Anchor and rode: How rusty is too rusty?

[danfarrell]

Hi,

I've recently purchased a well loved a and well used cruiser. I noticed the cqr anchor and rode shows significant rust. See attached pic .

Should i be worried a bout this? Have it blasted and galvanized? Replace chain? Replace anchor? Save my few pennies?

The boat isn't light; about 7 tons. She's a baba 30, in case you want to know.

Thanks for the advice.

[zboss]

Without knowing the provenance of the chain, it's always better to be cautious. IMO, if its a short length then just pitch it and get a new length.

However, if its a very long length of chain and if its not flaking to badly then clean a few links and take a measurement of the link width to determine how much chain has been lost. If it's still within spec and you are comfortable with the age keep it and/or send it in to get regalvanized.

[Bean Counter]

Super rusty chain leaves little flecks of rust on the deck a real pita to clean off. The anchor may be able to be regalvanized, but I would put the money into a more modern anchor - Mantus, Rocna, Spade etc. When the chain rusts too far, it can slip in the gypsy - you will know when this happens when you get hockles in the chain locker. Also if you anchor over shallow sand and let all the chain out, the rust will get cleaned off after a few days, it may not be as bad as it looks.

[danfarrell]

Thanks for the replies so far.

if you anchor over shallow sand and let all the chain out, the rust will get cleaned off after a few days

Aaah, good idea. I know a few places around the Apostle Islands that have lots of sand and shallow water. There's nylon after the chain so this might be a plausible solution.

Without knowing the provenance of the chain, it's always better to be cautious. IMO, if its a short length then just pitch it and get a new length.

The PO said there's 100 feet of it and it's apparently 1/4" hi-test , clearly not stainless :P, so I suppose about $400 worth of chain. Like most folks I'd rather not spend $4 let alone $400 if I don't have to ... but also know the pain of rust stains on deck. I also rather like my boat staying more or less where I anchor it while I sleep.

but I would put the money into a more modern anchor - Mantus, Rocna, Spade etc.

My last boat had a Delta anchor. I was very happy with its ability to set and hold. Of course that boat only weighed 2.5 tons or so... a fishhook probably wouldhave held it :P. Some folks swear by their CQRs ... others seem to despise them. They sure are awfully expensive compared to a delta.

take a measurement of the link width to determine how much chain has been lost. If it's still within spec and you are comfortable with the age keep it and/or send it in to get regalvanized.

Glad I asked ... that's a good idea. In hindsight , it seems obvious ... I'll take a closer look at the chain when I'm up there tomorrow. Really should know its state since I just bought the boat

[thomm225]

The picture shows very little rust or wear for that matter.

Maybe worry about it in 5 years.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by thomm225

The picture shows very little rust or wear for that matter.

Maybe worry about it in 5 years.

You must have extraordinary vision! It's hard enough to judge degree of rust wasting when you have the chain in your hands, let alone from a distant picture.

With any rust on the surface, it would seem that the galvo is gone, and if so, in five years of active usage there will be little left of the chain IME. I think that you will find, thomm, that in normally salty water (not brackish) rust eats chain pretty rapidly once the zinc is gone.

For the OP, if the chain really is 1/4 inch, I'd consider changing to 5/16 for your boat. She's kinda hefty for such light chain. And I'd sure consider a better anchor. You should spend some time reading the two long threads by Nolex and Panope, showing actual anchors in use in rhe real world. They might well change your opinion of both the CQR and the Delta.

Jim

Later addition: Had not realized this was a fresh water boat. Rust issue is far less demanding in fresh water, so time scale is expanded! Sorry... didn't know where the Apostle Islands were.

[Mike OReilly]

My current chain is looking kinda rough as well, so I’m listening and learning.

One observation. It appears danfarrell is in Lake Superior — fresh water (unless there is another Apostle Islands somewhere). I assume that makes some difference.

Dan, I concur with the others regarding chain size and anchor. Go bigger. And a good spade-style anchor is money well spent (Rocna, Mantus, Spade, Manson). CQRs are ok, but not as good as these new-gen anchors. And Delta, well, lets just say you couldn’t pay me to own one.

BTW, that’s a beautiful boat. Love the Baba.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

You must have extraordinary vision! It's hard enough to judge degree of rust wasting when you have the chain in your hands, let alone from a distant picture.

With any rust on the surface, it would seem that the galvo is gone, and if so, in five years of active usage there will be little left of the chain IME. I think that you will find, thomm, that in normally salty water (not brackish) rust eats chain pretty rapidly once the zinc is gone.

For the OP, if the chain really is 1/4 inch, I'd consider changing to 5/16 for your boat. She's kinda hefty for such light chain. And I'd sure consider a better anchor. You should spend some time reading the two long threads by Nolex and Panope, showing actual anchors in use in rhe real world. They might well change your opinion of both the CQR and the Delta.

Jim

Later addition: Had not realized this was a fresh water boat. Rust issue is far less demanding in fresh water, so time scale is expanded! Sorry... didn't know where the Apostle Islands were.

I think it has to do with my being around salt water and metal all my life that I can tell a bit about the rust I see.

The first boat I bought at 16 was an old Chincoteague Scow, with trailer and 40 hp Johnson outboard 1960 something vintage for $300.00. I bought it on the Seaside (ocean side) and was taking it over to the bayside to launch when one of the rusty rims disintegrated.

