Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 23-05-2018, 16:15   #106
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Brazil
Boat: Custom Swedish VindŲ 50 (35 ft)
Posts: 684
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
So before you crank you have to stand back up and then wipe, or wipe while sitting down, whatever, and during that time the fresh deposit is on top and exposed. Isnít that smelly?
Not mine.

Don't you think you'd have this with any other toilet? I'm not sure I understand your concern.
Copacabana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 16:23   #107
Registered User
 
fxykty's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Auckland
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 2,106
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Copacabana View Post
Not mine.



Don't you think you'd have this with any other toilet? I'm not sure I understand your concern.


With a flushing toilet the deposit is under water - no more fresh deposit smells.

Iím challenging from a positive place - I agree that a composting head is generally a better option for a boat. But itís over NZD1,000 for even the cheapest commercial head so Iím nervous about making the switch without satisfying my objections, and those of my fiancť (her biggest worry is about not being able to aim her urine, and she just laughed when I told her about C-headís ladle diverter). So weíve still got a fair bit of hill to climb before we agree to ditch the plumbing for a glorified bucket.

Hmmm, Iíll take a bucket, peat, and a toilet seat and make my own composting head in my garage and use that to test. Real life beats internet any day. Stay tuned.

Please, users of composting heads, what are your experiences?
fxykty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 16:51   #108
Senior Cruiser
 
newhaul's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 9,262
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
With a flushing toilet the deposit is under water - no more fresh deposit smells.

Iím challenging from a positive place - I agree that a composting head is generally a better option for a boat. But itís over NZD1,000 for even the cheapest commercial head so Iím nervous about making the switch without satisfying my objections, and those of my fiancť (her biggest worry is about not being able to aim her urine, and she just laughed when I told her about C-headís ladle diverter). So weíve still got a fair bit of hill to climb before we agree to ditch the plumbing for a glorified bucket.

Hmmm, Iíll take a bucket, peat, and a toilet seat and make my own composting head in my garage and use that to test. Real life beats internet any day. Stay tuned.

Please, users of composting heads, what are your experiences?
I have linked to my diy composter earlier in this thread it only costs a couple bucks mostly for the urine diverter ( large oil funnel) build the surround out of scrap wood .
( I'm currently working on a diy mixing paddle and gp crank stay tuned ) for now I just add a Hand full of peat over current deposits.
__________________
Non illigitamus carborundum
newhaul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 18:17   #109
Registered User
 
Mike OReilly's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 10,011
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

My poop smells immediately after being deposited in my Natureís Head. So did my poop in my standard marina Skipperís Head, as it does when I poop on land. I donít know anyone who has pristine, zero-smelling poop.

As Copacabana says, a quick churn, close the lid, and the smell is gone. If thatís ainít acceptable for your fiancť, then may I suggest a cork .

Just kidding of course. Seriously, I get where youíre coming from. It is a big move, and without direct experience, itís a bit of a leap of faith to take the word(s) of anonymous netizens. All I and others can keep saying is that the systems work as advertised.
__________________
Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG: www.helplink.com/CLAFC
Mike OReilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 18:52   #110
Moderator
 
JPA Cate's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 20,647
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

foxykty,

For your experiment, why not follow newhaul's plans for the one he made? I would think that even if the individual poop was extremely stinky (as it can be if one is ill), once the lid was closed, you wouldn't have objectionable smell, especially so, once the poop is stirred and mixed thoroughly with the dessicant, which will compost somewhat, over time, and then smell earthy. I used to put all my dog's poop into our garden compost bin, which was of course out of doors, and not stirred often, maybe once a month from May through October, which I did with a pitchfork, trying not to bother the earthworms. But the point is that dog poo stinks, too, normally, and draws flies, but once covered with the week's grass clippings, one never noticed it.

