from just off the starboard bow.

It's nice to hear from you all that we aren't the only ones who are struggling with the outboard learning curve...

And thank you Paige for the kind words... but you know, I'm from California; we don't HAVE accents!

; -)
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Old 05-10-2009, 14:25   #51
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You did good Sara, no doubt about it. Getting overpowered can lead to nasty problems. Like running up on the rocks at 5 knots because you can't turn into the wind. I put my Grampian



up on the side of Murray Canal at the east end of Lake Ontario because I chose to change the 9.9 mercury to a 5 hp Mariner. Good little engine, but not able to power her into a strong wind. I then had a hell of a time getting into the Olympic harbour in Kingston Ontario in a gale.

My mistake didn't cost me anything other than a ding in the bow strap and a busted shear pin, but it taught me a valuable lesson. Unless you have the power to horse her around against the wind, you will always have a potential disaster on your hands every time the wind comes up.

Ultimately you are the one who is responsible for the safety of all on board, so cancelling a sail because conditions changed for the worse is not a sign of timidity or even cowardice, its a sign of wisdom. Don't feel bad about choking. You didn't. You exercised some wisdom.

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Old 05-10-2009, 14:56   #52
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Cal 28 6000lbs

Isn't the rule of thumb for engine sizing

1HP per 1000lbs of displacement - just enough to move boat in marina

1HP per 500lbs of displacement - reasonable range for monohull sailboats and windage

I have an 10hp inboard deisel at 6400lbs and can find it underpowered in the channel in high winds.
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Old 05-10-2009, 15:17   #53
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The Gramp weighed in at about 5900 lbs. so the 9.9 was a tad light too but for most purposes it worked fine. Espie is 15,500 with a 30hp, seems ok. Sabre Dance is 20,200 with 28 hp. Sometimes a bit of a pig but ok most of the time. I'd agree that a minimum 2hp per 1000 lb is a good rule of thumb.

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Old 05-10-2009, 16:03   #54
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integral tanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by relee View Post
and ran out of fuel in the small fuel tank so often that it really was like a training device for this manuver, complete with real life consequences! Those were the days my friend.....

Bob
I have a buddy that bought a new OB with an integral tank for his dinghy and every time we go out to explore the has to bring an extra tank?! He runs out at least once. They realy don't give you any range and you have to bring a spare can anyway.

Spilling fuel into the water over the hot engine.......
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Old 05-10-2009, 16:51   #55
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My mistress Juon, a 12 meter steel hull sloop weigh in at about 16 tons and is powered by a 36 HP Yanmar. Long before she looses the ability to power through the seas, the pounding and the motion make you want to find a less direct way of getting to where you are heading!
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Old 05-10-2009, 17:12   #56
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I have a buddy that bought a new OB with an integral tank for his dinghy and every time we go out to explore the has to bring an extra tank?! He runs out at least once. They realy don't give you any range and you have to bring a spare can anyway.
Out little 3.3 hp OB has an integral tank. Its good because you can easily swing the OB onto the dink. Buy its not really the thing for exploring. The engine size is too small. Its just a dink engiine to get into the beach/dock. A 1 mile jaunt is a pain.
We carry a spare 1 gal tank with it so its not a space issue.

Our 9.9 hp has a huge tank that keeps sliding around and getting in the way. The ngine is too big to throw up to the yacht so its a pain to ship/unship. But its good for exploring or when ata safe ancorage for a long period.

Davits will fix the problem - but we are having problems getting reasonable davits quotes!
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Old 05-10-2009, 17:39   #57
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well... we displace something like 6000lb naked. So I guess it's more like 7000 with the gear we have on board...

which means we are underpowered...

Funny, This weekend we were talking about the Baja Ha-Ha and wanting to do it in 2 years. This year neither we nor tsunami are ready. Next year the youngest will be in the middle of all her college applications. The year after should be golden.

And Himself said we needed to find a bigger motor to do that. Like a 20 hp with something called a long shaft, which he says he has read would be better for us, although he doesn't know why.

Maybe we need that bigger motor sooner rather than later.

We are looking for a portabote for a dingy, and maybe we could use the little Johnson on it...
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Old 05-10-2009, 18:11   #58
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Long shaft

Yes an OB on a sailboat usualy has a longshaft. If you have a short shaft you may notice it rising up out of the waves in rough seas.
20hp sounds like a tad much for your Cal 28. Remember you wont go above hull speed. Most of the OB around here are 9.9 or maybe 15 at the most.

A dinghy is another question... as Mark wrote there is range, weight and if you want to plane.

I have an older 5hp Mercury 2 stroke on my inflatable, its about as much as I want to lift off the pushpit.
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Old 05-10-2009, 18:28   #59
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Is the issue of size tied to the structure it will be mounted to?

If we are 6000 naked I figure that for cruising weight we will get up to 9000 pretty easy what with water and fuel and all.

2hp per 500 lbs was your recommendation above so that would be like 18hp,and 20 seemed like a nice round number. Rather not need to run her at full throttle. Am I missing something here?

And what is 'hull speed' please?
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Old 05-10-2009, 22:44   #60
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This A.M. around the marina walking the dog I got (mostly) gentle jibes from the other residents. Lots of kind condescending consolation; "Don't worry, you'll learn how to steer eventually."

I Know how to steer... but it's a bit difficult with no power... and bay winds helping us along ; -)
I can never think of the proper come-back, at the right time, but maybe:

"And since you've brought it up, just how long have YOU been learning?" with a sincere and naive expression.
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