My eyes were very good back then so I learned what real rust looked like. we "borrowed" another rim from my brother's job site and eventually got the boat launched.

On the way back in the creek, the motor over heated. The impeller was shredded. I didn't know what an impeller was at the time I just knew the three R's and that I liked to fish

Attached are the current shackles on my main anchor, chain, and rode. The rusted one may be due to metal mismatch. I take a wire brush to it periodically, but when I'm anchored in a bad spot in heavy winds and waves 70 yards off a leeward shore you old worriers have caused me to lose even more sleep thinking about that shackle and my CQR anchor so since I'm actually doing some maintenance on my boat this year maybe I'll replace it with the 3-4 other shackles that the PO had on the boat when I bought it. He was a total pack rat

Also I did notice the location of the OP.


It held pretty good here as well...…..and multiple other times but there is always concern. in the video, If the anchor did drag or the shackle broke I would just have been pushed offshore which would have been Ok since it was a Spring Squall passing over …….the lightning was the main problem though and the big worry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHt7ocBZKms

[El Pinguino]

The anchor itself looks not too bad..... but I would check the wear on the pin... between plow and shank. You don't want it too sloppy.

CQRs are fine..... in mud. This one would have appeared to have kept the mothership out of trouble for a few years.

[CSY Man]

Agree with above: 1/4” is too skinny.
Ditch the rusty chain and get a 5/16” HT as well as a new anchor.
The CQR was great 40 years ago, if the wind was not blowing.
These days get a modern something, or even a similar size Delta if money is tight.
Been there, done that..

[danfarrell]

Yes, I'm on the big lake. But the boat has spent some of her life in salt water, or so says the surveyor. I honestly don't know when the anchor had a chance to rust up that much... maybe on the hard. Or maybe she spent more time on the hook than i realize.

I'm hearing disdain for the cqrs. Riffing on that theme, I'm curious whether i should think of this as a high priority item. Here in the apostles, the holding in the desirable anchorages is quite good. Further into the lake (where i hope to someday go) there's many places where i understand one can't anchor at all. Sand on the south shore, and shoal water far from shore. On the north and west side, rocks and too deep to drop a hook. Or so says the expert (locals will know the name Bonnie Dahl).

Anyhow, i have no serious experience and none to speak of in a boat this big or outside the area. But i find everything I see read to be true, regarding the cost of anchoring anxiety in the crew, and since that's the wife and kid, I'm especially keen on making this a fun time. I'm not made of money but anchoring out is essentially all there is to do in the apostles besides anchoring, so potentially crucial equipment. So I'll ask, is the cqr something I'll find a source of frustration and stress?

The windlass is newish. Am i correct in guessing the gypsey is typically interchangeable on these things? Never owned a windlass before.

I'll be researching all this too of course. Just trolling for whatever wisdom i can glean

[sailorboy1]

Have you pulled all the chain out and looked at the other end? Might not be rusted beyond the first section current attached at anchor

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by thomm225

I think it has to do with my being around salt water and metal all my life that I can tell a bit about the rust I see.

Ok, but it is kinda hard to see much detail in the rust in the original picture. Can you really tell if that is surface, flaking or structural rust? I sure can't.

The first boat I bought at 16 was an old Chincoteague Scow, with trailer and 40 hp Johnson outboard 1960 something vintage for $300.00. I bought it on the Seaside (ocean side) and was taking it over to the bayside to launch when one of the rusty rims disintegrated.

My eyes were very good back then so I learned what real rust looked like. we "borrowed" another rim from my brother's job site and eventually got the boat launched.

On the way back in the creek, the motor over heated. The impeller was shredded. I didn't know what an impeller was at the time I just knew the three R's and that I liked to fish

Attached are the current shackles on my main anchor, chain, and rode. The rusted one may be due to metal mismatch. I take a wire brush to it periodically, but when I'm anchored in a bad spot in heavy winds and waves 70 yards off a leeward shore you old worriers have caused me to lose even more sleep thinking about that shackle and my CQR anchor so since I'm actually doing some maintenance on my boat this year maybe I'll replace it with the 3-4 other shackles that the PO had on the boat when I bought it. He was a total pack rat

Your boat, your choice, but maybe not such good advice to a newbie?

Also I did notice the location of the OP.


It held pretty good here as well...…..and multiple other times but there is always concern. in the video, If the anchor did drag or the shackle broke I would just have been pushed offshore which would have been Ok since it was a Spring Squall passing over …….the lightning was the main problem though and the big worry]

Again, glad that it worked for you at that time. But advising a newbie that such risks are ok isn't good form IMO. He wants to know good anchoring practice, not what once worked for you on dodgy tackle.


[URL]

[Souzag818]

Had a CQR on the previous boat and for a while on the current one. Although I only dragged once with the CQR while I was setting it, after a couple tries, I did eventually get it to hold. Then I bought a Spade to replace the CQR, and I haven't looked back. I haven't had any problems with the Spade, in fact it grabs and brings the boat to an immediate stop every time. I do sleep better... My 2 cents

[Souzag818]

[QUOTE=Jim Cate;2857450]Again, glad that it worked for you at that time. But advising a newbie that such risks are ok isn't good form IMO. He wants to know good anchoring practice, not what once worked for you on dodgy tackle.