The deal with the fiancee may be difficult. She is unlikely to be familiar with just how much hassle for you, her beloved, having and maintaining holding tanks can be. How much does she want to haul around fermenting poo waiting for pump outs? If she thinks poo smells bad fresh, she should try to imagine it fermenting. Think outhouse or dunny. It is also hard to find plastic hose that is truly odor impermeable. It may be difficult to source at a semi-reasonable cost in NZ. If you have plans to cruise in the States at all, or the Great Lakes, I think you'd both be happier with a composting toilet than having to plan around frequent pumpouts. There's also the issue that it is heavy, and your Outremer, she just may not desire to carry that particular load.....

Another thought, if you can't get to a pump out facility, and you over-fill your holding tank, a combination of excrement and urine will flow out the vent tube, unless it is so plugged that the tank bursts. The latter is my worst nightmare about holding tanks.

I don't know if you have plans to do any high latitude sailing, but if you are going to spend a lot of time where it is very cold, composting will not work once it is freezing out.

Some women produce urine and feces at the same time, ejecting at the same moments from each orifice, and I have wondered about how a composting toilet would cope under those conditions, and, as you suggest, how the people would then cope with it.

Ann
__________________
Who scorns the calm has forgotten the storm.
JPA Cate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 19:02   #111
Senior Cruiser
 
newhaul's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 9,262
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
foxykty,

For your experiment, why not follow newhaul's plans for the one he made? I would think that even if the individual poop was extremely stinky (as it can be if one is ill), once the lid was closed, you wouldn't have objectionable smell, especially so, once the poop is stirred and mixed thoroughly with the dessicant, which will compost somewhat, over time, and then smell earthy. I used to put all my dog's poop into our garden compost bin, which was of course out of doors, and not stirred often, maybe once a month from May through October, which I did with a pitchfork, trying not to bother the earthworms. But the point is that dog poo stinks, too, normally, and draws flies, but once covered with the week's grass clippings, one never noticed it.

The deal with the fiancee may be difficult. She is unlikely to be familiar with just how much hassle for you, her beloved, having and maintaining holding tanks can be. How much does she want to haul around fermenting poo waiting for pump outs? If she thinks poo smells bad fresh, she should try to imagine it fermenting. Think outhouse or dunny. It is also hard to find plastic hose that is truly odor impermeable. It may be difficult to source at a semi-reasonable cost in NZ. If you have plans to cruise in the States at all, or the Great Lakes, I think you'd both be happier with a composting toilet than having to plan around frequent pumpouts. There's also the issue that it is heavy, and your Outremer, she just may not desire to carry that particular load.....

Another thought, if you can't get to a pump out facility, and you over-fill your holding tank, a combination of excrement and urine will flow out the vent tube, unless it is so plugged that the tank bursts. The latter is my worst nightmare about holding tanks.

I don't know if you have plans to do any high latitude sailing, but if you are going to spend a lot of time where it is very cold, composting will not work once it is freezing out.

Some women produce urine and feces at the same time, ejecting at the same moments from each orifice, and I have wondered about how a composting toilet would cope under those conditions, and, as you suggest, how the people would then cope with it.

Ann
Ann that's the purpose of the urine diverter. It collects the urine and sends it where it needs to go same with the poop it doesn't matter when do the deposit is left behind.
Btw guys do that to sometimes .
__________________
Non illigitamus carborundum
newhaul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 19:14   #112
Registered User
 
fxykty's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Auckland
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 2,106
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by newhaul View Post
Ann that's the purpose of the urine diverter. It collects the urine and sends it where it needs to go same with the poop it doesn't matter when do the deposit is left behind.

Btw guys do that to sometimes .


But is a funnel enough of a diverter or should we consider a fancy moulded pan like Separette www.separett.com/products/accessories/privy-501 ?
fxykty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 19:29   #113
Moderator
 
JPA Cate's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: aboard, cruising in Australia
Boat: Sayer 46' Solent rig sloop
Posts: 20,647
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
But is a funnel enough of a diverter or should we consider a fancy moulded pan like Separette Privy 501 | Separett ?
Ya know, a lot of this depends on your fiancee. the two orifices are very close together, and she might have to sit funny on the seat. I hope the two of youse are discussing it together. I couldn't tell from the photo of the separett, if the urine catcher pan extends far enough towards the back.

