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JDRichlen · 14-03-2012, 07:52

So I will start seriously looking at boats in may - sept. Im planning to be living aboard by october. Iv'e been doing a lot of browsing online at sailboats in the area, but haven't check any out in person yet. I'm thinking about something between 26-30 foot for my first liveaboard. From what I've seen i can find something reasonable in my area for around $5-8k. Would this be something that definitely needs to get surveyed before purchase? Or, would a survey be a waste on such a low cost boat? Also, should I be looking for boats in dry storage, or boats on a slip and have them hauled if need be for a survey?

Sailmonkey · 14-03-2012, 07:59

It depends on how handy you are, and how familiar you are with what you're looking at. When we bought ours I gave it a through inspection myself, made note or the problems and made an offer accordingly. That being said, I already knew what I was getting into as far as complete standing rigging replacement, complete 100% rewire, etc......
If you are not familiar with what you're looking at a survey will keep you from buying the $5k disaster and steer you towards the $5k bare-bones older boat in factory condition.

four winds · 14-03-2012, 08:10

If you self survey, be sure to look up the known issues with a particular model you intend to check out.

Also research how to detect flaws in things like standing rigging and other items.

If you're mechanically inclined and do this research it will help negate the need for a professional survey to a large extent.

**Pat Ross** · 15-03-2012, 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by four winds

If you self survey, be sure to look up the known issues with a particular model you intend to check out.

Also research how to detect flaws in things like standing rigging and other items.

If you're mechanically inclined and do this research it will help negate the need for a professional survey to a large extent.

Chuck Gustafson's book "How to Buy the Best Sailboat" has a self survey contained in the appendix and the book is a quick and worthwhile read, packed with good evaluative information

How to Buy the Best Sailboat: An Updated Edition of the Leading Consumer Guide With a New Chapter on Selling a Boat: Chuck Gustafson: 9780688109875: Amazon.com: Books

I think the major concern besides what is mentioned in the quotes above is ensuring that there is not structural damage of any kind. There are several specific areas you should be checking, as well as the general structure of the boat.

jerrymc · 14-03-2012, 08:07

You're probably going to have to have a insurance survey, even if you're only going to buy liability insurance, if the boat has no fairly recent survey. Most marinas require liability insurance, these days.

At that point, you'll have to decide whether to go for a full out-of-the-water survey or just live with the results of an insurance survey. You'll have to gauge whether the added expense is worth it to you & your peace of mind or not.

I have bought boats both with & without a survey over the years & felt comfortable with the decision. When the time comes, do what seems right to you, at the time.

Sailmonkey · 14-03-2012, 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrymc

You're probably going to have to have a insurance survey, even if you're only going to buy liability insurance, if the boat has no fairly recent survey. Most marinas require liability insurance, these days.

I have not needed any survey for liability......just doesn't make sense as they're not insuring the vessel at all.

four winds · 14-03-2012, 10:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

I have not needed any survey for liability......just doesn't make sense as they're not insuring the vessel at all.

I agree, but just experienced this conundrum this month. Thirty days to get liability or termination of lease. Most everyone required an out-of-water, no less, survey even for liability. Those that didn't require survey were three or four times higher in price for the insurance.

One explanation was the concern for a sinking at the dock, the resulting fluids spill and high cost of environmental cleanup. So I guess that is vessel related.

Progressive insured my boat for liability without a survey. And cost was about twice of the quotes from companies requiring survey.

Sailmonkey · 14-03-2012, 10:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by four winds

I agree, but just experienced this conundrum this month. Thirty days to get liability or termination of lease. Most everyone required an out-of-water, no less, survey even for liability. Those that didn't require survey were three or four times higher in price for the insurance.

One explanation was the concern for a sinking at the dock, the resulting fluids spill and high cost of environmental cleanup. So I guess that is vessel related.

Progressive insured my boat for liability without a survey. And cost was about twice of the quotes from companies requiring survey.

Twice the cost for me still didn't equal the cost of a survey over several years.

rebel heart · 14-03-2012, 08:16

Get the survey.

belizesailor · 15-03-2012, 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel heart

Get the survey.

+1.

Keep in mind that a "cheap" boat is not necessarily a good buy -- unless you can bring it back up to par at wholesale rates you are likely to spend more money fixing it up than you would to buy one in average condition.

A survey, even on a relatively inexpensive boat, is money will spent -- it can help you avoid issues that may cost more to fix than the value of the boat at this price level.

Rakuflames · 15-03-2012, 19:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by belizesailor

+1.

Keep in mind that a "cheap" boat is not necessarily a good buy -- unless you can bring it back up to par at wholesale rates you are likely to spend more money fixing it up than you would to buy one in average condition.

A survey, even on a relatively inexpensive boat, is money will spent -- it can help you avoid issues that may cost more to fix than the value of the boat at this price level.

There ARE bargains out there on boats, just as there are on houses -- people who need to sell, etc. But you really do need to know exactly what is and is not sound on that bargain boat. I had to replace the engine on this one six months after I bought it -- OUCH! The surveyor didn't do engines, and I didn't realize there was such a thing as an *engine* survey.

If you know what you're doing you can do a pre-survey evaluation yourself using a book, but you should still have a professional survey it.

Capt.Don · 14-03-2012, 08:24

In S. Calif, if the boat is over 10 years old, many marinas also require a current survey.

JDRichlen · 14-03-2012, 08:32

in reference to a current survey. What is considered current, and what kind of paperwork is provided with that as proof?

Target9000 · 14-03-2012, 08:34

Lets set the legal and insurance requirements aside for one sec.

Even if someone was going to GIVE YOU A BOAT FOR FREE, it would be smart to survey it. The thing is that boats are very much a responsibility and a burden as much as they are a joy and home. You must account for when taking a boat in, that you must have a place to store it, you must maintain it, and you may have to sell it or get rid of it one day.

All three of those things can cost lots of time and money. So even if you were being given a boat for free, it could become a money pit. You want to make sure that your time and the cost of your maintenance through the lifetime the boat is with you is WORTH IT for you. If you take on a boat and 3 months in a thru hull pops due to poor maintenance or setup, and the boat sinks on its mooring, that is going to be expensive!

Furthermore, you'll want to find a surveyor that you can really trust and go with him over the boat. Ask questions, and nit pick through everything. This isn't like buying a trinket to set on a shelf in a house. This is like bringing home a puppy.

Do it right.