Ann
__________________
Who scorns the calm has forgotten the storm.
JPA Cate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 19:39   #114
Registered User
 
fxykty's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Auckland
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 2,106
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
foxykty,



For your experiment, why not follow newhaul's plans for the one he made? I would think that even if the individual poop was extremely stinky (as it can be if one is ill), once the lid was closed, you wouldn't have objectionable smell, especially so, once the poop is stirred and mixed thoroughly with the dessicant, which will compost somewhat, over time, and then smell earthy. I used to put all my dog's poop into our garden compost bin, which was of course out of doors, and not stirred often, maybe once a month from May through October, which I did with a pitchfork, trying not to bother the earthworms. But the point is that dog poo stinks, too, normally, and draws flies, but once covered with the week's grass clippings, one never noticed it.



The deal with the fiancee may be difficult. She is unlikely to be familiar with just how much hassle for you, her beloved, having and maintaining holding tanks can be. How much does she want to haul around fermenting poo waiting for pump outs? If she thinks poo smells bad fresh, she should try to imagine it fermenting. Think outhouse or dunny. It is also hard to find plastic hose that is truly odor impermeable. It may be difficult to source at a semi-reasonable cost in NZ. If you have plans to cruise in the States at all, or the Great Lakes, I think you'd both be happier with a composting toilet than having to plan around frequent pumpouts. There's also the issue that it is heavy, and your Outremer, she just may not desire to carry that particular load.....



Another thought, if you can't get to a pump out facility, and you over-fill your holding tank, a combination of excrement and urine will flow out the vent tube, unless it is so plugged that the tank bursts. The latter is my worst nightmare about holding tanks.



I don't know if you have plans to do any high latitude sailing, but if you are going to spend a lot of time where it is very cold, composting will not work once it is freezing out.



Some women produce urine and feces at the same time, ejecting at the same moments from each orifice, and I have wondered about how a composting toilet would cope under those conditions, and, as you suggest, how the people would then cope with it.



Ann


Thanks Ann, good points.

My sweetie is well aware of the trials and tribulations of boat plumbing. We use our holding tank for short periods of time only as we are often in legal dumping areas (far enough off shore typically) and havenít had to resort to a pump out. Itís only a 40 litre tank so it certainly doesnít last very long with full time use - a good excuse to go for a sail but that wouldnít work in the Great Lakes (though weíre not planning to go there, but are planning on the west coast from Alaska, Inside Passage BC, then WA, OR and CA on our way south).

We have over filled the holding tank once and had the joy of the mess in our bilge. At least that was motivation to perform maintenance on the whole plumbing system. Unfortunately itís in the owner hull.

On the other side of the boat we have no holding tank at all (!!) so thatís the side weíre addressing first. Rather than installing a holding tank and everything else, I want to try a composting head. If it works there, weíll convert the owner side as well.

Yes, we do plan on high latitudes, but since these are dessicating heads rather than truly composting the cold should be just fine. Dryer in fact, so that should help dry out the poop mix too, right?
fxykty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 19:53   #115
Registered User
 
fxykty's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Auckland
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 2,106
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
Ya know, a lot of this depends on your fiancee. the two orifices are very close together, and she might have to sit funny on the seat. I hope the two of youse are discussing it together. I couldn't tell from the photo of the separett, if the urine catcher pan extends far enough towards the back.



Ann


Yup, gonna test this in our garage before sending a boat buck to C-head.

A local distributor has the Separett seat and itís only a fancy dinner out in cost. The garage test starts shortly!!

This will also test whether going churnless is fine or whether we really need a mixer.

Hmmm, still wondering whether I could DIY. No offence to newhaul, but Iím no ship right and I donít want anything too ugly in our boat. Also need to consider the air-secure outer shell.
fxykty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2018, 22:48   #116
Registered User
 
Panope's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Washington State
Boat: Colvin, Saugeen Witch (Aluminum), 34'
Posts: 1,926
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
But is a funnel enough of a diverter or should we consider a fancy moulded pan like Separette Privy 501 | Separett ?
I sprung for the Separette diverter and seat (the most expensive piece of plastic I have ever bought). It works great but I am sure a funnel could be made to work just as well.

The thing about the Separette, is that it LOOKS like a "store bought" product.
This certainly adds credibility in the minds of certain skeptical/squeamish persons.

My DIY head:
__________________
Panope's Modification/Refit: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...un-101572.html Videos of Anchors Setting: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ng-155412.html
Panope is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2018, 02:36   #117
Marine Service Provider
 
Steadman Uhlich's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,056
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
One of the purported benefits of composting heads is absence of smells, particularly that of head hoses. That makes sense to me.

But what about the fresh deposit? That certainly smells, and all of the composting heads just mix it in with or cover it with some peat or whatever medium youíre using. But itís still a fresh batch of poop, which smells. So whatís the actual Ďduring the businessí or Ďimmediately after the businessí smell is there? Please explain.

With a flushing head the fresh poop is removed, so you donít get that smell. Ventilation and/or a quick spritz of air freshener and you can stay in the same room, wash your hands, and brush your teeth without smelling what youíve just done.

I wish I knew someone in Auckland with a composting head so we could try it. Certainly my experiences with camping toilets and other portable toilets has been smelly and not reassuring that the composting heads have solved the problem. But I really want to replace the direct flush toilet ASAP.
I just got off a boat that had both a Raritan Elegance electric head and a Natures Head.

I used both, on the 21 day, 1200nm voyage.

This was my first experience with a CH. I have sailed on many boats, and usually the heads stink. I detest portable toilets, because of smell too.

The Raritan Elegance was very nice, with push button choices for water use and flushing. It generally cleaned the bowl at the touch of a button. It used fresh water for flushing. It was the nicest Head I have used on a boat. If you want a deluxe Head, this is a good choice. My only concern would be the need for fresh water, the need for electricity, and the hidden plumbing, in case of blockage. Also, we had to pump the holding tank when we got fuel, which took a long time and is always a hassle. We also had one stop where the holding tank was pumped with a portable pump. The boat I was on had 400 gallons of fresh water, so much more available than typical boats.

The Natures Head was partially full.
Even so, there was no "outhouse" odor at all.
Unless you look into the deep tank, you will not see the poop.
There was no apparent objectionable odor. Certainly nothing as bad as what a typical head smells like on old boats with smelly heads or bilges.
I suspect the vent and fan helps.
I was surprised that even a full jug of urine had no noticeable odor.
The urine diverter worked well.
The trap door was always closed when not pooping and ten turns of the compost stirrer was done each time, and the lid to the toilet kept closed.
We simply dumped the urine bottle overboard when offshore, and emptied it into a marina Head when in a marina stop. The bottle holds over 2 gallons. We had two bottles.

Based on what I have read, and now experienced, I will want a Composting Head on my future boat.

Hope that helps.
Steadman Uhlich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2018, 03:41   #118
Registered User
 
Mike OReilly's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 10,011
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
...I don't know if you have plans to do any high latitude sailing, but if you are going to spend a lot of time where it is very cold, composting will not work once it is freezing out.

Some women produce urine and feces at the same time, ejecting at the same moments from each orifice, and I have wondered about how a composting toilet would cope under those conditions, and, as you suggest, how the people would then cope with it.
Only speaking about Natureís Head, the diverters that direct urine one way and feces the other, are all part of the standard design. My Ann tells me she does nothing special. Weíve had a small number of female guests on board, and none have ever told me there were any issues.

Iíve never sailed in truly high latitudes, but most of my cruising has been done in colder areas (northern Ontario/Lake Superior & now Newfoundland). No problems with this cold. While the outside may be very cold, if the boat is kept at livable temps, composting will continue to work. And while the composting action will slow in cold temps, the drying/desiccating action carries on just fine.
__________________
Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG: www.helplink.com/CLAFC
Mike OReilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2018, 03:41   #119
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Brazil
Boat: Custom Swedish VindŲ 50 (35 ft)
Posts: 684
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
With a flushing toilet the deposit is under water - no more fresh deposit smells.

I’m challenging from a positive place - I agree that a composting head is generally a better option for a boat. But it’s over NZD1,000 for even the cheapest commercial head so I’m nervous about making the switch without satisfying my objections, and those of my fiancť (her biggest worry is about not being able to aim her urine, and she just laughed when I told her about C-head’s ladle diverter). So we’ve still got a fair bit of hill to climb before we agree to ditch the plumbing for a glorified bucket.

Hmmm, I’ll take a bucket, peat, and a toilet seat and make my own composting head in my garage and use that to test. Real life beats internet any day. Stay tuned.

Please, users of composting heads, what are your experiences?
Fxyktx, I realize my previous answer was a bit flippant, but it wasn't my intention. I understand your concerns. In fact, I went through the same process when I bought my Natures Head. I'm in Brazil and there are no composting heads here, so I had no way of checking one out beforehand or anyone to talk to who had one on their boat. Also, with the insane import taxes in Brazil, the Natures Head was going to cost me close to USD1,800! I wanted some reassurance that it was going to work as advertised. So, I began searching the net (forums like this one) and read everything I could. What I found was virtually EVERYONE who had installed a composting head was very happy with it (at the time, I found only 2 cases of buyer regret). Non-users had a few negative things to say, mostly related to handling the poo, dumping urine and the "idea" of composting, but these were people who had never used one. Well, I knew I wanted to be free of my manual seawater toilet, hoses and holding tank, so I ordered my Natures Head. This is my experience with Natures Head (now going on 5 years with one):

The unit is well built, sturdy and doesn't look cheap (it is up to the level of proper boat finishings). The handling of urine and poo has proven to be easy and not in the slightest bit disgusting. I dump the urine overboard every night and every once in a while dump the solids bin, which is exactly like rich earth- no smell and no bits inside that look like poo. Best of all, there is NO SMELL at all on my boat. Importantly, it has worked without mishap with men, women, children and different guests. In other words, there is no issue of anatomy getting in the way. I can honestly say that it has worked exactly as advertised and has surpassed all my expectations. It is, by far, the best upgrade I've made on my boat. If I were you, I'd take that leap of faith and just order a Natures Head. You won't regret it and your wife will not be put off by it at all once she starts using it. If you have any specific questions, just ask. There are plenty of us here who have compsting toilets who can answer your questions.
Copacabana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2018, 03:51   #120
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Brazil
Boat: Custom Swedish VindŲ 50 (35 ft)
Posts: 684
Re: Composting toilet: rules, regulations, and "real life" use etc.?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panope View Post
I sprung for the Separette diverter and seat (the most expensive piece of plastic I have ever bought). It works great but I am sure a funnel could be made to work just as well.

The thing about the Separette, is that it LOOKS like a "store bought" product.
This certainly adds credibility in the minds of certain skeptical/squeamish persons.

My DIY head:
Panope, I have to say that your DIY composter is the nicest I've ever seen.
Copacabana is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
oil, regulations, rule

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Newly Enforced BVI Rules & Regulations SVAspen Atlantic & the Caribbean 24 08-10-2016 14:59
Rules and Regulations for Building a Sailboat jakegator Boat Ownership & Making a Living 27 03-02-2012 06:23
Marina Rules and Regulations in Canada davevancat Liveaboard's Forum 4 03-03-2010 05:39
ownership, registrations, tax etc etc etc, (future boat owner) liquido Dollars & Cents 1 20-07-2008 05:00
Regulations for toilet holding tank Weyalan Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 57 19-08-2007 02:47

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 17:23.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.